West brom Match thread | Page 23 | Vital Football

West brom Match thread

Our Kids Dad said:
Exactly, I'm not convinced by Semedo & would much rather we gave Carvalho game time.


What wasn't a penalty - the handball?

I thought it was, he appeared to move his hand towards the ball - most of the pundits agreed too.

I wasn't sure why their 3rd was disallowed either, although I was more disappointed that we couldn't manage the game & conceded a daft free kick in the first place.
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If Bartley laying across the goal line in an offside position isn't interfering with play then I don't know what interfering with play looks like
 
pebble said:
Really don't get the hate for Walker.

Showed plenty of desire to bomb down the pitch and get the second v Leeds.

SL made too many changes v Charlton, but Walker had a great near post flick which just went wide and another first time shot straight at the keeper. Grabban has done no better lately.

Came on for the last 10 minutes v WBA and we equalised. Not sure if he was involved in the move.

Lazy? Or told to stay up the pitch. Can't score if he gets no service. Sky said of Grabban at HT v WBA that he had fewer touches than anyone else but had no service.

Get off the lad's back and he might just reward you.
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It’s not hate at all. There’s not a player at the club I want to see succeed more. Unfortunately he just ambles around, not getting involved and certainly not chasing down opposing defenders.

Grabban has fed off scraps all season but his work rate is far higher and he chases pretty much everything.

Walker should be chomping at the bit over this chance but he looks disinterested.
 
seasider red said:
When there is a discussion about talent v effort / work my mind always goes back to Jason Lee, no one could argue that he was the most talented centre forward we've ever had, but my word did he make up for it in the effort he put, and consequently most fans accepted the lack of talent because they could see that he was at least trying to make the best of that talent that he did have through sheer physical effort, and he had the disadvantage of direct comparison with SVC, but still the fans on the whole accepted him for what he was.
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The point I was trying to make and maybe didn't make clear is that most people simply want to see Tyler make the best of the talents he has and not let them go to waste or be unrecognised through any apparent lack of effort. It's in his own hands
 
Pope John XXIII said:
If Bartley laying across the goal line in an offside position isn't interfering with play then I don't know what interfering with play looks like
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Figgy was there too, very fine margins over the point at which either player was 'in play' at the point of contact.

Clearly, I'm ecstatic that it was disallowed, but as stated - the most disappointing aspect was that we actually squandered possession and gave away a free kick in such a dangerous position.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
As I was saying, it isn't fair to compare a striker's workrate to those of a defender, a defensive midfielder or a winger.

All three positions are much more in the centre of the action. All of them are in positions where the player is going to receive, and consequently have to make, far more passes per game than a striker.

There is simply no comparison. How on earth could Worrall ever look lazy? Just because of what the opposition do, he is always going to be busy. That is especially so if his own team don't do their jobs properly.

If the opposition do their jobs well and forest don't, a striker will look lazy because they aren't getting any action. Grabban has been accused of it as well. Just about every striker is when things aren't going well.

The alternative is to leave your position and go seek the ball out just to get some touches. But the problem is you end up like Harris, Cox or Brereton; you are seen as hard working but you are never in a position to score and your scoring rate is crap; criticism comes your way for that instead. You could argue that all three of those players were ruined (as forest players at least) by trying to 'put themselves about' rather than sticking to their core instincts to try to be in the right place and being open to criticism if a rare chance never comes or is fluffed.
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Not sure you can put it down to his position. McGugan, Centre mid - lazy. Abdoun, winger - lazy.
Greg Halford - everywhere and for me lazy.

the thing is pope, it’s not about running around like a headless chicken, particularly if the way he’s played when he’s come on works. However against Charlton and in his cameos, he’s been non existent. Did you not feel for Lolley in the Charlton game? Literally ran 30 yards to get to the edge of their box and Walker is just stood behind two players offering no outlet.

youre right, as a Centre half, worrall will be immune, but he’s also performing brilliantly, as a defender come under the most scrutiny other than a keeper, and walker knows that strikers automatically have to work harder than a Centre half - that’s the consequence for not having to stick your head to everything or block a ball with your bollocks.

As for the other positions - are you telling me that joe Lolley the winger doesn’t have to work as hard as Walker does as a striker? Lolley is here there and everywhere for 90, so not sure how he or cash whose up and down all game can hide and walker can’t.

and just to be absolutely clear, I’m not suggesting that Tyler walker Needs to come on run around aimlessly so fans go ‘oh wow good effort’. There’s a happy medium where you use your energy to close defenders down and stretch them. I just haven’t seen that once in his albeit short time with us. For me, somebody not having any joy should do those things.
 
Our Kids Dad said:
Exactly, I'm not convinced by Semedo & would much rather we gave Carvalho game time.


What wasn't a penalty - the handball?

I thought it was, he appeared to move his hand towards the ball - most of the pundits agreed too.

I wasn't sure why their 3rd was disallowed either, although I was more disappointed that we couldn't manage the game & conceded a daft free kick in the first place.
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The fact that the goal was disallowed at the end of the game seems to have papered over the fact that this is the third time in the last month we have been unable to 'manage' the end of a game. It was just that this time, the linesman saved us.

Something to correct if we end up in the high pressure 2-leg play off games, I would suggest.
 
DR Forest said:
The fact that the goal was disallowed at the end of the game seems to have papered over the fact that this is the third time in the last month we have been unable to 'manage' the end of a game. It was just that this time, the linesman saved us.

Something to correct if we end up in the high pressure 2-leg play off games, I would suggest.
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That was exactly my point Dr F.

We were due a decision to go in our favour, but we should not have to rely on that - we also have to be careful with needless bookings.
 
Our Kids Dad said:
Exactly, I'm not convinced by Semedo & would much rather we gave Carvalho game time.


What wasn't a penalty - the handball?

I thought it was, he appeared to move his hand towards the ball - most of the pundits agreed too.

I wasn't sure why their 3rd was disallowed either, although I was more disappointed that we couldn't manage the game & conceded a daft free kick in the first place.
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How can this not possibly be offside?

Are you seriously saying he is not involved in active play?

2273.jpg
 
I am of the opinion it was given for Bartley fouling Figgy. The linesman isn’t on the goal line when he raises his flag but in line with Bartley and Figgy and where they clash prior to both falling in to the goal. It was the TV commentators who gave the opinion and debate around off side. Clear foul in build up and given before the ball was struck by Robinson. Problem with TV is you don’t see the linesman and when he raised flag. If not at game, all you can go on is the position of linesman, who was in line with original foul. Also ref indicated foul not offside. Agree with those asking why we are vulnerable when teams throw kitchen sink. We had 10 players in box where as WBA had 5, yet ball still ended in back of net, be it illegally.
 
mao tse tung said:
How can this not possibly be offside?

Are you seriously saying he is not involved in active play?

View attachment 37705
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No, of course he/they are both in active play - but, aren't they both 'on the line'?

Aren't the bits 'behind the line' irrelevant?

Initially, I thought it was given for the foul, but Stroud clearly gave it due to linesman flagging.

I'm not bothered either way - we deserved to get at least 1 decision, I'm more concerned with the fact that we've repeatedly struggled to see a game out.
 
Our Kids Dad said:
No, of course he/they are both in active play - but, aren't they both 'on the line'?

Aren't the bits 'behind the line' irrelevant?

Initially, I thought it was given for the foul, but Stroud clearly gave it due to linesman flagging.

I'm not bothered either way - we deserved to get at least 1 decision, I'm more concerned with the fact that we've repeatedly struggled to see a game out.
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Part of the struggle to see games out is probably because we sub Sow off, likely fitness related but bringing someone like Semedo on is a big downgrade for the last 20 minutes. Our bench is so weak if players get tired and have to be subbed off it is going to make the end of matches a lot harder. Samba Sow's fitness is going to play a big part in the last 13 matches, keep him fit and I can see us pushing the top league places, lose him and who knows where we end up!
 
Our Kids Dad said:
No, of course he/they are both in active play - but, aren't they both 'on the line'?

Aren't the bits 'behind the line' irrelevant?

Initially, I thought it was given for the foul, but Stroud clearly gave it due to linesman flagging.

I'm not bothered either way - we deserved to get at least 1 decision, I'm more concerned with the fact that we've repeatedly struggled to see a game out.
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Being on the line is irrelevant; the bits behind the line are also irrelevant.

If Bartley had been completely over the line and had attempted to interfere with Figi, it would still have been an offence.
 
Ian2005uk said:
Part of the struggle to see games out is probably because we sub Sow off, likely fitness related but bringing someone like Semedo on is a big downgrade for the last 20 minutes. Our bench is so weak if players get tired and have to be subbed off it is going to make the end of matches a lot harder. Samba Sow's fitness is going to play a big part in the last 13 matches, keep him fit and I can see us pushing the top league places, lose him and who knows where we end up!
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We need Sow to avoid collecting yellow cards too, 2 more and he gets a 2 match ban.

Sow had been booked, Silva looked physically shot - but because we were losing 2-1 Sabri had to make offensive changes.
 
mao tse tung said:
Figi is still on his feet in that photograph so the foul is yet to occur; the player would be deemed offside the second the ball is played
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I thought the foul was before that, before the ball even fell to Robinson - which is why both ended up in the net.

It doesn't matter, result says 2-2.
 
According to FIFA: If an attacking player remains stationary between the goal posts and inside the goal net as the ball enters the net, a goal shall be awarded, however, if the attacking player distracts an opponent, the goal shall be disallowed.
 
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