Surely dead man walking | Page 86 | Vital Football

Surely dead man walking

moonay said:
Saying he's not "the worst" thing to have happened to the club is hardly worthy of being termed "blind faith".

All I've done is recognise/acknowledge everything that's gone on in his time here, rather than merely focus on his (admittedly) poor Championship points record, lacklustre performances and (sometimes) bewildering - and frustrating - team selections.

I see the bad things too............ just not exclusively so.
;)
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Isn't it the manager's job to get points, play entertaining football (even ugly football is entertaining if you're winning...) and to select the best players?

Surely those are the absolute tenets of being a competent manager, and by your own admission in your post, all of them are Cook's weak points.

Being very selective on one season in a lower league when we had head and shoulders the best squad in that league, one win over a big club who took us lightly when we were in great form and full of confidence, and a mediocre recent run is papering over some chasm sized cracks.

Cook doesn't do anything right. Literally nothing.

I think we're going to have to agree to differ on this one...
 
My responses are in italics ......

The_Pon said:
Isn't it the manager's job to get points, play entertaining football (even ugly football is entertaining if you're winning...) and to select the best players?

Yes, of course it is .......and as I've said, we sometimes have played good stuff, which has then been forgotten about after we've lost - the flip to your "ugly football" comment.

Surely those are the absolute tenets of being a competent manager, and by your own admission in your post, all of them are Cook's weak points.

I'm not saying he's brilliant. .......just NOT the "worst thing ever to have happened to our club".

Being very selective on one season in a lower league when we had head and shoulders the best squad in that league, one win over a big club who took us lightly when we were in great form and full of confidence, and a mediocre recent run is papering over some chasm sized cracks.

Yep .....I see your point ...... I just thought they were evidence as to why he's not "the worst thing etc".

Cook doesn't do anything right. Literally nothing.

I think we're going to have to agree to differ on this one...

Probably so.........and I've no problem with that.
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I look forward one of us referring back to this thread later in the season, and saying "see, I told you so".
;)

:cheers:
 
moonay said:
You see Hampton, this "conversation" thing doesn't really work unless you properly read what I wrote. Have another go.
;)




A full game, yep, maybe you're right ............... but at times, within games, we've had plenty of belting spells ......... just often without any end product.

The problem has been that our defence has been unable to keep clean sheets, so unless the good play has an actual result, it's easily forgotten.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that we do this every game ................. just that whenever we do, then it's better than anything produced under those other Managers.
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I've taken up your request Moonay, read it again and it's as i thought initially - gash.
🤡 has no redeeming features IMO given the time and investment he's had vs. both level of championship performances from his team and points won.
As for winning L1 - so did Caldwell, so could you or I with the financial superiority those seasons
 
Hampton said:
I've taken up your request Moonay, read it again and it's as i thought initially - gash...........
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Gash it may be Hampton, but it still doesn't say how what you posted. I didn't say "best championship football since Jewell". I said that Cook's best (Championship) football is way better than the best under Coyle, Mackay and Joyce. There's a big difference. Also, Rosler was way better than all of them.

Hampton said:
......... 🤡 has no redeeming features IMO given the time and investment he's had vs. both level of championship performances from his team and points won........
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I think I've covered most of this in responding to The Pon.

Hampton said:
.........As for winning L1 - so did Caldwell, so could you or I with the financial superiority those seasons
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I like Caldwell. I liked his team. I thought he was unlucky to be sacked ........ though to be fair, he's done little since to suggest it was a bad decision. As for me or you doing it .......given you're so confident, I'd submit my CV to Sunderland if I were you mate.
;)
 
moonay said:
Gash it may be Hampton, but it still doesn't say how what you posted. I didn't say "best championship football since Jewell". I said that Cook's best (Championship) football is way better than the best under Coyle, Mackay and Joyce. There's a big difference. Also, Rosler was way better than all of them.



I think I've covered most of this in responding to The Pon.



I like Caldwell. I liked his team. I thought he was unlucky to be sacked ........ though to be fair, he's done little since to suggest it was a bad decision. As for me or you doing it .......given you're so confident, I'd submit my CV to Sunderland if I were you mate.
;)
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First interview Thursday - though as i have a level1 coaching badge think I'm over qualified !
Rosler I agree - still not sure what "best 🤡" as a team you can put up ?
For me he's as boring dreary and negative as the other 3 but having had much more money to play with - on that basis bottom of the heap IMO
 
I thought Caldwell was well out of his depth (although I have far more respect for him than I have Cook as he gets our club). However I also very much liked his team. A lot of lower level players with a sprinkling of vets who very much appreciated playing for a "big club". It was easy to get behind them.

That season our financial power got us through yes. Wildschut was the difference, without him we probably wouldn't have gone up. Our January business that season was probably the best transfer window we've had in years. Wildschut on a permanent, Morsy, Colclough, Wabara and McAleny all brought something to the table and Warnock on loan later in the season. That squad depth allowed us to go on a winning run from March onwards whilst smaller squads like Burton and Walsall couldn't keep it up.

2017/18 we had the majority of that squad with Nick Powell and Dan Burn added to it. Anything other than top two would have been a failure. The FA Cup run was a lovely bonus, we got a nice helping hand with Bournemouth fielding a second string and West Ham having over half their squad out injured. Plus Nick Powell of course chose that a game to probably put in his best ever performance for us.

Cook's best Championship football is not better than Coyle's IMO. I can't remember a performance like Barnsley away under Coyle over the past two seasons? Have we beat a side 0-4 in the Championship under Cook?
 
Hampton said:
First interview Thursday - though as i have a level1 coaching badge think I'm over qualified !
..........
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Good luck with that. :LOL:(y)

Hampton said:
.........Rosler I agree - still not sure what "best 🤡" as a team you can put up ?
For me he's as boring dreary and negative as the other 3 but having had much more money to play with - on that basis bottom of the heap IMO
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It's not a case of "a team", or even full games .......... it's just patches of play in sporadic games ........ which we've probably gone on to lose ! ;)

C_Latic said:
I thought Caldwell was well out of his depth (although I have far more respect for him than I have Cook as he gets our club). However I also very much liked his team. A lot of lower level players with a sprinkling of vets who very much appreciated playing for a "big club". It was easy to get behind them...........
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I agree.

C_Latic said:
......Cook's best Championship football is not better than Coyle's IMO. I can't remember a performance like Barnsley away under Coyle over the past two seasons? Have we beat a side 0-4 in the Championship under Cook?
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One game. ........His first game. Is that it. He'd hardly had chance to get to work with them. Any flair that day was the legacy of Martinez.
 
Not defending him,but we've had a few good wins under Cook in the Championship.But they have been few and far between unfortunately.Problem is the best ones that spring to mind are last season.The 3-0 wins over Stoke away and Villa at home.Of course battering Bolton 5-2 was very satisfying.That Leeds win last season was massive with 10 men for most of the game.

Leeds away,so far this season is probably the most impressive result.There are still 13 games left though,so even though it's going to be extremely difficult,I haven't given up hope we can produce some big results and performances in the coming months and give ourselves a chance.
We've taken 11 points from our last 8 games.If we can replicate that from our next 8 games,it could get interesting going into those last 5 games.
 
hindleymonwafc said:
It's all still to play for....until we are mathematically certain to be relegated it's pointless ( pun intended) giving up. A bit of the old Dunkirk spirit is required at the mo.
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Think some of the lads on the pitch have had the 'Dunkirk spirit'......sadly tho let down with a few 'ghost' players & a manager who has 1 decent game followed by more of the same drab n dreary set ups, baffling substitutions & a touchline battle with the officials...
 
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