European Super League | Page 31 | Vital Football

European Super League

LewChatterley'sLover said:
We Villa fans shouldn't be too smug about all this. We have welcomed billionaires with open arms and want their cash thrown around like confetti. Are these not exactly the type of people who would have gone for the ESL? We are part of the same shitty disease but dodged the bullet this time.
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Nah! Wes and Nassef aren't like that.

They are highly competent very shrewd businessmen. They aren't throwing money around; they're investing with a purpose.

They bought the club for £90 million (£60 million plus paying of Xia's £30million debt). Total loss 2018-2020 was £168.1million, which was covered by equity injections. My limited understanding of these things suggests that they've thus sunk £258.1million into the club (maybe Mike has a better idea).

But ask yourself this. How much is the club now worth? £300million? They're doing OK, and it's good for everybody that they're doing OK. That's how to run a club. Leicester also are doing things the right way. The money spent has gone into building up the club in a sustainable way. In a few years time we'll really see the benefit of that.
 
JuanPabloAngel said:
Yes, never mind the lack of matchday income, they are desperate for the income from concerts and the NFL games which were meant to be played. Without that sort of money, they are in deep doo-doo, I would think.
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Yes, things have definitely been cancelled as I quite like their stadium and how it pushes the boat - albeit McDonald's fast food type of service - I've loosely followed so I think they already expected a main stadium sponsor (which Covid buggered as no-one is there), possibly two NFL events, maybe three (they have an NFL pitch built in that doesn't effect playing pitch). Then there's some retail or at least a pub that hasn't been earning, I caught talk of a possible baseball trial (although that confused me) and maybe three concerts as well.

And that's ignoring the match day loss when their prices are in the £1000's for season tickets despite their lack of success.

But that income will return, it's why I'm more focused on who wants to leave because if they are definitely not challenging for the CL for the next few years, relevant stadium income falls massively on a FFP front - even if they can claw back generic account cash flow.
 
mike_field said:
possibly two NFL events, maybe three (they have an NFL pitch built in that doesn't effect playing pitch).
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Yeah, and that's PER YEAR. The NFL have a long-term commitment to games in the UK and Wembley and Spurs will host the matches (Twickenham has also been used, but the idea was for the Tottenham Stadium to be the long-term venue alongside Wembley). BIG money in that for Spuds.
 
McParlandTheGreat said:
Nah! Wes and Nassef aren't like that.

They are highly competent very shrewd businessmen. They aren't throwing money around; they're investing with a purpose.

They bought the club for £90 million (£60 million plus paying of Xia's £30million debt). Total loss 2018-2020 was £168.1million, which was covered by equity injections. My limited understanding of these things suggests that they've thus sunk £258.1million into the club (maybe Mike has a better idea).

But ask yourself this. How much is the club now worth? £300million? They're doing OK, and it's good for everybody that they're doing OK. That's how to run a club. Leicester also are doing things the right way. The money spent has gone into building up the club in a sustainable way. In a few years time we'll really see the benefit of that.
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From my head, those rough figures are right without knowing what has gone in for cash flow since Covid and what will go in to balance next season's budgets given lack of match day etc.

We're around £300m but maybe not over - even allowing for the massive investment in the Academy.

But yup, a PL prize pot of what now £130+m a season for just avoiding relegation, any buyout will be based on 3-5yr value and these guys are savvy enough to get more than that (or do an RL and get bonuses on future success), so from their perspective despite spending shitloads, they are at worst breakeven.

Plus, they then have the stadium in their pocket as well on either a buyback on sale or future lease option.

The daftness of FFP means they haven't been able to actually put in so much that they won't break even if they walk away tomorrow - unless the PL itself goes tits up tomorrow.

And yes, given the Academy investment and the players others admire - whatever the spend there in generic accounting terms, I'd safely think, they could minimum quadruple that on future benefit and if there was a generic accounting v FFP breakeven issue, that could easily wipe that out as well.
 
JuanPabloAngel said:
Yeah, and that's PER YEAR. The NFL have a long-term commitment to games in the UK and Wembley and Spurs will host the matches (Twickenham has also been used, but the idea was for the Tottenham Stadium to be the long-term venue alongside Wembley). BIG money in that for Spuds.
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Yup, I don't know the figures but I'd be amazed if per game it was lower than £2.5/3m so take 500K for staffing issues and other costs, that's a good chunk of change to throw on generic cash flow and the debt 2/3 times a year for absolutely no real club effort.

And that's probably a very conservative guess on both revenue and costs which would be lower with each NFL side bringing their own staff for various marketing bits as well.
 
Let's be honest, our owners didn't join the ESL because they weren't invited. For an owner, the ESL is a no-brainer. £350m and no chance of relegation? PL clubs get around £150m from the PL. There's £500m per season and all you have to do is avoid relegation. Ka-ching!

Suddenly £1bn in debt doesn't sound so bad.
 
I'm not sure where this British super league idea has come from this time. The idea isn't anything new. There was talk of this 20 years ago.

Rangers and Celtic are too big for the SPL. Barca and Real are in the same position in Spain. I guess Juve and Bayern are the same too.

Scottish football fans complain about Celtic and Rangers monopolising trophies. Most of them would be happy to see the back of them and have a more competitive league. I'd guess that fans in Spain probably feel the same about Real and Barca.

These clubs seem to have grown their expenditure beyond what their domestic leagues can support too.

Is it somewhat inevitable that we will have a reorganisation of European football?

Perhaps it would be for the best? I enjoyed our time in the Championship. It's a fantastic league with so many teams all of very similar ability. I guess that's what a league is supposed to be about rather than only one or maybe two teams winning everything all the time.
 
seanie ward said:
just happened to be in the paddock pub newtown, when the rangers supporters shot in, i have never been so frightened in my life, me and my mate were frozen to the wall as they wrecked the place, we were very lucky they didnt see the celtic photo behind the bar, but we lived to tell the tale ,seanie
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We lived in Witton mate, and these bastards pitched tents on Witton island night before the game, throwing bottles at passing no11 buses and generally looking for a fight.
The writting was on the wall well before the game.
 
Liononthebed said:
Funny how the big 6 wanted to destroy the premier league and that causes a war but now talk is of destroying Scottish football ( yes I know you can’t destroy a shit league any more) but isn’t this ides just as bad as the super greedy league,
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Indeed, well said and I hope fans and clubs show solidarity with the "minor" Scottish teams should this proposal come forward.
 
BodyButter said:
Rangers and Celtic are too big for the SPL. Barca and Real are in the same position in Spain. I guess Juve and Bayern are the same too.
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Spain's a bit different. There are good teams apart from Barca and Real. But those two grab a ton of money because of their separate TV contracts. A TV deal which shared out the proceeds more would improve some clubs no end, and would probably generate more overall income as well.
 
McParlandTheGreat said:
Spain's a bit different. There are good teams apart from Barca and Real. But those two grab a ton of money because of their separate TV contracts. A TV deal which shared out the proceeds more would improve some clubs no end, and would probably generate more overall income as well.
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Absolutely. If Real and Barca want a bit more competition they should reduce their spending (and thus reduce their debt) whilst creating a more competitive league.

Oh but then I forget, this has nothing to do with sport, this is purely about money.
 
Real Madrid president Florentino Perez says the 12 clubs that agreed to join a new European Super League have "binding contracts" and "cannot leave".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56873448

:yawning:

I'm no contracts specialist, but given the ESL can longer conclude their end of the bargain and they hadn't fully formulated the league in the first place given the 'invite' clubs hadn't been firmed up - Perez doesn't really have a leg to stand on in my humble.
 
mike_field said:
Real Madrid president Florentino Perez says the 12 clubs that agreed to join a new European Super League have "binding contracts" and "cannot leave".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56873448

:yawning:

I'm no contracts specialist, but given the ESL can longer conclude their end of the bargain and they hadn't fully formulated the league in the first place given the 'invite' clubs hadn't been firmed up - Perez doesn't really have a leg to stand on in my humble.
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I'm starting to think I shouldn't believe everything Florentino Perez says 100%. Call me paranoid but there's just something that has me doubting his trustworthiness.
 
Another one I read said they all have large fees to pay if they leave the group.

The whole thing is ridiculous.

Still say it is funny watching Sky shit themselves over all this, apart from the fact you can be relegated, they did do the same to the football league.
 
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