Standing - Sit Down! | Page 3 | Vital Football

Standing - Sit Down!

VillaTomB38

Vital 1st Team Regular
#41
You aren't listening to the point though Tom, standing is growing and becoming more of a problem and people who have sat where they sat for years perfectly happily, are now having to complain because of standing where people used to sit.

I've already said in this thread, if you were new in, bought a seat at the back of the holte then you would have to question your choice.

Thing is though, for the sake of this debate, it isn't actually a choice anyway. It is an all seater stadium.

So, sod everyone as long as 'you' are happy then?
Ive also said in one of my other comments that at away games it’s unfair that everyone stands and this seems to be the expected norm. There are obviously people from various areas of Villa Park where they sit and stand that go to away games and they have to stand regardless. This is where the new legislation needs bringing in because as in Germany you could have 50% standing and 50% seating and at least then you have the choice, if you can’t get a standing ticket then tough you’ll have to sit and personally I’d accept that. I’ve sat at plenty of grounds and have no problem with it but I prefer to stand where possible. In L8 i get to stand and everyone around me does happily too, I can’t even recall ever seeing stewards either so no one is making us sit but they’d have a hard time trying anyway.

I can’t speak for other areas of the ground though, if someone has a problem with wherever their seat is then they need to bring it up with the club. Nothing will get done in silence.
 
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pvb1968

Vital 1st Team Regular
#42
With reponse to VAR getting a mention it is because that is something else that is spoiling the day out. Its part of an insideous creep in all areas of our lives where legislation and litigation are more and more in use to challenge things that somebody doesnt like.
I agree 110% with that comment.
 

pvb1968

Vital 1st Team Regular
#43
Difference is a wonderful thing and is why the globe consists of different languages, colours, tribes, styles, music, food, architecture and so on.
 

The Fear

A Wise Man (once sat next to him)
#44
That is because wittonite, you pvb and myself are people of a certain age, we've seen the birth of the nanny state and sanitisation of life.

But again, that's not the point, the club can only operate in the system that is here!
 

tmg513

Vital Squad Member
#45
What fans don't realise, is that the clubs are now getting into quite big trouble, which will lead to fines and potentially having a % of the tickets they can sell suspended i.e. the authories might say 10% have to be withheld.

Our club, so I'm told, has been targetted as the worst offender. I find it hard to believe, because of the constant pictures of the fans all standing at Anfield, however, this could well come to bite us and our club.
Could you clarify who exactly is going to fine the club and under what law or regulation? I can't see that the clubs breaks any laws by allowing spectators to stand so is this the local authority, the FA, or who?
 
#46
I can confirm in the Doug Ellis we get told to sit down, which if anyone knows where I sit is quite funny as the only thing behind me is a brick wall.
 

The Fear

A Wise Man (once sat next to him)
#47
Could you clarify who exactly is going to fine the club and under what law or regulation? I can't see that the clubs breaks any laws by allowing spectators to stand so is this the local authority, the FA, or who?
passed from pillar to post I think TMG but pressure, if I have things right, is on local authorities. It isn't for me to be looking up the exact regulations they will use, you'd have as much chance as me looking it up, but no one can be in ignorance of the fact that it is the law, surely? It has been since the Taylor Report, and all seater started for the 94/95 season.

Since 1994-95, it has been a legal requirement for Premier League clubs to have all-seater stadiums, so there are no standing areas at all. This was a recommendation of the Taylor Report (1990) following the Hillsborough disaster in 1989.
 

tmg513

Vital Squad Member
#49
passed from pillar to post I think TMG but pressure, if I have things right, is on local authorities. It isn't for me to be looking up the exact regulations they will use, you'd have as much chance as me looking it up, but no one can be in ignorance of the fact that it is the law, surely? It has been since the Taylor Report, and all seater started for the 94/95 season.

Since 1994-95, it has been a legal requirement for Premier League clubs to have all-seater stadiums, so there are no standing areas at all. This was a recommendation of the Taylor Report (1990) following the Hillsborough disaster in 1989.
I have no argument that the club is legally obliged to provide an all-seater stadium but I don't believe that a spectator standing up or a club allowing them to do so breaks any law.
 

BodyButter

Vital Football Legend
#50
The problem with standing is the same as the problem with speeding, the government interfering in people's lives. It's not unsafe to stand. The Taylor Report was a farce.
 

The Fear

A Wise Man (once sat next to him)
#51
The problem with standing is the same as the problem with speeding, the government interfering in people's lives. It's not unsafe to stand. The Taylor Report was a farce.
The argument isn't about the Taylor Report though BB, of course it was a farce, as was putting us in cages in the first place.

Standing in a seated stadium, I believe, isn't safe. Standing in a properly fitted out safe standing stadium (or back in the good days, just a standing stadium) is.

I hate it when we score away and everyone pushes and you go flying over seats, it might be fun for people fit, but not for those of us who have busted and challenged bodies.
 

The Fear

A Wise Man (once sat next to him)
#53
I can’t speak for other areas of the ground though, if someone has a problem with wherever there seat is then they need to bring it up with the club. Nothing will get done in silence.
They have, and are, as have the authorities... as said, it has been allowed, in football, to slip. Now to reverse it will be difficult. But by the sounds of it, it will need to be done.

Sounds to me that others don't care though, as long as they get to do what they want.

I might be wrong...!!!!!!!!!!! :batman:
 

The Fear

A Wise Man (once sat next to him)
#55
The problem with standing is the same as the problem with speeding,
are you confirming my suspicion that speeding is safe and I can indeed continue by the way? Hope so, although a bit frustrating as I've just traded in my 3 litre twin turbo motor to try to slow down a bit!
 

mike_field

Vital Football Legend
#56
SGSA issue licences and in tandem with LA safety certificates, standing is a breach of those contracts - then you're down the health and safety executive route = fines for non-compliance or stands being shut ultimately I believe.
 

tmg513

Vital Squad Member
#58
That is a total contradiction isn't it? I thought it was clearly a law that fans had to be seated in an all seater stadium? Even if by the contract that you enter into when buying a ticket.
The contract you enter into when buying a ticket is a different thing and is just a civil matter: by purchasing a ticket you agree to abide by the ground regulations which include a clause that you stay seated unless your side's just scored and other exciting moments; this is what allows the club to eject offenders if they want to. There is no law that I can see that compels fans to stay in their seats or the clubs to compel them to. The law says that clubs must provide all-seater stadiums and must only sell tickets for those seats. There is no mention that fans have to actually sit in those seats.

[edit] You got there before me JF!
 

The Fear

A Wise Man (once sat next to him)
#59
Ha, yes, agreed TMG. But the club could still have sanctions against them.

So as long as 'we' aren't going to be done by the law that The Clash fought (and lost) are we all happy then?

I am not sure how the football authorities will possibly deal with this to be honest, if I'm being fair, I can't lose any sleep over it either, I can't afford the loss of beauty sleep with a mug like mine!
 

VillaTomB38

Vital 1st Team Regular
#60
They have, and are, as have the authorities... as said, it has been allowed, in football, to slip. Now to reverse it will be difficult. But by the sounds of it, it will need to be done.

Sounds to me that others don't care though, as long as they get to do what they want.

I might be wrong...!!!!!!!!!!! :batman:
It may sound selfish but I’m happy with my situation in L8 and that’s why I have the season ticket there, I get what I want yes but I care about others too which is why I want the legislation brought up to date and railed seating brought in. Then the choice will be black and white, you buy a ticket here if you want to stand and you buy a ticket there if you want to sit, there can be absolutely no arguments then.