Surely dead man walking | Page 84 | Vital Football

Surely dead man walking

How can we expect the players to keep their discipline when the manager conducts himself like an out of control Sunday League manager.
Bet his salary is a little bit more than what the average Sunday League manager earns.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
I have never kissed arse in my life, Norm, and I don't intend to start now.

I have the survival of our club at heart and am genuinely asking for a truce in this vendetta against Cook, not because I want him or the Royles to stay, but because I fear the damage that it is doing to our chances of survival, however I could say that you on the other hand are exhibiting the behaviour of someone desperate to see us get relegated by constantly attacking anyone that shows any reason on here.

Are you sure you support the same club as me. Because you sure as hell don't sound like you want us to stay up. A reasonable person would listen to other peoples views and consider their values before dismissing them out of hand. Could it be that your mission in life is to come on here and wreck any proposals that could help the club survive?
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Save your breath mate...I tried the same crack when Malkie was in charge to get behind the team and not the manager...but no , the right on PC brigade would have none of it and preferred to put the club to the sword to fit with their ever so tight minded look on life...they BOYCOTTED the matches, yes that's right put their own judgements before the team's welfare...ever since I do what I do.

I call it the jellyfish era.
 
moonay said:
Did they really though hindley? Really? Or were they just Bertie Big Bollox saying they would?

Internet Warriors. Great name for a new phoenix club !

;)
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It's a good point mate...sometimes what folk say and do can be different. It was said by several though at the time...surely you remember the classic I would rather go to the Trafford Centre jibe some years ago rather than help the team out when they were sinking fast. People claim to be supporters then put their own differences before the general good of the club.

I can't think of any manager that would make me turn on the team that I have stuck with for over 50 years. I didn't always go regularly but that had nowt do with any shite boss or even shitter team.
 
Yet some would rather go to a Youth Cup game at Old Trafford, than get behind the first team players at WBA the day after!

Its already been mentioned there would be more support from Wigan at OT than at the Hawthorns the day after.
 
Stormin' Norman said:
Yet some would rather go to a Youth Cup game at Old Trafford, than get behind the first team players at WBA the day after!

Its already been mentioned there would be more support from Wigan at OT than at the Hawthorns the day after.
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I can only speak for myself but due to working every Saturday night the WBA game is a no go but the Friday match is very much on.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
Jock, I'm not asking you to like Cook or even agree with what he does, I am merely asking that we stop the constant over the top criticism, at least in public view, and give the appearance of a united front.

As you yourself have said it looks as though the board have decided to stick and no amount of comment from us will change that, but positive support for the team might save us from the drop. I understand and agree with the frustrations but see nothing to gain from pursuing them other than to create a negative atmosphere around the stadium and on social media.

If you cant say anything good about the manager, then why not concentrate your efforts on extra support for the players, who I personally think have shown they are up for the fight and leave the negative comments for another day.

(I also understand if you think I am talking bollox and want to ignore my comments as it has been a long hard season so far).
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Its not over the top criticism, if anything 🤡 hasn't recieved the amount of 💩 deserved for the utter shambles he has brought to our first team for all of this season and most of last. #🤡out - right feckin out
 
The_Pon said:
In the industry I work in, I deal a lot with insurance companies. Insurance inspectors are the 'referees' of my world. I don't always agree with their assessments on a host of matters, but I still have to be respectful.

Everyone knows what company I work for, and if I got a bollocking for being abusive and using foul language to an inspector, it would reflect very negatively on me and my employer.

As such, however much I may disagree with them at times, I have to be respectful and calm when I raise my disagreements. That's to my benefit and to my employer's benefit. The fact that I'm polite and respectful means that the inspectors actually give me some respect back and often actually listen to what I'm saying.

Cook getting a bollocking after 5 minutes when nothing happened, then continuing to be objectionable to officials all game, pretty much every game, can't do us any favours.

The ref on Tuesday was absolutely disgusting in his bias, but there's a chicken and egg question there... Was Cook acting like that because the ref was biased or was the ref biased because Cook pissed him off?

If it was a one-off, I'd probably have backed Cook's reaction after Tuesday, but he does it pretty much every game. Referees talk to each other. Cook has a reputation, and that means referees are now coming into games with a downer on him, and that translates to 50/50 calls being 60/40 calls against us. Refs hate Cook (because of Cook's behaviour), so they're not going to do his team any favours or ever give us the benefit of the doubt.
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It's not often i would stand shoulder to shoulder with refs but this is one of those times 🤣
 
Hampton said:
Its not over the top criticism, if anything 🤡 hasn't recieved the amount of 💩 deserved for the utter shambles he has brought to our first team for all of this season and most of last. #🤡out - right feckin out
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Again today, look what hes done.
Probably go and get a lucky win like those last two.
 
jocklatic said:
TBF......the forum seems split into 2 camps / 2 thoughts. Those who want PC out & will not be getting behind him while the other camp who think we should get behind PC & the team altho not necessarily keeping PC at the season's end regardless of our final league position. TB , Moonay n others putting up good points about getting behind the team ( which I think majority of us are) & manager ( which majority of us prob aren't). Whereas others like Norm, Zakky n others will have nothing at all to do with PC n want him gone n gone now. Me, I'm in the camp of wanting him gone but know it won't happen so will with gritted teeth try n get behind the club, temper the criticism in the hope we can somehow scrape survival.........🤔
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I am in total agreement about the two camps Jock. I will admit that I am also one who wants rid of Cook and Co. but have come to the conclusion that he will not be leaving us until we are at least relegated or the season ends.

Despite Norm seeing me as an apologist for Cook and the Board I am not.

I am not asking anyone to change their views on whether Cook stays or goes I am simply asking people to keep their more vitriolic statements out of the debate for the present to try and form a united front to support the players as we try to get out of the mire by pulling together.

As I have previously said, I am well aware that some posters will see this as absolute bollocks and try to shout me down, and that is their right but I truly believe that all this discontent and spiteful content is damaging to the effort.

I have also said that once things have been settled I will gladly take point in the effort to see the back of the manager but until we are safe or relegated we need to stand together and present ourselves as Latics fans united behind the team.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
I am in total agreement about the two camps Jock. I will admit that I am also one who wants rid of Cook and Co. but have come to the conclusion that he will not be leaving us until we are at least relegated or the season ends.

Despite Norm seeing me as an apologist for Cook and the Board I am not.

I am not asking anyone to change their views on whether Cook stays or goes I am simply asking people to keep their more vitriolic statements out of the debate for the present to try and form a united front to support the players as we try to get out of the mire by pulling together.

As I have previously said, I am well aware that some posters will see this as absolute bollocks and try to shout me down, and that is their right but I truly believe that all this discontent and spiteful content is damaging to the effort.

I have also said that once things have been settled I will gladly take point in the effort to see the back of the manager but until we are safe or relegated we need to stand together and present ourselves as Latics fans united behind the team.
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I get exactly what your saying TB n don't think you are anyway an apologist for PC. It's hard to not be critical when watching some of our play, the managers tactics & substitutions. Hopefully we can get the wins / points which in turn will save any criticisms 😉
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
I am in total agreement about the two camps Jock. I will admit that I am also one who wants rid of Cook and Co. but have come to the conclusion that he will not be leaving us until we are at least relegated or the season ends.

Despite Norm seeing me as an apologist for Cook and the Board I am not.

I am not asking anyone to change their views on whether Cook stays or goes I am simply asking people to keep their more vitriolic statements out of the debate for the present to try and form a united front to support the players as we try to get out of the mire by pulling together.

As I have previously said, I am well aware that some posters will see this as absolute bollocks and try to shout me down, and that is their right but I truly believe that all this discontent and spiteful content is damaging to the effort.

I have also said that once things have been settled I will gladly take point in the effort to see the back of the manager but until we are safe or relegated we need to stand together and present ourselves as Latics fans united behind the team.
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Continuing to call for 🤡 to be potted whilst supporting the players nowt wrong wi that IMO.
You can do both at the same time v.easily.
 
Too much emphasis is put on what people say on line. Being critical of Cook or defending him on here has no baring on anything. So if arguing or venting frustration on here helps folks - i say fill your boots as it won't influence his decisions or keep him in place / speed up his sacking. It's better letting out the frustration on here and getting it out of your system than bottling it up and venting it at the ground or arguing with fans there.

In a polls of 1,500 fans (that's prob about a fifth of our average home attendance so a decent cross section) 87% wanted Cook gone but you wouldnt know it from being at games. As terrible as we've been for much of the last 12 months the crowd is still not very hostile, still pretty forgiving and only voice frustration when Cook does really stupid things or dreadful performances. The crowd still come alive when they are given something to get excited about - it's just we've not had much to get us on the edge of our seats. The excuse Kendrick tried to push with that poor article that the fans are part of the problem is nonsense. On match days we all turn up wanting them to win, but we are demoralised after being too often let down on the pitch. If the team selection is positive, the tactics logical and the players show heart then the place gets a bit of hope, and the fans are with them while in the ground. If the team selection is rubbish, tactics negative and there is a lack of fight / aggression it doesn't matter what the fans in the stand or say on a forum after the game - we are dead in the water. We know we arent going to 'steamroller' teams but we are expecting us to do the things to maximise our chances of success , learn from mistakes and go down swinging. Not too much to ask but it seems it is this season.

I don't think anyone biting their tongue or pretend they feel differently about Cook until the end of the season will help or hinder anything.

I'm firmly in the wanting the best for Wigan camp - which is obviously to win enough games to keep us up. I see Cook as a big roadblock to that but hope we do it despite him. I think we are going down - it's not defeatism it's realism based on everything we've seen we are good and bad at, remaining fixtures etc. I would love to be wrong but i dont think saying it or saying the opposite will help or hinder our chances. I'll still be there regardless but it's frustrating it's come to this after having so much cash spent on recruitment in the summer and so many mistakes made.
 
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Stormin' Norman said:
Yet some would rather go to a Youth Cup game at Old Trafford, than get behind the first team players at WBA the day after!

Its already been mentioned there would be more support from Wigan at OT than at the Hawthorns the day after.
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I’ll bite mate. Would I rather watch our own homegrown record breaking youngsters busting a gut for the badge at the theatre of dreams against one of the biggest clubs in the world for free? Or watch a group of players and coaching staff that have belittled us in the press and consistently let us down on the pitch, and pay an admission fee for the privilege?

Tough one that.
 
C_Latic said:
I’ll bite mate. Would I rather watch our own homegrown record breaking youngsters busting a gut for the badge at the theatre of dreams against one of the biggest clubs in the world for free? Or watch a group of players and coaching staff that have belittled us in the press and consistently let us down on the pitch, and pay an admission fee for the privilege?

Tough one that.
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Add to that we all know it will likely be a very negative back 5 with 3 def mids and everyone lumping it long to a totally isolated striker. We are probably going to lose baring West Brom missing as many sitters as Leeds and it's a 2 hour drive plus ticket and petrol costs. Not exactly an enticing trip - if we felt we'd go for it then more would fancy it but you know it will be negative tactics and team selection that invites pressure we are terrible at coping with.

While the kids will be less than an hour away, free entrance, we are going to attack and have a decent chance of winning.

I won't be able to attend either due to family commitments but if I didn't I'd certainly go watch the under 18s at Old Trafford but not be going to West Brom. I've been burned by too many away games over the last couple of years to spend the money and time going any more until something changes.
 
I wonder how many will carry on supporting the Youth team after Old Trafford?

I also wonder how many have watched them at all this season?
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
I am in total agreement about the two camps Jock. I will admit that I am also one who wants rid of Cook and Co. but have come to the conclusion that he will not be leaving us until we are at least relegated or the season ends.

Despite Norm seeing me as an apologist for Cook and the Board I am not.

I am not asking anyone to change their views on whether Cook stays or goes I am simply asking people to keep their more vitriolic statements out of the debate for the present to try and form a united front to support the players as we try to get out of the mire by pulling together.

As I have previously said, I am well aware that some posters will see this as absolute bollocks and try to shout me down, and that is their right but I truly believe that all this discontent and spiteful content is damaging to the effort.

I have also said that once things have been settled I will gladly take point in the effort to see the back of the manager but until we are safe or relegated we need to stand together and present ourselves as Latics fans united behind the team.
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I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm 100% behind the players. Every one of them. I cheer everyone that comes onto the pitch in a Latics shirt, regardless of whether I think they're the right player to be starting, coming on was a sub, coming off, whatever.

There isn't a single player who I think deserves to be booed or criticised. Some (Lowe, Massey, Jacobs etc.) I don't think are good enough for this level, and I'd prefer they didn't play, but as I've said on other threads, I don't blame them personally. They don't pick themselves, and when they play, it's not their effort or commitment that I think is substandard. It's their ability, and that's not their fault. No-one can ask any player to be better than they are so long as they're giving 100% effort.

And that's my take on the situation. The manager is the root of all evil at this club. No problem with the players, and I'll cheer every last one of them until the cows come home. Cook, on the other hand, I will boo, jeer and condemn whenever and wherever I can.

I fully understand that it's highly unlikely to make a god's bit of difference, but even if my efforts in booing and jeering him make Cook getting sacked just one billionth of a percent more likely, it's still well worth the effort.

I'm behind the team; I want us to do as well as we can, ideally without Cook, but more likely despite Cook. I'll vocally show that to the players whenever I can. With that said, there is not a chance in hell that I'll say anything positive about Cook, because there's nothing positive to say about Cook. To try to pretend otherwise would be dishonest. He's the worst thing to happen to Wigan Athletic in our club's history. He's a disease that it seems we currently can't or won't cure... And it's not possible to live with it for much longer, so the club must either bite the bullet and deal with it, or die, simple as that.
 
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