Poch getting ready for the off? | Page 9 | Vital Football

Poch getting ready for the off?

I'd definitely take Rafa, but I wouldn't suddenly expect us to start winning trophies. He's a very good manager but the game has moved on since he won the major honours 10 years ago - and whilst he's won some stuff since he's not exactly proven himself to have the beating of the big clubs/Pep & Mourinho - at Real they got rid of him due to being unpopular with the players and losing big games...
 
Spursex said:
You can ignore the financial facts and the over-performance as much as you like, but equating success to 'only' being judge by silverware only shows your limitations.

Silverware is important, but step-change progression both on and off the pitch will underpin the club's progress for years.

Poch himself in his pre-match comments, has just pretty much said what I said a few days ago about the sea-change in our project key milestones and the fact that it has been achieved.

So stay half-empty, stay negative, play the troll, be one of 'those' 'supporters' - it really doesn't matter to me.
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My limitations? Who the bloody hell do you think you are?

Players judge success by winning trophies. Even sides with less money spent than we have, have won trophies. Poch has done well to bring the players together although there are many signings he has made that beggars belief. Sissoko and Aurier to name but two.
 
Resrocspur said:
My limitations? Who the bloody hell do you think you are?

Players judge success by winning trophies. Even sides with less money spent than we have, have won trophies. Poch has done well to bring the players together although there are many signings he has made that beggars belief. Sissoko and Aurier to name but two.
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I think you are arguing against yourself here.
 
How on earth am I arguing against myself?

What have we won in the last 4 years with a team that on paper is better than Man U, Liverpool and Chelsea?

That is fact!

You two are living in cloud cuckoo land.

RD and Big Chiv can see it too. They know their football, whereas you two are clearly blinkered.
 
When Poch signed up as manager, he bought into the 'project'. That project had certain aims and goal, along with certain limitations.

To date, all he's been asked to deliver is consistent CL qualification, which he has done. If he wins trophies along the way, that's great, but he's not going to jeopardise his position by not meeting the targets he's been set.

If you really want to vent your ire, maybe you should direct it as Levy.
 
ftuttle said:
When Poch signed up as manager, he bought into the 'project'. That project had certain aims and goal, along with certain limitations.

To date, all he's been asked to deliver is consistent CL qualification, which he has done. If he wins trophies along the way, that's great, but he's not going to jeopardise his position by not meeting the targets he's been set.

If you really want to vent your ire, maybe you should direct it as Levy.
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ftuttle said:
When Poch signed up as manager, he bought into the 'project'. That project had certain aims and goal, along with certain limitations.

To date, all he's been asked to deliver is consistent CL qualification, which he has done. If he wins trophies along the way, that's great, but he's not going to jeopardise his position by not meeting the targets he's been set.

If you really want to vent your ire, maybe you should direct it as Levy.
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ftuttle said:
When Poch signed up as manager, he bought into the 'project'. That project had certain aims and goal, along with certain limitations.

To date, all he's been asked to deliver is consistent CL qualification, which he has done. If he wins trophies along the way, that's great, but he's not going to jeopardise his position by not meeting the targets he's been set.

If you really want to vent your ire, maybe you should direct it as Levy.
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Clearly, you get it. Some people just can't see the woods for the trees.
 
Resrocspur said:
How on earth am I arguing against myself?

What have we won in the last 4 years with a team that on paper is better than Man U, Liverpool and Chelsea?

That is fact!

You two are living in cloud cuckoo land.

RD and Big Chiv can see it too. They know their football, whereas you two are clearly blinkered.
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I'm a bit baffled by your statement 'What have we won in the last 4 years with a team that on paper is better than Man U, Liverpool and Chelsea' are you saying this team has been in place for 4yrs? Kane only really broke into the team 3yrs ago, Toby only joined us 3yrs ago, Sanchez last summer, Wanyama less than two years, Son less than 3yrs, Trippier 3yrs, Aurier less than a year and Alli is just completing his 3rd season. This side has cost a fraction of the sides you have mentioned, it is also debatable if on paper they are a better side.
But assuming you are correct, they certainly weren't better 4 or even 3 years ago.
For me we are where we are today because of Poch, when all our players are fit our first 11 can certainly compete. But our problem is our bench is still not quite good enough.
 
Topspur1 said:
I'm a bit baffled by your statement 'What have we won in the last 4 years with a team that on paper is better than Man U, Liverpool and Chelsea' are you saying this team has been in place for 4yrs? Kane only really broke into the team 3yrs ago, Toby only joined us 3yrs ago, Sanchez last summer, Wanyama less than two years, Son less than 3yrs, Trippier 3yrs, Aurier less than a year and Alli is just completing his 3rd season. This side has cost a fraction of the sides you have mentioned, it is also debatable if on paper they are a better side.
But assuming you are correct, they certainly weren't better 4 or even 3 years ago.
For me we are where we are today because of Poch, when all our players are fit our first 11 can certainly compete. But our problem is our bench is still not quite good enough.
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Bingo...we are unable to adjust when needed and have very limited cover for some of our starters.
 
Resrocspur said:
How on earth am I arguing against myself?

What have we won in the last 4 years with a team that on paper is better than Man U, Liverpool and Chelsea?

That is fact!

You two are living in cloud cuckoo land.

RD and Big Chiv can see it too. They know their football, whereas you two are clearly blinkered.
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you are using statements that don't have any substance , clearly not thought out very well and smack of desperation to denigrate the team , manager and background staff.
Bringing other names into your argument doesn't do you any favours either. They both have well thought out constructive and intelligent debate qualities . I appreciate that you might have different opinions to me but I would also appreciate not being put into ,negative ,ridiculous
and imaginary box's to suit your post.
Should you also think I am biased then I will completely agree with you. I am a Spurs supporter through and through , rain or shine and have seen more ups and downs in the last fifty eight years than the bloke who works Tower Bridge has had hot dinners.
Blinkered ? You're having a laugh
 
There are clearly good points being made by everyone here. The stupid thing is we all do agree in a weird kind of way.

Some just go to town a bit more heavily. Like myself. :eek!:
 
It would be great to debate opinions without condescension when agreement cannot be reached. Some opinions may be better researched than others and this often applies when commenting on history when there are facts to be presented, analysed, interpreted and debated, but when it comes to future predictions everyone is just offering an opinion based upon what they see and how they interpret current and past trends.

What I have always liked about the forum was that views spoken from the heart could be expressed without snide comments in response. That’s not to say without dissent but with debate, Sadly, this seems to be changing lately.
 
It's the sanctimonious posters that are irritating at times. People who think they have a divine say on the inner thoughts of the club. Unless Poch or Levy are working under aliases on here, it would be welcomed if they would be a little less high and mighty.

We all have opinions, I admit I am a stubborn and forthright at times and I guess I need to reign it in occasionally. :grinning:
 
Resrocspur said:
It's the sanctimonious posters that are irritating at times. People who think they have a divine say on the inner thoughts of the club. Unless Poch or Levy are working under aliases on here, it would be welcomed if they would be a little less high and mighty.

We all have opinions, I admit I am a stubborn and forthright at times and I guess I need to reign it in occasionally. :grinning:
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I agree you do, as do I....I get extremely irritated by those who present subjective opinions as fact and who seemingly ignore context when often it's the key aspect of any debate; having a closed mind negates the possibility of anything positive happening and we as a club have come too far in recent times to denigrate our progress or the possibilities that this now is beginning to afford us.

:tophat:
 
There are a lot of factors affecting our progress. I don't think we have got worse, I don't think we have stood still. We have had injuries to key players and the Wembley issue to deal with. Money limitations in comparison to our rivals too. If we get CL it will be a big achievement IMO. As I have said before, minor cups are ok but no real measure of progress or ability.
 
Resrocspur said:
I 'm well aware of the positives of the club. We are financially stable, have a brand new stadium to look forward to and have a good manager and squad. We have moved forward, but whereas we have remained steady, others around us have won trophies even with inferior sides and even though their seasons are considered poor. I don't think we have made the most of the squad we now have. Poch has had 4 years and we are no closer to winning something. Yes he has improved things, but if we fail to get CL this season, is that really progress? I honestly can't see us winning anything in the foreseeable future. Poch has a wall to climb. I can't see him doing it and with thvis team, it would not only be a major disappointment but also a major failure.
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So I guess your from your statement above making CL again would be progress?
 
Does anyone still think he is 100% the right man?
 
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