The Official Dean Smith Thread
- Thread starter Melon Donkey
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Pangloss
Vital Football Legend
Results aren't any better though.
There's a sense to me that he has made us more inept in one area (attacking) in order to make us less inept in another (defence). The net result being we're delivering the same results.
Wurzel
Vital Football Legend
Yes this often happens with struggling sides, they spend so much effort in defending to the detriment of the attack.
Pangloss
Vital Football Legend
£40m because some tabloids have plucked that out of thin air? Transfer Markt rate him at £16m and there's a little bit more science going into that number.
Thomas Holte
Vital Football Legend
It's good to see a very small minority still supporting and defending Dean Smith while the vast majority think otherwise.
Wurzel
Vital Football Legend
Fickle?It's good to see a very small minority still supporting and defending Dean Smith while the vast majority think otherwise.
Thomas Holte
Vital Football Legend
Thomas Holte
Vital Football Legend
I'll leave that for the tiny and vast majority to decide or "Fickle" as you describe us
crimsondonkey
Vital 1st Team Regular
Selective but I'll address all the points for you.
'two points from four tough games is acceptable so he is getting results '
Nope its not acceptable, they're all tough games and at that rate of 0.5 pts per game, we will be down, so tell me how the holy fuck is that acceptable?
On this irrelevant value of players crap - tbh I couldn't give a fuck until we actually sell them, I want to see performances in Claret and Blue not worry about what some journo talks our players up as.
But I'll take issue with some of your assumptions anyway!
'Jack Grealish has gone from being famous for ditching Ireland for England to being an 80m rated player'
How long has it been since he ditched Ireland to be relevant. Also as good as Jack has been this season it is Smith that has insisted on playing him out of position for most of it, and surely if he had he'd be worth even more, so Smith has effectively devalued him.
'Mings has gone from being out on loan from Bournemouth in the championship to playing for England'
Largely on the back of his performances in the Championship where lots of commentators credited him for his leadership. In the PL he's been a liability at times and overplayed and made silly mistakes - Smith hasn't exactly coached that out of him has he, although he has taught him this 'rest defending' bollocks though clearly so I'll credit Deano with that!
'McGinn has gone from being a 1.5m championship player to being a 40m rated midfielder'
McGinn's value went up the moment he left Scotland and pulled on a Villa shirt. His first few performances were full of energy and drive - you can't credit Smith for that if he already had it as soon as he arrived. In the PL he's found it harder to have the same impact, I've no idea where these silly valuations come from and no interest either.
'So yes, the team is improving'
This is my favourite comment and the one that is furthest from reality, hence the La La Land description.
You could say based on your own assessment that players have improved, and even that is debatable. Even more debatable to credit Smith for it.
But the biggest problem is conflating team with the alleged player improvement suggested. The team has been plainly fucking awful from start to finish. The team is getting worse not better. Smith started out with plan A, to naively play open pressing football against better opposition and the team conceded shit loads of goals, and has now regressed into parking the bus and of course now we carry fuck all goal threat (and still concede...).
The team started off the season applying themselves with a decent workrate, but now the team can't be bothered and Smith can't motivate them to put the required work in.
The team are not fucking improving
Look I don't mind a bit of debate and support for Smith to bring a bit of balance, but please base it on some semblance of logic and reality in the real world.
Some of you must have little tweezers to be able to so tightly grasp at the straws that you are, ha ha!
McParlandTheGreat
Vital Champions League
Interesting one that. If you go by those who criticise DS and the team the most then mighty Sheffield were going to trample all over our whimpering spinless players, and Newcastle the same. So as we were at least as good as them and got a point from each then those same critics ought to admit they were wrong and that we're doing better than they expected.
Then there are others (like me) who beforehand reckoned that Sheffeld and Newcastle aren't actually very good, we are actually better than painted, and getting something from both matches was the minimum to expect. So the fact we only got 2 draws is disappointing. I think we should have had 4 points minimum.
Where I think DS has gone wrong is that given where we are, he should have played to our strengths not tried to cover up for our weaknesses. Given the lack of match fitness going gung-ho wasn't on but attack should have been the priority. Same for the rest of the season. We're not going to get a win unless we put out a functioning attack which can score goals.
Thomas Holte
Vital Football Legend
Meanwhile, why not aim for the stars in trying to privately get a new manager - They could only say no?
Everton did it and they are no bigger a club than Aston villa.
Everton did it and they are no bigger a club than Aston villa.
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Wurzel
Vital Football Legend
Selective but I'll address all the points for you.
'two points from four tough games is acceptable so he is getting results '
Nope its not acceptable, they're all tough games and at that rate of 0.5 pts per game, we will be down, so tell me how the holy fuck is that acceptable?
On this irrelevant value of players crap - tbh I couldn't give a fuck until we actually sell them, I want to see performances in Claret and Blue not worry about what some journo talks our players up as.
But I'll take issue with some of your assumptions anyway!
'Jack Grealish has gone from being famous for ditching Ireland for England to being an 80m rated player'
How long has it been since he ditched Ireland to be relevant. Also as good as Jack has been this season it is Smith that has insisted on playing him out of position for most of it, and surely if he had he'd be worth even more, so Smith has effectively devalued him.
'Mings has gone from being out on loan from Bournemouth in the championship to playing for England'
Largely on the back of his performances in the Championship where lots of commentators credited him for his leadership. In the PL he's been a liability at times and overplayed and made silly mistakes - Smith hasn't exactly coached that out of him has he, although he has taught him this 'rest defending' bollocks though clearly so I'll credit Deano with that!
'McGinn has gone from being a 1.5m championship player to being a 40m rated midfielder'
McGinn's value went up the moment he left Scotland and pulled on a Villa shirt. His first few performances were full of energy and drive - you can't credit Smith for that if he already had it as soon as he arrived. In the PL he's found it harder to have the same impact, I've no idea where these silly valuations come from and no interest either.
'So yes, the team is improving'
This is my favourite comment and the one that is furthest from reality, hence the La La Land description.
You could say based on your own assessment that players have improved, and even that is debatable. Even more debatable to credit Smith for it.
But the biggest problem is conflating team with the alleged player improvement suggested. The team has been plainly fucking awful from start to finish. The team is getting worse not better. Smith started out with plan A, to naively play open pressing football against better opposition and the team conceded shit loads of goals, and has now regressed into parking the bus and of course now we carry fuck all goal threat (and still concede...).
The team started off the season applying themselves with a decent workrate, but now the team can't be bothered and Smith can't motivate them to put the required work in.
The team are not fucking improving
Look I don't mind a bit of debate and support for Smith to bring a bit of balance, but please base it on some semblance of logic and reality in the real world.
Some of you must have little tweezers to be able to so tightly grasp at the straws that you are, ha ha!
Look you obviously don't like Smith, fine, but this complete refusal to view anything positive at Villa is frankly puerile. I think if you bothered to look with an ounce of balance you would see that not everything is shit, but hey, it's your opinion, you are entitled to it, and people are entitled to challenge that opinion, and we do.
Wurzel
Vital Football Legend
Sorry but I'm afraid at the moment they are. I know how that hurts but we are a newly promoted possibly soon to be relegated side, they are an established Premiership side.
crimsondonkey
Vital 1st Team Regular
I do like him. I just don't rate him.
Nothing personal, just look at the results and the performances.
All this fanciful stuff about certain players values etc is just irrelevant and well fanciful.
Like I said, challenge and debate is good, I just think it's even better when the assumptions and logic underpinning those opinions have some basis in reality/ reasonable logic.
Wurzel
Vital Football Legend
I totally agree, when are you going to use those opinions based in reality and logic? LOL.
crimsondonkey
Vital 1st Team Regular
Well I can't wait for you and the other fantasist in the village try to put a positive spin when we're relegated and try to tell everyone that we're improving and Deano has done a great job
I'm sorry but how is supporting a manager that has taken us from a mid table championship club to one point from safety with six games to play in the premier league and league cup runners up in 18 months an illogical opinion?
When things arent going well in football, fans either rally against commonly the manager, rarely the players, and/or occasionally the owners. We've got new owners who have spent money in two transfer windows so no one is blaming them, for some bizarre reason no one is really blaming the players, everyone is blaming the coach. Bizarre.
crimsondonkey
Vital 1st Team Regular
Eh? No one said that. You’ve introduced the supporting the manager bit by yourself.
You said: “the team was improving” (based on cherry picking of individual players).
That is illogical because -
1. Individual players do not constitute the team and their values are irrelevant anyway
2. The team is not improving, it’s getting worse
Keep up
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