General politics thread: | Page 5 | Vital Football

General politics thread:

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Pope John XXIII said:
I see the Met are busy winning hearts and minds tonight :rolleyes:
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Did you see Jess Phillips on the Marr Show?
Asked about whether there's a problem with how we are bringing up kids she said:
"I'm raising 2 boys myself so I don't want to further bash women, but we need to make sure we are educating kids better" (slight paraphrase).
 
i am a tree said:
Did you see Jess Phillips on the Marr Show?
Asked about whether there's a problem with how we are bringing up kids she said:
"I'm raising 2 boys myself so I don't want to further bash women, but we need to make sure we are educating kids better" (slight paraphrase).
Click to expand...
Yes i did. Horrible specimen. It took Andrew Marr to remind her mid rant that 75% of all violence is directed at men.
 
i am a tree said:
Did you see Jess Phillips on the Marr Show?
Asked about whether there's a problem with how we are bringing up kids she said:
"I'm raising 2 boys myself so I don't want to further bash women, but we need to make sure we are educating kids better" (slight paraphrase).
Click to expand...
Clearly she is just victim blaming. If you want a real champion of women, you need to go to the opinions of our own CP, not the most significant parliamentary champion of women's safety of the last few years.
 
jbacsta said:
Yes i did. Horrible specimen. It took Andrew Marr to remind her mid rant that 75% of all violence is directed at men.
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By other men, presumably.

Hardly the same thing or the same concern is it?

The issue is women's safety from male violence, not make safety from male (or even female) violence. We are not the victims of this story.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
Clearly she is just victim blaming. If you want a real champion of women, you need to go to the opinions of our own CP, not the most significant parliamentary champion of women's safety of the last few years.
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Or Pope who thinks women can solve the problem of them being murdered and raped, that fathers have less responsibility than mothers and men in general none at all...
 
jbacsta said:
Yes i did. Horrible specimen. It took Andrew Marr to remind her mid rant that 75% of all violence is directed at men.
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Mostly by other men, and there is a clear distinction in the types of violence, abuse, harrassment etc that women receive than men.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
No, fathers on the whole take less responsibility, which is a whole different to address
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They do, so lets focus on them rather than mothers to provide the solution. Let's call on men to educate and provide appropriate role models rather than saying it's down to 'especially the mothers'.
 
Calvin Plummer said:
They do, so lets focus on them rather than mothers to provide the solution. Let's call on men to educate and provide appropriate role models rather than saying it's down to 'especially the mothers'.
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It's "especially the mothers" because more mothers are active parents- from the simple fact of 15-20% of families being single parent families for a start.

How can it be that, over a day on from that post, you still haven't grasped that I used the word "especially" only for that reason?

Go on then, "call on men" to provide an appropriate role model and be more active parent. Go on, do it. Do your "calling". What does it look like and what is the effect?

One of my favourite authors sometimes says "wish in one hand and shit in the other, and see which one fills up first"
 
Pope John XXIII said:
It's "especially the mothers" because more mothers are active parents- from the simple fact of 15-20% of families being single parent families for a start.

How can it be that, over a day on from that post, you still haven't grasped that I used the word "especially" only for that reason?

Go on then, "call on men" to provide an appropriate role model and be more active parent. Go on, do it. Do your "calling". What does it look like and what is the effect?

One of my favourite authors sometimes says "wish in one hand and shit in the other, and see which one fills up first"
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Hang on lol you're the one who thinks mothers can magically provide a solution. How is that going Popey?

Simple fact, (ignoring medical intervention) it takes a man and woman to make a baby and the man has just as much responsibility to educate and provide healthy rolemodels as the mums do.

Your magic solution that will come from mothers also completely ignores society, culture, media, language etc. But yeah those damn mothers...
 
Calvin Plummer said:
Hang on lol you're the one who thinks mothers can magically provide a solution. How is that going Popey?

Simple fact, (ignoring medical intervention) it takes a man and woman to make a baby and the man has just as much responsibility to educate and provide healthy rolemodels as the mums do.

Your magic solution that will come from mothers also completely ignores society, culture, media, language etc. But yeah those damn mothers...
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I didn't say I knew what the solution was. I said that, whatever it is, when it does come it will be the women and mothers who end up being the ones who have had the biggest role in sorting it; as they have/do in so many other things.

I love your optimism that men alone are going to suddenly change 30,000 years of collective behaviour because CP is haranguing them on the internet.

We of course have to tackle some toxic culture as well. We have an absolutely poisonous working class culture in some families, in which either mothers or father's deliberately try to sabotage their children or Impose nonsense conservative "traditional" values on their children to make themselves feel important. You can dial this up by 100 in the USA, where many "traditional" parents literally kick their kids out on the streets at 18.

And of course we have some utterly toxic BAME cultures that are religiously conservative or culturally "traditional". Many of these have a deeply ingrained mysogeny that is vigerously defended by the mothers of the family (FGM is almost wholly inflicted by the women of a family) and some, particularly some of the "traditional" Carribbean families, openly tolerate male violence as "strict" parenting.

But someone like you will no doubt want to play the racism card if anyone so much as points that finger, so get that card at the ready.

In my experience, those BAME families are far more likely to change through the changing attitudes of the young girls than the young boys. I see some girls who are being drawn into the traditional types, and I see others that are rebelling and having none of it. The latter, I hope, will raise girls and boys who don't have an inherent mysogeny and dont feel wedded to those "values"

What I don't see much of is young men/boys who are rebelling against those cultural norms and fiercely defending women or insisting on more modern values. I see a lot of great young BAME men, but I don't see much evidence of a conscious change there.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
I didn't say I knew what the solution was. I said that, whatever it is, when it does come it will be the women and mothers who end up being the ones who have had the biggest role in sorting it; as they have/do in so many other things.

I love your optimism that men alone are going to suddenly change 30,000 years of collective behaviour because CP is haranguing them on the internet.

We of course have to tackle some toxic culture as well. We have an absolutely poisonous working class culture in some families, in which either mothers or father's deliberately try to sabotage their children or Impose nonsense conservative "traditional" values on their children to make themselves feel important. You can dial this up by 100 in the USA, where many "traditional" parents literally kick their kids out on the streets at 18.

And of course we have some utterly toxic BAME cultures that are religiously conservative or culturally "traditional". Many of these have a deeply ingrained mysogeny that is vigerously defended by the mothers of the family (FGM is almost wholly inflicted by the women of a family) and some, particularly some of the "traditional" Carribbean families, openly tolerate male violence as "strict" parenting.

But someone like you will no doubt want to play the racism card if anyone so much as points that finger, so get that card at the ready.

In my experience, those BAME families are far more likely to change through the changing attitudes of the young girls than the young boys. I see some girls who are being drawn into the traditional types, and I see others that are rebelling and having none of it. The latter, I hope, will raise girls and boys who don't have an inherent mysogeny and dont feel wedded to those "values"

What I don't see much of is young men/boys who are rebelling against those cultural norms and fiercely defending women or insisting on more modern values. I see a lot of great young BAME men, but I don't see much evidence of a conscious change there.
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Lol no you didn't, but nice attempt at walking back your previous nonsense.

I'm not going to respond to the rest of your post which not for the first time treads a very fine line...
 
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