Tics v Hornets | Page 5 | Vital Football

Tics v Hornets

king_dezeeuw06 said:
100% agree, having better players always helps, but it's not what you have it's what you get out of them.

Rotherham and Blackpool have really poor quality squads for this level (probably worse than us) but play to their strengths and get every drop of potential out of what they've got. While West Brom and Watford this season have 2 of the best squads but have not got anything close to their potential out of it. I think too often this season we've not got enough out of what we have.

I believe the squad we have despite it's limitations can be competitive at this level if coached correctly. We've shown there is nothing to be afraid of if we play to our strengths and apply ourselves to the best of our ability.
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The league really isn't that special this season, which makes our determination to treat any team who turns up at the DW like they're Liverpool or Arsenal absolutely infuriating. Burnley are the only team I've watched at home who I thought were up to much at all - even the crushing against Middlesbrough was really more down to our own complete collapse than anything they did.

For all the criticism levied at Roberto over the years, seasons like this make me miss his Sin Miedo brand of football. He knew the only way we were to going to survive with the squad we had - and ever-dwindling funds from Dave to improve it - was to throw caution to the wind and pin teams back. He knew we didn't have a strong enough defence to throw 11 players behind the ball and hold out for a point so may as well try and grab a couple of goals for ourselves and see what happens.

We certainly wouldn't have taken off our only dangerman and forfeited possession to Watford for the last 15 minutes like we did yesterday that's for sure. It might've gone spectacularly wrong on occasion but we've been hammered a couple of times at home this season deploying an ultra-cautious approach anyway!

Even Cook understood this better than Leam. Consider the 3-0 vs Villa in 18/19. Instead of making excuses about being 'in our first season at the level', we took the game to a promotion contender from the off and were rewarded with three points that were crucial to survival. We're a million miles from producing performances like that these days at the DW. Sure, having a Reece James helped but our forward options of Garner/Grigg/Jacobs/Windass/Roberts (Powell didn't play) were hardly Galactico-level in quality. If we had an equivalent game coming up, we'd talk them up all week as impossible to beat and how we should just be happy to be in the league, that we've still got a club etc. and probably not register a single shot on target.

Rotherham, Blackpool etc. have squads that really are no better than ours on paper as you say. Though for as long as we stubbornly insist on playing-not-to-lose at home we'll continue to pick up nothing more than the 6 points from 27 we've mustered so far.
 
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Cant complain about the performance until the tactical change with Magennis. Only player on the pitch keeping them honest was Broadhead, running behind and stretching the game. For whatever reasoning Magennis was deployed extremely deep, half way inside of his own half. Their entire team pushed on causing massive overloads, without any threat in behind or in front of them they had the freedom to recycle and pin us in without any fear of conceding.

Had some good moments yesterday, was 50/50 for me until that change, against a side with some very athletic players. Just cant allow a team like that to become confident, usually never goes well. As they have the pace to hurt teams sitting back.
 
I think its unfair to blame Josh for this defeat because it wasn't his fault...the whole side were sinking deeper and deeper 2nd half and if you keep inviting the opposition on eventually they will find a way, and they did. Simple fact is we have loads of good lads trying their best which put in straight forward terms are not championship standard. Yesterday I thought we did well, matched them for effort and at times skill as well. Then I think Leam shows this side to his outlook where on about 70 he decides preserve the point and it more often than not doesn't work. The Broadhead substitution typified this negative approach. It should have been Keane off not Nathan.

Saying all that we could have got something out the game with a bit of luck but relying on luck will see us in the bottom 3 before the break for the WC. After the Middlesbrough game I'd given up but performances like yesterday give me some hope we can compete with even good teams...problem is getting the confidence into the players is Leams job and I'm not sure his timid approach can give them this over the full 90 minutes.

Shinnie will be a massive loss on Wednesday as nobody else has his football brain.
 
Couldn't make yesterday's game c/o work. Had to make do with Jeff Stelling & Co from the 2nd half. Totally gutted they scored in the last few minutes, as before a ball was kicked, I would have settled for a draw.

From reports, we seemed to do OK again. And in similar circumstances to the recent QPR game, lost by fine margins.

We go again Wednesday night!
 
jeffs right said:
Negative for most of the season has been McClean. He just isn't good enough for this level although there are others who also fit that bill.
Got to feel terribly sorry for Leam as he was totally let down by the owners in the summer transfer market however through with some of his tactics and selections he hasnt helped himself at times.
We will be relegated if something is not done in January.
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McCLeans legs have gone very slow can't beat anyone these days
 
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We are really missing quality at this level. We were much better than boro and cardiff games. Similar to Blackburn in terms of passing and tackling today and just generally competing.

There was a few times the ball came to back post to mcclean and instead of getting a shot of first time it ends up needing that extra touch so we never make the most of the space we do eventually find.

Feels like the quicksand form we've need used to in the championship over the winter months in recent years in that division.

It's feeling quieter in the stands as well at home games. The drum from ES2 used to build the atmosphere but it's all a bit flat just now.

Need to try get points on board before the World Cup and come back on some sort of positive
 
The problem we have you can’t play Magennis in the role we want him to play and only one person to blame the manger. He is not the best at this level now we all know that but there is no width in the team to get to the byline and cross the ball. It’s dinosaur football we are playing.
 
Made in Wigan said:
Saw him in East stand as I was heading to seat at start of game. What did he have to say on the off field issues?
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Didn't hear it al as I came in at the latter end , but he basically confirmed that it was a an isue with the bank and not in their direct control, the payments should have been made on Friday but they were made on Monday. There were questions from the floor but there were no microphones so it was difficult to hear with background noise. people seemed satisfied except one person who complained that Mal soon disappeared, but it was 2:20 on a match day and then I saw him in the East stand about 20 mins later
 
NorthernSoul said:
Exactly, 12 months before us, Blackpool created a brand new squad more or less in the Summer and picked up a surprise promotion, snaller budget than us. I think they had 5 ex Wigan players last season, playing a decent amount of minutes and none of which I would have had anywhere near our starting 11 last season.

They are widely regarded by supporters across all Championship clubs to have the weakest squad in the division but through excellent management stayed up comfortably last season, they seem to attack a bit more and try and win. That's a real disappointing aspect about Richardson, too cautious.

When we push higher up the pitch, press high, commit men forward and pass it along the floor, we actually look a solid mid table Championship side. When we drop deeper and revert to long ball, we look very poor.

Once Broadhead went off today we lost our outlet up top and nothing sticked anymore and we needlessly invited pressure from a Watford side who despite obvious quality offered little threat against our defence who played very well.

Magennis when he comes on, just annilhates our team, as he cannot hold the ball up, his reaction times are very slow and it changes the style of the whole team, to something we are uncomfortable with. Unless we are going all out attack late onwith say 3 strikers on and pumping crosses into the box, then I don't see how he ever gets on the pitch if we want to start winning games. Fair enough Broadhead can't do 90 but Aasgaard would have been a more like for like sub with his style, he could have held the ball up and created.

A close game but felt up until Broadheads departure, we looked the more likely side to win it 1-0 but that sub cost us the game.
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I personnaly felt that Broadhead was quite poor yesterday and thought he should be the one to be replaced. Pity Lang is injured as we need his type of runs at defenses
 
Just had a read through a lot of the posts on yesterday's game and i agree with a good number of points and observations raised. Personally, i thought it was a good performance today, disappointing result of course but a considerable improvement on some of the recent home displays (Middlesbrough cough). Ultimately Watford's quality shone through, i agree with KdZ's post about it being like last season in reverse, last season we could get away with being off in some games against opponents in the bottom half of League One (there were a number of examples of this in 2nd half of last season) due to us having superior quality to those teams at League One level. Total role reversal yesterday.

Been hearing a lot of talk about budgets, spending etc. I think quite simply we are going to have to accept that our budget for the time being at Championship level is going to be very restricted. There are still EFL restrictions in place lets not forget. Until we can stabilise at this level for 3 seasons minimum and gradually grow our revenue, grow our gates and make money from player sales then we wont be paying out any substantial transfer fees at this level.

One thing i will say is that if we do stay up at this level for 2023-24 then we need to do need to conduct a big squad overhaul next season. So many of this side are just not going to cut it beyond this season at Championship level and some are clearly already struggling now as it is. A number of the current squad is out of contract in the summer though, so there should be a good amount freed up in wages from letting a fair chunk of the current squad go if we stay up to do a big rebuild next summer.

To me, this summer, the issue was not the 'well we didnt spend any money' arguement (there wasnt much to spend due to our budget and restrictions). It was also as well not 'we didnt bring in a large number of players to supplement the squad' (Talal correctly pointed out that we have signed 14 players before in a summer window when going up to this level and look how much of a mess it ended up being before when we did this). Not to mention no one was calling for 11/12 new signings in the summer anyway.

However, the big issue with the summer's recruitment was that it was done far too late. The fact we only had one player signed up before our opening day game against Preston was very disappointing. Not to mention that one player (Nyambe) had not had a proper pre season behind him and we had to manage his fitness and play him into fitness during the season. Im just not a fan of leaving recruitment late. I know some mentioned that you can pick up those late deals that you might not have been able to early in the window if you wait. But the flip side of the coin to that argument is that you then risk missing out on signings in the free agent market (there were certainly some players we could have looked to have targeted here). Not to mention waiting till late in the window also means you run more risk of panic buying and that is unfortunately what has happened with the loan signings of Edmonds Green and Fletcher given how little both have featured for us.

Ultimately we have been unlucky this season with a few of the factors that have occurred during the season which were beyond our control. Example, i didnt think we needed a left back in the summer as i still thought that Bennett now that he was finally free of injury would still have a year of Championship football left in him. Sadly that isnt the case and the injuries have totally finished him. Pearce just isnt in favour and McClean as we saw yesterday especially and throughout the whole season so far is unfortunately past his best at Championship level no matter what role he plays on the left hand side. So left back has become a problem position for us when it wasnt viewed as a problem at the start of the campaign.

Stoke midweek is massive now as is Blackpool at home in the final game before the WC break. To me, id sacrifice the Swansea game away (rest and rotate the pack for that as its a free hit and i dont envisage getting anything away at Swansea) and throw everything at those two home games vs Swansea and Blackpool. Go on the attack in both. Please start Scully midweek if possible even if it means putting McClean as a left back, Scully as a winger and reverting to a back four once again. Broadhead behind MacGennis if Wyke is still injured even it means taking Keane out of the starting line up for a while (it should have been Keane imo taken off yesterday not Broadhead). Was noteworthy how any creative zip and guile we had in attack yesterday evaporated when Broadhead was taken off.

Need to start winning at home, the good away results early in the season were never sustainable and on another day the Birmingham and Luton away wins could have gone the other way. Thankfully they didnt as we would now be bottom of the league. Newly promoted teams have to make use of their home games if they are to survive and we badly need to starting putting some wins on the board at home. 4 or 6 points from those Blackpool and Stoke games could go a long way to helping us survive this season. Yesterday's result not great but the performance is some hope to cling onto. More of the same performance wise.vs Stoke with hopefully a different result next time!
 
GlasgowLatic said:
He came over to me at 5 to 3 and asked if I'd heard about problems then started showing me pics of him and Leam in bahrain😂
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So why not show these pictures to the press before all this blew out of proportion instead of stupid old pics from the past. Why not communicate with fans before even leaving the country that Leam was getting a new contract before the Mail's report. Why not announce himself prior to the Mail that there had been another wages cock up?
 
Oscarbon said:
Sorry I assumed that the players were hoofing the ball upfield on his instruction.
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Been through this time and again, :arrghh: the players are playing to the managers instructions otherwise I'm 100% certain he would have put a stop to it by now.

Surely the players must be pissed off with the hoof ball, we have players that can play football in that squad, take the shackles off Leam and let them bloody play ffs!
 
Oscarbon said:
Sorry I assumed that the players were hoofing the ball upfield on his instruction.
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Well they weren't for much of the game. What does he tell 'em ? ... do 15 mins of passing, then 15 mins of hoofing?

A few times, he (and the coaching staff) berated the players for getting rid of the ball to anywhere, when other options were on to play it out calmly.
 
Frank Bullitt said:
Been through this time and again, :arrghh: the players are playing to the managers instructions otherwise I'm 100% certain he would have put a stop to it by now.

Surely the players must be pissed off with the hoof ball, we have players that can play football in that squad, take the shackles off Leam and let them bloody play ffs!
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See above response.
 
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