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So you don't lose your job if you're an MP, but if you're not an MP you do lose your job and livelihood . And I'm being ridiculous ! To stand down as an MP you have to go to prison, but to lose your job as an adviser you only have to make a "mistake" (copyright Lisa Nandy) .
You don't seem to understand how even the most basic of politics works or any of the conventions. This argument is so remedial as to be embarrassing.

When you are elected as an MP you are a backbencher. You do not work for the government, even if you are in the same party as the government. Your whip will try to get you to vote the 'right' way, but as a backbencher there is little they can do. Chucking backbenchers out of the party (removing the whip) for defying their party orders on how to vote is completely unprecedented until Johnson (IE Cummings, because Johnson would never have done it off his own instinct) did it late last year. That was considered utterly disgusting politically.

MPs do not lose their seats unless they die or go to prison. The reason for that should hopefully be so obvious as to not need explanation even to you.

When you get promoted, I.E to a permanent under-secretary or a minister of state, you get a pay rise and you now work for the government. That is now your job. You have to represent your constituents as an MP as well (and separately). You are on the government payroll though and any voting against the government line usually requires your resignation *from that job*. Any infraction or impropriety *may* lead them to resign, be sacked or be reshuffled (resignation being the nice way of doing it).

A really good example is Priti Patel. She went on "holiday" to Israel and while there she met with several senior Israeli government figures and effectively conducted her own foreign policy meetings behind the back of her PM and contrary to her brief, which had nothing to do with foreign policy. She did not inform nor get the permission of the cabinet to do this. The PM was so weak at the time she did it the nice way and asked her to resign for her "misjudgement" (we had a different word for this in the cold war- "treason").

The equivalent to Mr Cummings job is not the role of an MP, which is that of an elected official (which Mr Cummings is not). The equivalent is that of an MP who has a government job, having to resign from that government role. The general rule is that the resigning minister spends 18 months - 2 years out in the cold before it becomes ok to bring them back in. I'm sure that would have been the case with Mr Cummings as well.

To my knowledge the only one of the whataboutary examples you have given who has an actual job in the Shadow cabinet (I could be wrong on this) is Stephen Kinnock, who has an extremely minor brief to do with Asia policy. I believe he may not have had that at the time he expressly held his hands up and apologised for his actions though. The others, as far as I am aware, do not have a job to resign from and have not actually broken the ministerial or MPs codes of conduct either. Neither of which apply to Mr Cummings who has never stood for public office.

Why do you feel the need to defend this guy LK?

He isn't a member of the Tory party. He has really undue influence; he is effectively running the government as an unelected SPAD and that can't be right.

Apart from your simplistic, tribal instincts why defend him and argue black is white? If this were anyone outside of the Tory circle you would agree that their actions were wrong (let's face it; you reckon Kinnock should for sitting 2m from his dad on his birthday, and maybe he should resign from his tiny Asia brief for that).

Aren't you embarrassed to be defending this absolutely bullshit story for no real reason? Even the Daily Mail and nearly 20% of MPs in the Conservative Party openly say he was wrong.
 
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We should have learned our lessons from Campbell, Mandelson, et al.
Unless you were happy with those un-elected officials running our country?
There is absolutely no comparison between Blair and Johnson.

Blair was in charge and absolutely had his own ideas and agenda. You cannot attribute either to Mr Johnson, especially after that embarrassment yesterday

Advisors advise, ministers decide. But Cummings is allowed to do both.

And interestingly, both Campbell and McBride have been emphatic that any advisor in Blair or Brown's government would have been gone within the hour. George Osborne has said the same of Cameron's government.

This government is trying to copy Trump and his tactics. That should absolutely horrify any citizen of this nation. Unless you like the idea of an administration built on cruelty and Malice?
 
There is absolutely no comparison between Blair and Johnson.

Blair was in charge and absolutely had his own ideas and agenda. You cannot attribute either to Mr Johnson, especially after that embarrassment yesterday

Advisors advise, ministers decide. But Cummings is allowed to do both.

And interestingly, both Campbell and McBride have been emphatic that any advisor in Blair or Brown's government would have been gone within the hour. George Osborne has said the same of Cameron's government.

This government is trying to copy Trump and his tactics. That should absolutely horrify any citizen of this nation. Unless you like the idea of an administration built on cruelty and Malice?


Oh Blair was in charge and had his own ideas and agenda

Like helping to kill millions of innocent brown babies in Arab countries

Just like those other European countries that did it too

Oh wait
 
The bbc never apologised to Labour. All the lies since 2010. The way they treated Brown, Ed & Corbyn.
All the bullshit they reported.
I wonder why?

Why don't you post some specific examples with references and I can address your point...I'm not making comment on vague allegations.
 
I do not see too much wrong with what Maitlis said; her words reflected the situation then as it does now.

The BBC actually complained not so much about what she said but about what she did not say, the omission, apparently, made the opening statement look like a personal view.

No doubt Oliver Dowden could not get on the phone quick enough to complain.

If John Humphries or Andrew Neil had used those words there would have been no rebuke.

There would have been nothing said because both would have met the allegations head on and justified their remarks; and lets face it, in that instance the justification would not have been too difficult.

Could you imagine the response if Paxman had still been on Newsnight?

I can still vividly remember the time he held Michael Howard to account; of course, that would not happen today because the Politicians do not have the balls to appear in public anymore.

Paxman was largely interested in Paxman...

Context though of when it's used, in an interview there is back and forth and an alternate narrative is allowed. Here was a personal opinion presented as fact without the right to reply.

Do I believe she's correct? Absolutely.

Do I believe BBC News should be driven by presenting facts without bias and personal opinion? Absolutely.
 
Point of order!

Mandelson was elected to parliament in 1992.

He beat Angus the Monkey in resounding fashion for the Hartlepool seat.

I remember Mandy electioneering prior to the vote; he walked into a Fish and Chip shop in Hartlepool and ordered some Fish and Chips, on seeing the vat of mushy peas he asked for some of the avocado dip as well.

At least they didn't hang this one...
 
Oh Blair was in charge and had his own ideas and agenda

Like helping to kill millions of innocent brown babies in Arab countries

Just like those other European countries that did it too

Oh wait
That has absolutely no relevance to the point in hand, even if I were to accept it as accurate.
 
That has absolutely no relevance to the point in hand, even if I were to accept it as accurate.

He was his own man you say so why did he help exterminate brown babies in the middle east

Was it at the behest of the Americans or was it because he was a cold calculated mass murderer of children

Literally millions dead and maimed because of him or was it because of the Americans
 
There is absolutely no comparison between Blair and Johnson.

Blair was in charge and absolutely had his own ideas and agenda. You cannot attribute either to Mr Johnson, especially after that embarrassment yesterday

Advisors advise, ministers decide. But Cummings is allowed to do both.

And interestingly, both Campbell and McBride have been emphatic that any advisor in Blair or Brown's government would have been gone within the hour. George Osborne has said the same of Cameron's government.

This government is trying to copy Trump and his tactics. That should absolutely horrify any citizen of this nation. Unless you like the idea of an administration built on cruelty and Malice?

I wasn't comparing the competency (lack of) with the PMs advisers, merely they have both had them and have been, sometimes controversial.
 
He was his own man you say so why did he help exterminate brown babies in the middle east

Was it at the behest of the Americans or was it because he was a cold calculated mass murderer of children

Literally millions dead and maimed because of him or was it because of the Americans
If I discussed this with you, you would have a full on meltdown and nothing would be achieved. I shall spare you the emotional turmoil and the forum your attention seeking.
 
Corbyn didn't change & that's one of the reasons he didn't win a general election.
Imagine Corbyn addressing the nation with un-brushed hair & being a bumbling clown.

So you are saying that all the times Corbyn voted against the EU expansion, spoke against the capitalist agenda, and wanted to leave, he was not being truthful?
 
Paxman was largely interested in Paxman...

Context though of when it's used, in an interview there is back and forth and an alternate narrative is allowed. Here was a personal opinion presented as fact without the right to reply.

Do I believe she's correct? Absolutely.

Do I believe BBC News should be driven by presenting facts without bias and personal opinion? Absolutely.
They did have the right to reply. They were invited on, as always. They declined the offer, as always.
 
I wasn't comparing the competency (lack of) with the PMs advisers, merely they have both had them and have been, sometimes controversial.
But the convention of what happens when the screw up publicly is there. And has now been shattered. For all parties, not just this pound shop trump government.
 
But the convention of what happens when the screw up publicly is there. And has now been shattered. For all parties, not just this pound shop trump government.

I think politicians are past convention. These kind of conventions are mostly there for public image purposes, or to help future politicians, and since Trump none of that shit matters anymore, when you have tribal followings so sycophantic that the most blatant of wrongs are defended so long as there's LITERALLY ANY excuse for it.
 
Paxman was largely interested in Paxman...

Context though of when it's used, in an interview there is back and forth and an alternate narrative is allowed. Here was a personal opinion presented as fact without the right to reply.

Do I believe she's correct? Absolutely.

Do I believe BBC News should be driven by presenting facts without bias and personal opinion? Absolutely.

What are they supposed to do when the perpetrators refuse to appear on programmes like Newsnight and be held to account?

Speaking truth to power should not be reliant on the whim of Politicians.

Refusing to provide a spokesperson should not prevent the scrutiny from taking place; if that scrutiny then appears to be one sided, they only have themselves to blame.

Maitlis should not be deterred by what happened; she is a very talented Journalist.