Remaining fxtures | Page 13 | Vital Football

Remaining fxtures

walgarthjohn said:
Can see the point but I can also seeing it cost a lot of money. And how can we fund that and the EFL know that.
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No doubt it will be expensive but the prefered bidder could be in place in the middle of next week. If that is the case and they put the deposit in and want to proceed with the legal costs I imagine we can proceed as long as they know they are paying for it. If we don't get prefered bidder immediately or they don't want to proceed then that changes things but it is in any potential new owners best interest to fund the appeal if it's got a chance of saving them 10 to 20m.

Alternatively if we have to sell a player to fund it it's probably worth it as if we go down relegation fee clauses alone will cost us millions. Worth selling one of them now even on the cheap to fund the case than accept relegation and then sell them all on the cheap.

Ultimately the admin and potential owners will work out the best way forward with the appeal but I think for us to come this far with so much on the line we probably need to try and take it as far as we can.
 
Made in Wigan said:
This is the appeal - from what I understand they can’t appeal the appeal. In regards being 80% sure of success - in a win or lose scenario you’d take those odds everytime in a court of law or in this case an independent commission. I’m not even sure why you’d consider it a miracle - if you look back at the efk’s success at these hearings they rarely get the outcome they hope or want.
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I suspect they probably could appeal the appeal but if we win on legal grounds it will probably be hard to appeal the loop hole we exploited.

I admire your optimism but don't get your hopes too high as you may set yourself up for the horrible let down. I'm with you that we clearly have a chance and should pursue it as much as possible but I don't think we can be that confident as anything could happen and I point blank dont trust the EFL and could see them working out a way to fudge their way out of this at our expense.
 
C_Latic said:
I just hope the QC is honest with us. He's receiving the money so will understandably want us to proceed with the appeal. I just wish he realises how perilous our finances are and shows some integrity in giving it to us straight as to our chances of overturning this thing. Because even though we go down, we simply cannot afford to be wasting cash that quite frankly we don't have, on something we aren't over 80% sure of winning. Let's not forget, even if a miracle happened and we did get it overturned, the EFL would appeal which means MORE money to be spent and the case dragging again. We simply cannot afford to get this wrong. Our club's future may depend on it.
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I suspect they will understand the circumstances and be straight with us - they won't want to take on a case they know they can't win. If they are taking it on i suspect they believe there is a good chance of success.

But not sure we can put any percentage chance on it as this is uncharted territory without anything like this ever happening before. But fingers crossed it is a fight we'll win and the reward will justify the risk.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
I suspect they probably could appeal the appeal but if we win on legal grounds it will probably be hard to appeal the loop hole we exploited.

I admire your optimism but don't get your hopes too high as you may set yourself up for the horrible let down. I'm with you that we clearly have a chance and should pursue it as much as possible but I don't think we can be that confident as anything could happen and I point blank dont trust the EFL and could see them working out a way to fudge their way out of this at our expense.
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I’m with you on not trusting the efl. However this is an independent commission - it’s chaired by a barrister. All laws or in this case regulations are a bit of an unknown entity until tested. In this case our situation is unique and the regs won’t have been tested on the points we will raise. There is also the point on when any penalty is due - regs talk about ‘normal’ season - good luck to the efl arguing the season is ‘normal’ at this point in time.

Personally I think we’re done on the pitch, today has killed us, every result went against us. However my honest, objective on this is we have a good chance of avoiding a penalty this season. In a way I wish I didn’t as I could move on and accept we’re done.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
I suspect they probably could appeal the appeal but if we win on legal grounds it will probably be hard to appeal the loop hole we exploited.

I admire your optimism but don't get your hopes too high as you may set yourself up for the horrible let down. I'm with you that we clearly have a chance and should pursue it as much as possible but I don't think we can be that confident as anything could happen and I point blank dont trust the EFL and could see them working out a way to fudge their way out of this at our expense.
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Think after today's draw against Charlton & other results not going our way a successful appeal is what alot of fans ( myself included) are pinning our hopes on. Had we got the 3 points today most of us would be thinking f@ck the EFL, shove 2 fingers up to them & be fairly blase about our appeal....sadly we're now all in the last chance saloon cheering on our QC.....whilst chanting "QC, QC will tear you apart again"......I'll get my coat🍻😉
 
Made in Wigan said:
I’m with you on not trusting the efl. However this is an independent commission - it’s chaired by a barrister. All laws or in this case regulations are a bit of an unknown entity until tested. In this case our situation is unique and the regs won’t have been tested on the points we will raise. There is also the point on when any penalty is due - regs talk about ‘normal’ season - good luck to the efl arguing the season is ‘normal’ at this point in time.

Personally I think we’re done on the pitch, today has killed us, every result went against us. However my honest, objective on this is we have a good chance of avoiding a penalty this season. In a way I wish I didn’t as I could move on and accept we’re done.
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I don’t agree we’re done. We need to win, that hasn’t changed. But all this talk of teams being on the beach I don’t think that will be the case. Leeds are not going to end the season with a whimper when there is so much riding on it. I cannot believe Bielsa would allow it. Then there is Blackburn. Again I don’t see Mowbray allowing his players to take it easy. I think he gets on well with Cook and although they are our local rivals I would not be surprised in the slightest if, playing with no pressure, they came out and did us a favour. We just have to put in one almighty performance to get the result by any means possible on Wednesday and I think we will get one of the results we need.
 
SwindonLatic said:
I don’t agree we’re done. We need to win, that hasn’t changed. But all this talk of teams being on the beach I don’t think that will be the case. Leeds are not going to end the season with a whimper when there is so much riding on it. I cannot believe Bielsa would allow it. Then there is Blackburn. Again I don’t see Mowbray allowing his players to take it easy. I think he gets on well with Cook and although they are our local rivals I would not be surprised in the slightest if, playing with no pressure, they came out and did us a favour. We just have to put in one almighty performance to get the result by any means possible on Wednesday and I think we will get one of the results we need.
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Whilst I don’t share your optimism, I hope you’re right Swindon.
 
SwindonLatic said:
Plenty more twists and turns yet and us staying up on our own merits after what has gone on the past few weeks is the perfect end to the season. As you know we don’t do things the easy way and Wednesday could be the latest chapter in our final day great escapes! UTFT!
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Well said...that's the spirit. Cook will send them out swarming all over them like flies round a Richard 111. Brentford will probably be 3 up by half-time and Fulham will give up going into 50/50s with a fired up Sammi.

It can be done, it will be done.
 
Gutted after that late goal yesterday,but we have to keep our heads up,as we still have a chance!
It will be tough on Wednesday,but we are on a remarkable run of form,are one of the best teams in the league in 2020 and have proved we can beat the top teams.So it will be a hard game for Fulham too.We are still full of fight and have been absolutely brilliant at home in recent games!

I actually wouldn't mind a Barnsley win today,as it puts extra pressure on Luton/Charlton.We know we have to win to have a chance,so even if Barnsley win their last 2,we still finish above them on goal difference,if we do so.

Furthermore,some added motivation for Blackburn is that if they beat Luton,they can still finish above n*b end.There's a lot of rivalry between the 2 and I'm sure they'll want to finish in the top 10 as well.
Finally IMO I don't think Bielsa is the type of manager to just accept a loss and a poor performance on the last day.So there's still hope for us yet.

We can still do this! Believe!
 
Is it feasible / possible that being in league one will be a financially more attractive proposition for potential buyers ?
Admittedly the income is significantly lower but won't the expenditure also be lower. I assume the biggest drain on club finances is player wages, if we drop a division I assume (again) there will be clauses in any retained player contracts to facilitate a wage reduction and the majority of this squad will leave anyway as they can certainly play at a higher level.
If we stay in the championship players could (legally) sit on lucrative contracts and cost the new owner a fortune.
I don't know whether net losses in league one will be less than net losses in the championship.
 
Arthur_Itis said:
Is it feasible / possible that being in league one will be a financially more attractive proposition for potential buyers ?
Admittedly the income is significantly lower but won't the expenditure also be lower. I assume the biggest drain on club finances is player wages, if we drop a division I assume (again) there will be clauses in any retained player contracts to facilitate a wage reduction and the majority of this squad will leave anyway as they can certainly play at a higher level.
If we stay in the championship players could (legally) sit on lucrative contracts and cost the new owner a fortune.
I don't know whether net losses in league one will be less than net losses in the championship.
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Depends on how you cut your cloth.

If we are in the Championship there is drastically more income and player sales will be higher.

Easier to run a club with more money especially in the first season with new owners. We can chose to run a wage bill at whatever level we choose knowing a sustainable wage bill will obviously make us less competitive but we can balance that against player sales too.

There is no scenario in this instance going down this year makes things easier as everything is worth less and income revenues plummet. Easier to get buyer and start to rebuild at this level than in L1.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
Depends on how you cut your cloth.

If we are in the Championship there is drastically more income and player sales will be higher.

Easier to run a club with more money especially in the first season with new owners. We can chose to run a wage bill at whatever level we choose knowing a sustainable wage bill will obviously make us less competitive but we can balance that against player sales too.

There is no scenario in this instance going down this year makes things easier as everything is worth less and income revenues plummet. Easier to get buyer and start to rebuild at this level than in L1.
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Agree with some but not all of that KDZ, like me, you've made some assumptions. If we stay up and can't offload certain players we cannot "choose" to run a wage bill at whatever level we like. Ask Sunderland about Rodwell. I'm not saying it will happen, we just don't / can't know yet. Also, there's an assumption that all players will be worth less but I'd counter that by saying only if only a single club is interested in them. Take Robinson for example, it's been suggested that he has a release clause of 1.5m but if 2+ teams want him there is no way the highest bid would be 1.5. We just don't know how finances will be affected, it's all speculation, but I'd "guess" that a local consortium trying to keep the club alive for the good of the community (god bless them) may (or may not) prefer a league one outfit with league one liabilities so the assumption that relegation will put off all buyers (as has been suggested on here) might or might not be the case. I'm just offering an alternative possibility. Not even sure if I believe it myself.
 
Arthur_Itis said:
Is it feasible / possible that being in league one will be a financially more attractive proposition for potential buyers ?
Admittedly the income is significantly lower but won't the expenditure also be lower. I assume the biggest drain on club finances is player wages, if we drop a division I assume (again) there will be clauses in any retained player contracts to facilitate a wage reduction and the majority of this squad will leave anyway as they can certainly play at a higher level.
If we stay in the championship players could (legally) sit on lucrative contracts and cost the new owner a fortune.
I don't know whether net losses in league one will be less than net losses in the championship.
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Few weeks ago when this broke I thought the same myself Arthur. As more information has come out around the release clauses in players contracts should we go down then I think the value of the club would plummet too much. If it plummets we aren’t as attractive a purchase and if no one then buys us we may no longer exist. Maybe there is a buyer that wants a L1 club and associated costs in which case happy days (thinking maybe lenigans consortium) but financially the club would lose millions. Stay up, if needs be flog what we can, accept we’d likely go down next year if we did that but we’d at least have more cash in the bank that way going forward. My fear is the uncertainty around what league we are in will cause unnecessary purchase delays and create even further problems.
 
Made in Wigan said:
Few weeks ago when this broke I thought the same myself Arthur. As more information has come out around the release clauses in players contracts should we go down then I think the value of the club would plummet too much. If it plummets we aren’t as attractive a purchase and if no one then buys us we may no longer exist. Maybe there is a buyer that wants a L1 club and associated costs in which case happy days (thinking maybe lenigans consortium) but financially the club would lose millions. Stay up, if needs be flog what we can, accept we’d likely go down next year if we did that but we’d at least have more cash in the bank that way going forward. My fear is the uncertainty around what league we are in will cause unnecessary purchase delays and create even further problems.
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If we can stay up I don’t necessarily think we are nailed on to struggle next season. We have saleable assets yes, but with some astute signings there is no reason why we can’t build on this fantastic last third of the season. There are a few players from out relegation rivals I’d be looking at not to mention the loan market
 
SwindonLatic said:
If we can stay up I don’t necessarily think we are nailed on to struggle next season. We have saleable assets yes, but with some astute signings there is no reason why we can’t build on this fantastic last third of the season. There are a few players from out relegation rivals I’d be looking at not to mention the loan market
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Its all a big unknown at present. No idea what league we’ll be in, if we’ll get bought, if so who will they be, what will be their plans, what budget we’d have, will there be a salary cap, who will be manager etc etc. All that a new season starting in about 8 weeks!
 
hindleymonwafc said:
Well said...that's the spirit. Cook will send them out swarming all over them like flies round a Richard 111. Brentford will probably be 3 up by half-time and Fulham will give up going into 50/50s with a fired up Sammi.

It can be done, it will be done.
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This is Wigan, when have we ever done the simple / boring scenario?
Let's carry on believing for those next few days cos if win the game which is well easily possible I think we will stay up.
 
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