What Are The Options Going Forward

[steveperryman]

Steve, there's a whole lot more wrong than signing a CB will solve.

As bad as some of our defending was, why is that Newcastle were able to attack us with gay abandon? They had 22 shots. This was Newcastle FFS. They shouldn't have been given a sniff of our goal.

We should have been dominating the game and playing largely in their half. We had 11 shots.

You say we have a pool of talent that others can only dream of. And I totally agree. But why are we only seeing glimpses of it? With the quality we had on the pitch yesterday Newcastle should have been chasing shadows.

Jose and this squad are not the right fit for each other.

I'd rather we prioritise key positions so i view the need for a CB as paramount. The rest can follow but that should be the key towards our progression. The younger lads need an experienced bod to lead the line & keep them in check, it would make a world of difference.

The signing would also allow the likes of Ndombele to play a more advanced role which would also allow Harry to play around the box. As good as he is dropping deep i'd prefer him in & around the opp's box more often.

Another attacking mid would be helpful, i'm not averse to a more attacking shape if we have the personnel in place to do it.

 

[xvausch]

I'd rather we prioritise key positions so i view the need for a CB as paramount. The rest can follow but that should be the key towards our progression. The younger lads need an experienced bod to lead the line & keep them in check, it would make a world of difference.

The signing would also allow the likes of Ndombele to play a more advanced role which would also allow Harry to play around the box. As good as he is dropping deep i'd prefer him in & around the opp's box more often.

Another attacking mid would be helpful, i'm not averse to a more attacking shape if we have the personnel in place to do it.

Question(s)....

If you could choose any two CB's currently playing, anywhere in the world, cost is no issue, who would you choose to be the ultimate Spurs backline core?

And then, do you honestly think, that pairing would do markedly better while executing the exact same tactical gameplans we have seen from Jose this season?

If so, you're essentially chalking the droppin of 17 pts from winning positions this season, primarily upon individual player errors. Am I understanding you correctly on this?

.

 

[muttley]

The challenge with centre-halves is that there is currently a golden generation in the twilight of their career - Pique, Ramos, Bonucci, Chielini, Godin, SIlva, Vertonghen, Hummels, Boateng etc.

There are less great centre-halves following them and guys like Upamecano, De Ligt, Dias etc are heavily sought after. Even Fofana goes for £30m at 19 years of age. Once you factor in the dearth of left footers, then it appears even more of a challenge to replace Vertonghen.

I'm not sure where that leaves Spurs. We clearly were after Skriniar but we now know that Inter are clearing debts and balancing the books. Would anyone be surprised if we're back in for him?

The team that wins the league has Dias, Stones, Laporte and Ake. How do we compete with that?

 

[steveperryman]

Question(s)....

If you could choose any two CB's currently playing, anywhere in the world, cost is no issue, who would you choose to be the ultimate Spurs backline core?

And then, do you honestly think, that pairing would do markedly better while executing the exact same tactical gameplans we have seen from Jose this season?

If so, you're essentially chalking the droppin of 17 pts from winning positions this season, primarily upon individual player errors. Am I understanding you correctly on this?

.

That's a rather silly question considering we won't be able to buy either of them. We brought in Doherty for crying out loud.

What i do see is a coach playing far too negatively because of our back line. So in answer to your question i don't believe we'd need to play as deep with a more experienced CB pairing. Why would we with all our attacking talent?

It's quite something for a team to chuck away a 3 goal lead, to do it in under 7 minutes... well that's something else lol. That's why i believe Jose has turned himself into The Tinkerman. He doesn't trust them. I wonder why.

I'm not a Jose fan by any means. Yes he plays a negative brand of football that many dislike but you can't tell me that our rear guard is good enough when they've been haemorrhaging goals for the best part of a year & a half.

 

[Gary Onedaysoon]

That's a rather silly question considering we won't be able to buy either of them. We brought in Doherty for crying out loud.

What i do see is a coach playing far too negatively because of our back line. So in answer to your question i don't believe we'd need to play as deep with a more experienced CB pairing. Why would we with all our attacking talent?

It's quite something for a team to chuck away a 3 goal lead, to do it in under 7 minutes... well that's something else lol. That's why i believe Jose has turned himself into The Tinkerman. He doesn't trust them. I wonder why.

I'm not a Jose fan by any means. Yes he plays a negative brand of football that many dislike but you can't tell me that our rear guard is good enough when they've been haemorrhaging goals for the best part of a year & a half.

Jose spent £50m on three defenders - Reggie, Rodon and Doherty. That's far more money then the majority of PL managers had.

Where's the improvement in our defence collectively? Where's the improvement in any of our defenders individually?

He's the joint second best paid manager in the Premier League. What exactly are we paying him for? I wouldn't give him another penny unless he can demonstrate, as a minimum, that he can improve the players he has got.

If his argument is that he can only get results with the very best players he should do the decent thing and walk right now.

 

[Departed]

Jose spent £50m on three defenders - Reggie, Rodon and Doherty. That's far more money then the majority of PL managers had.

Where's the improvement in our defence collectively? Where's the improvement in any of our defenders individually?

He's the joint second best paid manager in the Premier League. What exactly are we paying him for? I wouldn't give him another penny unless he can demonstrate, as a minimum, that he can improve the players he has got.

If his argument is that he can only get results with the very best players he should do the decent thing and walk right now.

We are going to end up disliking him intensely and he will belittle Tottenham for the rest of his life or he will turn this around. Not much middle ground here.

 

[steveperryman]

Whilst Reggie has turned out to be a great addition to the squad, we needed a CB. Rodon is nowhere near the finished article & i'm pretty certain he wasn't high on Jose's list of demands. He's the type of player you sign when you have a settled back 4 & you want to take a gamble. It may yet pay off but it'll take time... time Jose doesn't have.

His constant tinkering with the back line reeks of desperation. He reminds me of The Tinkerman shortly before his dismissal at Leicester. That being said it's easy to understand why. You cannot tell me in all honesty that our back line is good enough to compete at the highest level. The proof over the last couple of years would tell you otherwise.

Should Jose be doing better? That's only a question that Levy can answer & we may well get that answer soon enough.

 

[xvausch]

That's a rather silly question considering we won't be able to buy either of them. We brought in Doherty for crying out loud.

What i do see is a coach playing far too negatively because of our back line. So in answer to your question i don't believe we'd need to play as deep with a more experienced CB pairing. Why would we with all our attacking talent?

It's quite something for a team to chuck away a 3 goal lead, to do it in under 7 minutes... well that's something else lol. That's why i believe Jose has turned himself into The Tinkerman. He doesn't trust them. I wonder why.

I'm not a Jose fan by any means. Yes he plays a negative brand of football that many dislike but you can't tell me that our rear guard is good enough when they've been haemorrhaging goals for the best part of a year & a half.

I didnt suggest it was a realistic question, or course it isnt. Its an exercise.

Why dont you go back and give my original post another shot.

.

 

[steveperryman]

I didnt suggest it was a realistic question, or course it isnt. Its an exercise.

Why dont you go back and give my original post another shot.

.

You seem to suggest that our rear guard is good enough or am i way off the mark?

Regarding Jose, he should be doing better & he's certainly made mistakes but to suggest that it's all on him is the height of naivety on your part.

 

[xvausch]

You seem to suggest that our rear guard is good enough or am i way off the mark?

Regarding Jose, he should be doing better & he's certainly made mistakes but to suggest that it's all on him is the height of naivety on your part.

Good enough? How in the world could you possibly know? Certainly not based upon the results on the pitch of late, if you agree that the world's very best would also struggle to succeed in this "philosophy".

I'm being naïve? Cool. Not sure at all that I am tho. Pretty pragmatic actually.

I'm not the one turning 180degrees on the players in the course of less than a year, when they've been given a shit source product to try and do something with.

It's ALL on Jose. until he's not there anymore. He's made it so, himself, no one else, and he's gotta lie in his own pig shit now.

Holding players responsible for THAT, is what I'd call pretty naïve actually.

.

 

[Nick Real Deal]

As a coach, if your defence is not up to it, what formation and tactics do you use ?
I know there is more than one option but what is most likely to produce the best results with the players we have ?

 

[steveperryman]

Good enough? How in the world could you possibly know? Certainly not based upon the results on the pitch of late, if you agree that the world's very best would also struggle to succeed in this "philosophy".

I'm being naïve? Cool. Not sure at all that I am tho. Pretty pragmatic actually.

I'm not the one turning 180degrees on the players in the course of less than a year, when they've been given a shit source product to try and do something with.

It's ALL on Jose. until he's not there anymore. He's made it so, himself, no one else, and he's gotta lie in his own pig shit now.

Holding players responsible for THAT, is what I'd call pretty naïve actually.

.

The results on the pitch over the last 2 years would suggest that they're not good enough. The same players may i add who were haemorrhaging goals for fun under Pochettino. Don't take my word for it. Nearly every top coach & pundit has lambasted them over that period. Don't you remember Dumb & Dumber?

 

[xvausch]

The results on the pitch over the last 2 years would suggest that they're not good enough. The same players may i add who were haemorrhaging goals for fun under Pochettino. Don't take my word for it. Nearly every top coach & pundit has lambasted them over that period. Don't you remember Dumb & Dumber?

Ok, fine, so you want to continue to try an apply a fair eval on a totally unsettled squad. You're gonna be throwing up dueces at reality every time doing that.

I may add, that Spurs were the #1 defense in the league under Poch (More than one time even maybe!). And at one point well into this season even, pretty sure we had let in the least goals in the Prem. So to suggest the players aint got it in 'em, or that they've always been unmitigated failures under Poch (Wherever this FakeNews type meme came from...) well that Sir is total hogwash.

Replace the Cancer, let the players play. We WILL will matches.

Why you insist on the most difficult road to success is odd.


.

 

[USAFSPURS]

I have a bad feeling this is going to get worse before it gets better. And unfortunately it needs to I think. We need a rebuild

 

[Real Deal]

As a coach, if your defence is not up to it, what formation and tactics do you use ?
I know there is more than one option but what is most likely to produce the best results with the players we have ?

The amount of individual mistakes we make at the back suggests a few things.

1. They are not good enough.
2. Poor coaching.
3. Players are low in confidence and playing with fear.

Sanchez was never this bad under Poch so the latter 2 options are certainly playing there part.

Tang, Sess, Ŕodon, hopefully Reggie possibly Sanchez are part of the team growing over the next 5 years. Obviously additions are needed.

Aurier, Doherty, Toby, Rose and Davies can all go. Not the level required.

 

[Spursex]

That's a rather silly question considering we won't be able to buy either of them. We brought in Doherty for crying out loud.

What i do see is a coach playing far too negatively because of our back line. So in answer to your question i don't believe we'd need to play as deep with a more experienced CB pairing. Why would we with all our attacking talent?

It's quite something for a team to chuck away a 3 goal lead, to do it in under 7 minutes... well that's something else lol. That's why i believe Jose has turned himself into The Tinkerman. He doesn't trust them. I wonder why.

I'm not a Jose fan by any means. Yes he plays a negative brand of football that many dislike but you can't tell me that our rear guard is good enough when they've been haemorrhaging goals for the best part of a year & a half.

haemorrhaging goals ?

Only city (winning then league by a mile, with 21 against) and Chelsea have given away less than us (30), that's not exactly 'haemorrhaging goals' (us 32) is it ?

The issue is the goals we have given away from winning positions, the points this has cost us and the reasons why this has happened i.e. individual errors caused by poor tactical game management and / or both.

What goes on post and pre-games is as critical as what goes on during games.

 

[Spursex]

As a coach, if your defence is not up to it, what formation and tactics do you use ?
I know there is more than one option but what is most likely to produce the best results with the players we have ?

Our players/defence is easily good enough for a top 4 team, but our pattern of play, lack of game management causes us unnecessary tend towards panicking - that's a coaching issue; individuals who have all the basic skills simply needed to be drilled and drilled and have a management team that demonstrates absolute confidence in them - and doesn't use them as media fodder.

 

[Pompey Yid]

Talent without desire is not worth the paper its written on

Agree there Greavsie, but the desire to work with a twat, that is the same story worldwide, is why we are as we are.

 

[Pompey Yid]

As an ex-CH turned CD, for me no matter how good you are, if your boss wants you to play "park the bus" "invite em on football" it will in the end drive you mad, thus more mistakes, continuously looking over your shoulder, look a whole lot more foolish, final result...you the good defender starts to look total shite, then why did we buy him etc.
This type of football, pressure on defenders, today is wide open for mistakes, worldies scored, bad luck etc.

I am not saying our defense is good but continuous pressure is going to tell in the end, plus smash any confidence you might have once had.

 

[muttley]

Number of minutes played in the Prem.....

Dier 1890
Toby 1611
Sanchez 1397
Rodon 551

Reggie 1555
Davies 1340

Aurier 1159
Doherty 1142
Tanganga 316

Centre half - Jose spent too much time playing a deep defence around Toby and Dier to the detriment of the team setup. A lot of it had Hojbjerg and Sissoko sitting in front before the new year. Dier then started to make individual errors so Jose shifted Toby over to the left and put Sanchez back in. Rodon wasn't named in the UEFA squad and has had to deal with Jose's biases to older players.

Left back - duties shared between the 2 LB's. Problem is that their styles are so different that it changes us tactically each time. Davies has had a poor season compared to his performances in the past. Reggie started the season better than he is finishing it.

Right back - duties shared equally between Aurier and Doherty who have both had poor seasons. Aurier has at least shown that he can put in a few good performances. Doherty has been a complete non-entity. Tanganga had early-season injuries, but should now be given a chance to grow into the role. We all know he won't be.