Here we go! | Page 1608 | Vital Football

Here we go!

toms said:
There is quite clearly a distinction between those who towed the party line as the will of the people was delivered. May didnt want it for example so came up with a dog awful deal. There were about 3-40 remainers and many others towed the line or were reluctant Brexiteers. True Brexiteers -I'd say 100.
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But where did they tow it to?
 
toms said:
There is quite clearly a distinction between those who towed the party line as the will of the people was delivered. May didnt want it for example so came up with a dog awful deal. There were about 3-40 remainers and many others toed the line or were reluctant Brexiteers. True Brexiteers -I'd say 100.
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If May ‘didn’t want it’, how do you explain Boris’ deal?
 
Polly 433 said:
Marches, speeches, long columns written about deaths in Gaza. Number killed 33,000. Terrible as it is where are the eyes and speeches, the marches about Yemen. Number killed in Yemen 300,000 nobody stirs. Syria 250,000, under estimate. No body marches. Palestinians have a right to their own state but so do others. Do not take your eye of the ball. Gaza is only one part of the picture.
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if there isnt a rise in anti semitism then that would be a concern :/
 
toms said:
That's absolute nonsense particularly given the immigration pact the EU has just passed. I will grant you though that the Conservatives have failed with controlling immigration
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So my post is all nonsense except for the bit you agree with, which is all of it?
 
Pope John XXIII said:
So my post is all nonsense except for the bit you agree with, which is all of it?
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Did I? I don't think so. Being in the EU would be significantly worse as would a Labour government

This is what you said in response to me commenting about the EU:-

"A single material benefit was we could actually control immigration far better within it"
 
toms said:
Did I? I don't think so. Being in the EU would be significantly worse
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It wouldnt
toms said:
as would a Labour government
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It wasn't
toms said:
This is what you said in response to me commenting about the EU:-

"A single material benefit was we could actually control immigration far better within it"
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Which is true. The end of immigration cooperation and the exposure to many more trade compromises for miniscule benefits has exploded immigration.

Which was entirely predictable. It was predicted in fact. You called it project fear
 
Woanz said:
news.sky.com

Liz Truss refuses to rule out running for Tory leader again

Liz Truss's tenure in Downing Street lasted just 49 days after her £45bn package of unfunded tax cuts triggered mass market turmoil. The former prime minister has since doubled down on what she was trying to achieve, and is touring the media ahead of the publication of a book.
news.sky.com news.sky.com


I mean honestly
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If the worst PM of all time is who they want as leader, clearly they've had enough of power for a while.
 
weejockmcplop said:
If the worst PM of all time is who they want as leader, clearly they've had enough of power for a while.
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I was reading a book that talked about how the civil service will often give ministers a range of about 5 options, with four of them being absolute insane and then the one the permanent secretary actually wants the minister to take (usually because it's the only really sensible one available).

But with Truss they had to stop it because she would always pick the most bonkers of the insane options they put before her
 
Pope John XXIII said:
I was reading a book that talked about how the civil service will often give ministers a range of about 5 options, with four of them being absolute insane and then the one the permanent secretary actually wants the minister to take (usually because it's the only really sensible one available).

But with Truss they had to stop it because she would always pick the most bonkers of the insane options they put before her
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That's not surprising at all. She has extremely bad judgement.
 
Just caught a bit of 'Last week tonight with John Oliver' on Medicaid, the healthcare poor people get in America.

All I can say is be thankful we have the NHS, however imperfect.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
It wouldnt

It wasn't

Which is true. The end of immigration cooperation and the exposure to many more trade compromises for miniscule benefits has exploded immigration.

Which was entirely predictable. It was predicted in fact. You called it project fear
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Couldn’t disagree more
 
toms said:
Nothing wrong with her. She was absolutely right on tax policy . Lower taxes are key to growth. Everything that happened on inflation and interest rates was coming anyway.
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That last bit is nonsense.

Lower taxes can be a good lever for growth. But they are not universal, and a country needs to be able to afford them and work within planet Earth as it actually is.

The exact same markets she venerated as if they were holy were the ones that destroyed her- because they thought she was an idiot.

If you have low taxes you need either high skills (we don't have these) or to make social decisions to fuck a very, very large number of people and accept them being in abject miserable poverty with short lives- so slightly more people at the top and middle can thrive a bit more.

I have no doubt that's a choice you would either a) make gladly or b) pretend wasn't the case. But this country has no appetite for that kind of thing
 
Pope John XXIII said:
That last bit is nonsense.

Lower taxes can be a good lever for growth. But they are not universal, and a country needs to be able to afford them and work within planet Earth as it actually is.

The exact same markets she venerated as if they were holy were the ones that destroyed her- because they thought she was an idiot.

If you have low taxes you need either high skills (we don't have these) or to make social decisions to fuck a very, very large number of people and accept them being in abject miserable poverty with short lives- so slightly more people at the top and middle can thrive a bit more.

I have no doubt that's a choice you would either a) make gladly or b) pretend wasn't the case. But this country has no appetite for that kind of thing
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This country has no appetite for lower taxes? Oh yes it does. And your choices in the penultimate paragraph are utterly false. If you want people to invest in this country, a low tax regime is vital.

Our manufacturing base is growing rapidly as are our exports. Suggest we substantially reduce immigration and make sure people who can work do work with emphasis on skills training. Jobs they don't want to do, well if you cant do anything else then you have to do them. I would like to continue working into my seventies if physically able too. I might retire from what I'm doing now but I want to contribute in other ways and supplement whatever pension I get. I'll pretty much do anything I can

Brexit can be absolutely stunning if we do it right starting with ridding ourselves of any extreme left wing zealots in the civil service so tied to the EU that they might as well be working for a foreign body. Then we need a government that will pull us out of the ECHR, have an immigration policy based on need, build more affordable homes, make work pay and actually train people for the jobs of tomorrow.

Lower taxes, more investment, upskill/reskill citizens who are legally here and be absolutely thorough on state expenditure

We wont get this with Starmer and Reeve. It'll be bigger state, higher taxes for longer, class warfare towards anyone who has aspired to improve their family's situation, woke on steroids and worst of all pinning ourselves to the apron of the EU with all their regulations, with all the immigration that will come our way.
 
toms said:
This country has no appetite for lower taxes? Oh yes it does. And your choices in the penultimate paragraph are utterly false. If you want people to invest in this country, a low tax regime is vital.
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That wasn't what I said. Every person on the planet wants lower taxes. They also want all the things that you can only have with higher taxes. When it comes to the choices between the two, people of our country consistently want public services more than lower taxes.

toms said:
Our manufacturing base is growing rapidly as are our exports. Suggest we substantially reduce immigration and make sure people who can work do work with emphasis on skills training. Jobs they don't want to do, well if you cant do anything else then you have to do them. I would like to continue working into my seventies if physically able too. I might retire from what I'm doing now but I want to contribute in other ways and supplement whatever pension I get. I'll pretty much do anything I can
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Which manufacturing base is that then?

I thought you were a libertarian, now you are advocating communism?

toms said:
Brexit can be absolutely stunning if we do it right starting with ridding ourselves of any extreme left wing zealots in the civil service so tied to the EU that they might as well be working for a foreign body. Then we need a government that will pull us out of the ECHR, have an immigration policy based on need, build more affordable homes, make work pay and actually train people for the jobs of tomorrow.
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Yes, indeed. It was always going to be the case wasn't it? Brexit was ALWAYS going to be something that would have been stunning if only X, Y and Z had/ had not happened. The excuses were rolling in within weeks.

toms said:
Lower taxes, more investment, upskill/reskill citizens who are legally here and be absolutely thorough on state expenditure
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Ok, what shall we cut?

Shall we start with pensions being cut to fund lower taxes for the young?

Shall we take a property tax off the boomers to pay to reopen the adult colleges your party closed so we can upskill/reskill?

Being absolutely thorough on state expenditure definitely means scrapping that triple lock

toms said:
We wont get this with Starmer and Reeve. It'll be bigger state, higher taxes for longer, class warfare towards anyone who has aspired to improve their family's situation, woke on steroids and worst of all pinning ourselves to the apron of the EU with all their regulations, with all the immigration that will come our way.
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Ok the one hand you have a party in opposition who say, earnestly, that they will try to do more or less everything you've asked for.

On the other hand you have a party that has been in power for 14 years that absolutely hasn't done any of it
 
Pope John XXIII said:
That wasn't what I said. Every person on the planet wants lower taxes. They also want all the things that you can only have with higher taxes. When it comes to the choices between the two, people of our country consistently want public services more than lower taxes.


Which manufacturing base is that then?

I thought you were a libertarian, now you are advocating communism?


Yes, indeed. It was always going to be the case wasn't it? Brexit was ALWAYS going to be something that would have been stunning if only X, Y and Z had/ had not happened. The excuses were rolling in within weeks.


Ok, what shall we cut?

Shall we start with pensions being cut to fund lower taxes for the young?

Shall we take a property tax off the boomers to pay to reopen the adult colleges your party closed so we can upskill/reskill?

Being absolutely thorough on state expenditure definitely means scrapping that triple lock


Ok the one hand you have a party in opposition who say, earnestly, that they will try to do more or less everything you've asked for.

On the other hand you have a party that has been in power for 14 years that absolutely hasn't done any of it
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I could never trust the Labour Party or a pro EU party
 
toms said:
I could never trust the Labour Party or a pro EU party
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Hilarious use of the word ‘trust’ from someone who supports this Government. I would say that they don’t deserve your support but if you can’t see through them now then you don’t deserve any more than you are getting - failure, incompetence and corruption.
 
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