12 point appeal | Page 22 | Vital Football

12 point appeal

ZAKKY said:
"However, your post seemed a sarcastic one"

There was nothing sarcastic about it only in your mind, we all know about the QC, but I was showing what top qualifications this woman has.
It really does annoy me the amount of times you needlessly chirp in at peoples comments.
OH and the big guns were the whole team
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Well given that you didn't clarify why you thought she was the "big guns", yes, it quite easily came across as sarcastic. .................. especially when fraud wasn't meant to be part of the defence.

"Chirp in at people's comments" ! It's a forum. FFS. It's what we're supposed to do. I'm amazed that you're so touchy about it. My response wasn't offensive in any way.

If you meant the big guns were the whole team, then maybe you should have said as much.
 
moonay said:
Well given that you didn't clarify why you thought she was the "big guns", yes, it quite easily came across as sarcastic. .................. especially when fraud wasn't meant to be part of the defence.

"Chirp in at people's comments" ! It's a forum. FFS. It's what we're supposed to do. I'm amazed that you're so touchy about it. My response wasn't offensive in any way.

If you meant the big guns were the whole team, then maybe you should have said as much.
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If you can't comprehend what I wrote that's your problem.
Its not your place to tell me what I should or should not be writing stop being so pompus
 
ZAKKY said:
If you can't comprehend what I wrote that's your problem.
Its not your place to tell me what I should or should not be writing stop being so pompus
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Yes Sir ............................ the cap fits perfectly.
:tophat:


PS: It's "pompous".
;)


PPS: Lighten up man.
 
Nottingham said:
The key question is the extent to which we gained an unfair advantage by having access to additional funds to buy better players than say, Barnsley could afford. Would we have finished as high in the league without those funds?
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That is totally irrelevant, the EFL rules on financial fair play says member clubs can lose a certain amount of money, more if the owners have enough wealth to cover any losses, WAFC have not broken those rules in any way.

As for Barnsley their case rests on the fact that the playing field is not level and we had an advantage because we were spending beyond our means, that opinion should not hold water as any loses we had were supposed to be underwritten by the clubs owner agreed at the beginning of the season.

The ironic thing though and something that should be pointed out in court as a rebuttal to their so called evidence is they announced losses of c.3.5 million up to April 2019 yet are able to offer £1 million pounds for a player in the past week or so, are they saying it is ok for them to lose money and buy beyond their means, yet clubs operating within the FFP rules are not allowed to buy players because they lost/spent more money.
 
Just reading their message board they cannot get through their thick skulls that we have not bought PLAYERS off them that weakened them , we bought Moore, Morsey was our player on loan with them, they were given the opportunity to buy him at a bargain price and chose not to, another mentioned is Williams who was on load from Everton and had loan deals elsewhere before coming to us.

Another claim is we purchased players without funds, let me correct this Moore and Lowe were purchased with the sale of Will Grigg to Sunderland, we also had a further £7 million from the sale of Dan Burn, some younger lads and fringe players and the final payment from the Yanic Wildschut money from Norwich.
 
Nottingham said:
The key question is the extent to which we gained an unfair advantage by having access to additional funds to buy better players than say, Barnsley could afford. Would we have finished as high in the league without those funds?
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No one in this league runs at a profit. I’m not sure how you can quantify that answer anyway. Effectively we bought assets that we developed and would or could have sold at a large profit.
 
ZAKKY said:
If you can't comprehend what I wrote that's your problem.
Its not your place to tell me what I should or should not be writing stop being so pompus
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Sarcasm doesn't really work through text at times. So people can read things in a different tone than they meant. Probably a minor mistake on his end to assume it was sarcastic tbh
 
Hi. Barnsley Fan here. I think personally we are both wanting the best for our respective clubs. As a fan I do sympathise with the Wigan fans you have had a super 2nd half of the season. looking from the outside and not an expert your new owners seem to have jumped in the deep end and stuggled with financial and political climate. Covid is unheralded in the modern era.

From our side we have been up and down in form all season and the last games we were superb. should of beaten Luton and Leeds. the last 2 games were remarkable for a team bottom and pressure on.

I get that the 12 points is mandatory for entering administration and i think has been for about 15 years. I really have no idea wat will happen in the appeal. one of us will lose out and it is a shame for both clubs the way the efl have taken forever to make decisions, particularly with Derby ans Sheff Wed on financial matters. I respect our fans and yours and hope in the future we can move on and get the respect back for one and other.
 
Wonder when it ends ?... bet the greedy bastards are still in the boozer on their " working lunch ".

I/2 million my feckin arse.
 
exiled tic said:
Jock I have to say it is a strange feeling being at the course with million pounds worth of horses running in front of empty stands with the commentary blaring away!! 5,000 people allowed in on Saturday so could be interesting, as for me, thee and Battaash I think he may just pip us!! 😃
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Think you'd be right with us getting pipped at the post, hopefully unlike our appeal which wins by 2 or 3 lengths. Yep heard there was 5K allowed in at Goodwood ( members/ O&T's / some public) but wondering if it'll go ahead after Boris's announcement??? Any racing tips for me to lose more money on?? Good luck to Battaash
 
Snake Pliskin said:
Hi. Barnsley Fan here. I think personally we are both wanting the best for our respective clubs. As a fan I do sympathise with the Wigan fans you have had a super 2nd half of the season. looking from the outside and not an expert your new owners seem to have jumped in the deep end and stuggled with financial and political climate. Covid is unheralded in the modern era.

From our side we have been up and down in form all season and the last games we were superb. should of beaten Luton and Leeds. the last 2 games were remarkable for a team bottom and pressure on.

I get that the 12 points is mandatory for entering administration and i think has been for about 15 years. I really have no idea wat will happen in the appeal. one of us will lose out and it is a shame for both clubs the way the efl have taken forever to make decisions, particularly with Derby ans Sheff Wed on financial matters. I respect our fans and yours and hope in the future we can move on and get the respect back for one and other.
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Thanks for taking the time to come on here and make your point, one that I for one see. However the problem is that a lot of vitriolic abuse has been written by Barnsley fans, who incidentally have no idea what our circumstances are, on your fan web sites.

We have always been a club that has respected other clubs and the rules of the EFL and have always worked within our means. The crux of the problem we are experiencing is that the EFL allowed the sale of our club from one crooked owner to another. At the time of our administration being announced we had no excessive debts, no missed payments and were looking forward to next season as a Championship club. The crook that took over the club then refused to pay over a six million pound payment he had told the EFL he would make and plunged us into Admin.

To sum up we have no excessive debts and have not been run outside the rules laid down by the EFL. We had no problem staying within the bounds of FFP and in fact would probably have ended the season breaking even had we been allowed to continue and then sell off one or two players. We have not gained advantage from Directors ploughing money in and in fact had more points than you finished on prior to the administration commencing. Since the turn of the year we have had one loan player come into the first team on a regular basis and have not spent millions bringing in players to boost our form.

Unfortunately some of your compatriots are spewing vile comments out and insinuating that we are cheats. Just imagine what would happen to your club if your owner decided to take his cheque book home and walk away. I seriously doubt that you would be happy to see other "supposed" football fans ridiculing you for something that the club could do nothing about.

Once again thank you for coming on here and giving us your take. May I suggest that you take my comments back to your forum and educate those on there that are totally out of order with their obnoxious views.

I sincerely hope that if we manage the impossible and get the unfair deduction overturned that your fanbase will understand, however having seen some of the comments directed at us recently, I seriously doubt that happening.
 
Snake Pliskin said:
Hi. Barnsley Fan here. I think personally we are both wanting the best for our respective clubs. As a fan I do sympathise with the Wigan fans you have had a super 2nd half of the season. looking from the outside and not an expert your new owners seem to have jumped in the deep end and stuggled with financial and political climate. Covid is unheralded in the modern era.

From our side we have been up and down in form all season and the last games we were superb. should of beaten Luton and Leeds. the last 2 games were remarkable for a team bottom and pressure on.

I get that the 12 points is mandatory for entering administration and i think has been for about 15 years. I really have no idea wat will happen in the appeal. one of us will lose out and it is a shame for both clubs the way the efl have taken forever to make decisions, particularly with Derby ans Sheff Wed on financial matters. I respect our fans and yours and hope in the future we can move on and get the respect back for one and other.
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It's a lot more complicated than our owners making a mistake or getting in over their heads or Covid - the new owner tried to liquidate us on his first day in control. This has been a deliberate attempt to damage the club, something very sinister has happened behind the scenes.

The punishment for admin is meant to be to stop teams gaining an advantage by spending money they don't have or avoiding paying creditors. We gained absolutely no advantage and had no outstanding debts to anyone other than our owner at the time, much of which was effectively debts transfered onto us to cover the cost of buying the club. We had 2.5m in EFL money due the following week and wages were only 1m, we could've easily got to the summer and sold the club and made the new owners more money but they insisted they had to dispose of us immedietely regardless of if it would cost them up to 75% of their initial outlay. This wasnt about minimising loses they just seemed to want to get rid of the club for no reason.

The EFL are effectively trying to lock us up for murder when we actually committed suicide. This has distroyed our infrastcuture, youth system, we've lost millions in future players sales, the manager is quitting, all the first team will leave etc. We've suffered enough at the hands of dodgy owners who the EFL failed to vet correctly and now they want to make they want to punish us for crimes we didn't commit.
 
Snake Pliskin said:
Hi. Barnsley Fan here. I think personally we are both wanting the best for our respective clubs. As a fan I do sympathise with the Wigan fans you have had a super 2nd half of the season. looking from the outside and not an expert your new owners seem to have jumped in the deep end and stuggled with financial and political climate. Covid is unheralded in the modern era.

From our side we have been up and down in form all season and the last games we were superb. should of beaten Luton and Leeds. the last 2 games were remarkable for a team bottom and pressure on.

I get that the 12 points is mandatory for entering administration and i think has been for about 15 years. I really have no idea wat will happen in the appeal. one of us will lose out and it is a shame for both clubs the way the efl have taken forever to make decisions, particularly with Derby ans Sheff Wed on financial matters. I respect our fans and yours and hope in the future we can move on and get the respect back for one and other.
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Fair play. I think it would/will be cruel to whichever club doesn't get a favourable outcome in the appeal. The bottom line is some guy who lives on the other side of the planet pulled a fast one and this is the result. There has to be a full investigation by the EFL and changes need to be made otherwise these crooks will continue to get the green light and ruin clubs. I understand the argument that making it harder to buy a club could be detrimental to the league and clubs but there has to be a line.

I floated the idea of a bond that the new owners have to pay into which is then secured by the governing body (EFL, Premier League). This bond will cover the cost of all creditors for a limited period of time and in the event that the club goes into administration the bond is released to the admins. If the buyer sells the club the bond will be refunded in full once the new owners have secured their bond with the relevant governing body.
 
Snake Pliskin said:
Hi. Barnsley Fan here. I think personally we are both wanting the best for our respective clubs. As a fan I do sympathise with the Wigan fans you have had a super 2nd half of the season. looking from the outside and not an expert your new owners seem to have jumped in the deep end and stuggled with financial and political climate. Covid is unheralded in the modern era.

From our side we have been up and down in form all season and the last games we were superb. should of beaten Luton and Leeds. the last 2 games were remarkable for a team bottom and pressure on.

I get that the 12 points is mandatory for entering administration and i think has been for about 15 years. I really have no idea wat will happen in the appeal. one of us will lose out and it is a shame for both clubs the way the efl have taken forever to make decisions, particularly with Derby ans Sheff Wed on financial matters. I respect our fans and yours and hope in the future we can move on and get the respect back for one and other.
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The bottom line is that you have been in the relegation zone since September and never left it. In fact you failed to amass more points than we did before a patsy tried to liquidate us on the day he took ownership. I fail to see why you believe you deserve to stay up - personally having witnessed us be relegated three times in the last 7 years I’ve always been pragmatic about it and accepted we weren’t good enough, instead of seeking to blame other clubs. A little humility is sometimes is a good thing.
 
To be honest, it's the very least he could do.

It'll be interesting to see if there is anything that's been found which could be acted on by the Fraud Squad, or whoever. You never know, we might be going after suing them after this is over.
 
I have a feeling that Stanley Choi shafted Au Yeung. Why would anyone buy a club in the middle of pandemic? I feel Stanley wanted to rid himself of the club with little financial impact and used Au Yeung as the fall guy.
 
jocklatic said:
Think you'd be right with us getting pipped at the post, hopefully unlike our appeal which wins by 2 or 3 lengths. Yep heard there was 5K allowed in at Goodwood ( members/ O&T's / some public) but wondering if it'll go ahead after Boris's announcement??? Any racing tips for me to lose more money on?? Good luck to Battaash
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No crowds tomorrow now jock,late cancellation by Boris!Battaash did his bit today and broke the course record,a good day for us with two winners and a third!Hope our QC had a good day as well!!
 
moonay said:
To be honest, it's the very least he could do.

It'll be interesting to see if there is anything that's been found which could be acted on by the Fraud Squad, or whoever. You never know, we might be going after suing them after this is over.
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I very much doubt he incriminated himself or that other **** and was undoubtedly coached beforehand and had a legal representative on that call. Given we’ve used his testimony in our appeal suggests to me it was an effort to ensure we don’t get relegated and thus mitigate the burning desire to pursue this further. I’ve no evidence of that but given he tried liquidating us on the day he took over I suspect it’s damage limitation time for these ***** if they are being seen to help us now.
 
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