#COVID19

[Old Red Fart]

Thank the lord she’s not our PM*

*I do understand she’s the darling of the liberal progressives too, but it doesn’t take a rocket surgeon to see how this will end...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1293400780167208960

Good job you don't live in New Zealand strett, you'd be hung, drawn, and quartered, a good many Australians wish she was our PM in place of the wishy washy salesman we have at the moment. She appears to be doing a good job over there, and particularly with the covid fight. On a personal level I'd like to see her doing the same job over in the UK, and then see how you end up with the virus. Sounds as though it might be a much needed wake up call.

She has a lot of teeth, but that clip looks to me to have been a bit doctored. Even with those teeth she looks better in the flesh. Wish we had her over here.

 

[Old Red Fart]

How on earth can you keep politics out of this? Politicians have been making the decisions across the world. Our politicians have made some terrible decisions. Other politicians have made far superior decisions.

Now then itto, keep your hair on,my only reference to politicians was to keep it to a minimum although in my opinion yours in the UK are pathetic. Also my reference to your beaches and Wollaton would have had the local police in quickly to sort it out had it happened here. In a general sense your Politicians should have laid the law down early but they didn't and it sounds as though a fairly large percentage of the UK public didn't want it either. Might be wrong with the last bit but that's the impression I get.
And it's not that there was plenty happening across the globe to learn from either.
And I doubt whether your pollies have got the message even now.

Please bear in mind that we live half a world away and the info we get is secondhand at best although there's no doubt (or not so much) about the fatalities and the rest of it.

 

[Strett]

Not exactly what I was asking - should they be legislated for? Should refusing a vaccine (assuming there ever is an effective one) be compulsory? If so what do you do with those who refuse? If not, then a vaccine becomes near valueless and the harm to the economy and society continues.

It’s an interesting discussion, legally it would be tricky to enforce but it could be enforced by means of a ‘travel passport’ (blue obvs) which effectively puts restrictions on people who have not got it. But that’s never been done before. TB for example kills 1.5m people worldwide, nothing there.

 

[Strett]

it beggars belief that a debate is needed to show that covering your mouth and nose will spread less germs. Whats the question? its madness

If it assuages people’s fears and gets them out and about then it’s a good thing.

 

[Apollyon]

Paz is currently working on an old skool 3 skin vaccine chaps.

Inbox him for details

 

[in_the_top_one]

It’s an interesting discussion, legally it would be tricky to enforce but it could be enforced by means of a ‘travel passport’ (blue obvs) which effectively puts restrictions on people who have not got it. But that’s never been done before. TB for example kills 1.5m people worldwide, nothing there.

Nothing there?

First, TB is in decline worldwide and is a treatable bacterial infection. Not the same.

Second, the biggest TB problems are in countries like India. India has... compulsory bcg vaccination!

 

[in_the_top_one]

Paz is currently working on an old skool 3 skin vaccine chaps.

Inbox him for details

But can he roll a tulip?

 

[in_the_top_one]

If it assuages people’s fears and gets them out and about MORE SAFELY then it’s a good thing.

Fixed that for you.
Masks are not a placebo.

 

[Apollyon]

But can he roll a tulip?

Whilst riding a bike on an A road

 

[in_the_top_one]

and it sounds as though a fairly large percentage of the UK public didn't want it either. Might be wrong with the last bit but that's the impression I get.

Nobody wants a lockdown.

And it's not that there was plenty happening across the globe to learn from either.

Presumed this is a bad joke?
We were late to our wave. That is a massive ADVANTAGE which we squandered appallingly. Many other countries had seen the need for lockdown and acted. Italy and others were looking at us agog and begging us to take action.
We didn't because of a mixture of weak advice from SAGE, Boris Johnson's divorce arrangements because he'd got yet another woman knocked up that was not his wife, and Brexit.
And now we have 60k+ dead friends and relatives, a longer lockdown, and a more desperate and longer-lasting recession. Much of that disaster (not all) was entirely preventable and many people were shouting that at our politicians at the time - not with hindsight.

So, don't worry, my hair is still on but I'm justifiably cross about it. Everybody should be.

 

[in_the_top_one]

i think if i have the choice and am vaccinated (presuming it works) then i don't care if others don't. They arent a risk to me

Sadly, there are some who cannot take vaccines for medical reasons and they need high general uptake to protect them.

 

[Strett]

Nothing there?

First, TB is in decline worldwide and is a treatable bacterial infection. Not the same.

Second, the biggest TB problems are in countries like India. India has... compulsory bcg vaccination!

BCG has a relatively low success rate, but the point being, which I’m sure you understand, is that according to the WHO 1/4 of the world’s population have TB, but the population is free to travel without proof of inoculation.

 

[Strett]

Fixed that for you.
Masks are not a placebo.

But they are. People think it offers them protection, it doesn’t it protects others and only if they are worn correctly, which a casual look around people in Woolworths, shows the majority are not.
Social distancing and regular hand washing is far more effective. It’s an economical decision to get people out and spending money.

 

[Old Red Fart]

For a start ORF, any time you have heard about a 'lockdown' or 'local lockdown measures' since the pubs re-opened, you have been tricked, because the pubs are still open everywhere.
You either lock everything down or you don't. It doesn't help stop the spread of a virus to kind of lockdown some things a little bit.
I've been told I can't have a neighbour in my garden, but also i can take everyone on my street to the nearest restaurant and get a government subsidized meal out. How do these measures stop coronavirus?
Its been like this from the start. Government decisions have been slow and ineffective in almost every area, and have been so half arsed as to be completely useless in practice.

As one small example,. I am having an operation next week and i'm supposed to be shielding.
Because the government wants people spending money in pubs, my housemate has to go back to work, even though the pub he is working in isn't safe from corona. I am being told i must quarantine but i can't expect the guy to lose his job on my behalf.

tl;dr Contradictory policy that doesn't make sense and is unnecessarily PR focused and confusing, as well as being ineffective is the reason for the UK's poor showing.

Sure, you can choose to blame individuals at the beach, but with problems on this huge a scale i think its reasonable to zoom out a bit and look at what the causes of that behaviour are and whether anything could have been done to predict/change said behaviour.

First off, good luck with your op, hope it goes well. you're right about the confusion, to different degrees it's worldwide and folks on the beach is only a part of it. The major part of the problem seems to be the way that people tend to gather together, could be church, football, cafes, pubs and anything like that,and the authorities are loath to close any of them down, it's a vote loser. We've reached the point over here where this is being addressed with the emphasis being put on the distance between customers and that is now being policed heavily, seems to be working too.
It's going to be a few months yet before we see a worthwhile result over here, most of us are living in hope.

 

[Taylor82]

I still haven't even washed my hands in months.

 

[Strett]

Nobody wants a lockdown.


Presumed this is a bad joke?
We were late to our wave. That is a massive ADVANTAGE which we squandered appallingly. Many other countries had seen the need for lockdown and acted. Italy and others were looking at us agog and begging us to take action.
We didn't because of a mixture of weak advice from SAGE, Boris Johnson's divorce arrangements because he'd got yet another woman knocked up that was not his wife, and Brexit.
And now we have 60k+ dead friends and relatives, a longer lockdown, and a more desperate and longer-lasting recession. Much of that disaster (not all) was entirely preventable and many people were shouting that at our politicians at the time - not with hindsight.

So, don't worry, my hair is still on but I'm justifiably cross about it. Everybody should be.

41000 deaths. Fixed that for you.

 

[in_the_top_one]

BCG has a relatively low success rate, but the point being, which I’m sure you understand, is that according to the WHO 1/4 of the world’s population have TB, but the population is free to travel without proof of inoculation.

That's a point. It's a different point, but it's a point.

 

[in_the_top_one]

41000 deaths. Fixed that for you.

No.
Excess deaths is a much better method, and still possibly an underestimate on account of reduced deaths from other transmissible diseases that were also reduced thanks to lockdown. E.g. seasonal flu.

 

[Old Red Fart]

Nobody wants a lockdown.


Presumed this is a bad joke?
We were late to our wave. That is a massive ADVANTAGE which we squandered appallingly. Many other countries had seen the need for lockdown and acted. Italy and others were looking at us agog and begging us to take action.
We didn't because of a mixture of weak advice from SAGE, Boris Johnson's divorce arrangements because he'd got yet another woman knocked up that was not his wife, and Brexit.
And now we have 60k+ dead friends and relatives, a longer lockdown, and a more desperate and longer-lasting recession. Much of that disaster (not all) was entirely preventable and many people were shouting that at our politicians at the time - not with hindsight.

So, don't worry, my hair is still on but I'm justifiably cross about it. Everybody should be.

Here again itto, just like a bad smell, I can't stop, glad about your hair, presume it's not grey yet.
I wasn't joking, deadly serious in fact, I thought your Govt had made a right ballsup but wasn't sure if my facts were correct since all of our UK news is secondhand. Other than that I agree all of your post.
I learned today that the new outbreak in New Zealand is a different strain to the old one, I've no idea whether this might involve a different vaccine, hope not, I have no faith in Putin. It's going to take quite a while to get topside of this in any case and I hate to think of the few years that will follow, no quick fix possible.
In Sydney we still have pubs, restaurants etc open but subject to Police checks and heavy penalties when caught out, and on the face of it seems to be working. Keeps some of the population a bit happier.

 

[in_the_top_one]

But they are. People think it offers them protection, it doesn’t it protects others and only if they are worn correctly, which a casual look around people in Woolworths, shows the majority are not.
Social distancing and regular hand washing is far more effective. It’s an economical decision to get people out and spending money.

There y'go. I've highlighted the important bit.

I have never commented on the relative efficacy of masks over hand washing or distancing. I agree it is an effort to get people out.


You don't need a mask to shop online. Woollies has been closed in the high st for five years. See, I can be a smartarse too.