Nicky Shorey gone | Page 4 | Vital Football

Nicky Shorey gone

GillsFan22 said:
in theory yes, but when you’re a club that relies solely on free agents, and on the face of this season incredibly cheap free agents, it is hard to make a case for it being a worthwhile use of a wage. If the new owner wants to come in and spend then there will be more place for a deeper recruitment department.
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So you want to sign players based purely on trials or watching a couple of games?

There's a reason clubs study so in depth. Even with this we will not be as in depth as the likes of Peterborough id imagine (forget prem). I use Peterborough as they are the prime example of a lower league club signing young players and selling on for big money
 
This argument is the same as arguing why do we need a full time fitness coach, surely the manager can tell them how to stay fit/don't they know how to stay fit, we also have a full time goalkeeping coach. Its all about macro details and having specialists in to give you the edge
 
antonpage said:
So you want to sign players based purely on trials or watching a couple of games?

There's a reason clubs study so in depth. Even with this we will not be as in depth as the likes of Peterborough id imagine (forget prem). I use Peterborough as they are the prime example of a lower league club signing young players and selling on for big money
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scouts and a head of recruitment are not the same thing. Before Shorey came along I fully expect the club would still have signed players off of more than “a couple of games”.
 
GillsFan22 said:
scouts and a head of recruitment are not the same thing. Before Shorey came along I fully expect the club would still have signed players off of more than “a couple of games”.
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We have no full time scouts, managers have confirmed this. We go off trials, the manager watching matches on recordings and when he can in person which wont be often.

We used a network of commission based scouts who work for multiple clubs purely on that basis, if the player signs they get paid. That isn't the same depth of knowledge as a clubs scouting department or working in the same interests. they also arnt team building in the way the recruitment department and management will together in house.

The recruitment department is responsible for the network of scouts any club will have.
 
GillsFan22 said:
scouts and a head of recruitment are not the same thing. Before Shorey came along I fully expect the club would still have signed players off of more than “a couple of games”.
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There's still the point that our record on signing players and selling them on was poor. There's a reason for this.
 
antonpage said:
We know who will be on a free transfer, youth targets, potential free transfers, potential mutual terminations, targets abroad (so studying stats and recordings in house), new loan targets. If you delve into the world of stats, find out injury records, pull up the vast data of likelihood of future injuries, recommendations, watching games in person and in house it'll be full time year round.

Our management team needs a big list of options as loads fall through. The more info we have the better we will be prepared.

If this isn't needed why have we failed so badly at signing and selling on players? Other clubs of our budget/stature have found gems and sold them on
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Yeah, in my view Brighton are the prime example.
 
OneSirKeefy said:
But it would also not surprise me if NH survives. And if he does, my conspiracy theory is that he was always the person identified by the future ownership as the person for the “long term project”. Back in January I was gobsmacked that NH decided to come here. It hasn’t worked out (yet), but his stock and reputation back then could have landed him any job in L2, L1 and a lot of Champ clubs. Why come to GFC, dead and buried in L1 with no money? So my thinking is that this takeover (if it happens) has been in the planning a long time, and PS was advised to get rid SE and pursue NH. And NH knew about the upcoming changes.
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Your comment about being gobsmacked is exactly how I felt. When project BFSE came to its inevitable end, I just had no idea how we were going to repair his damage, and who was going to take it on. Even if Woodman had come, he was just Stimson mark two to me. Just thinking who the new Dennis Oli and Adam Miller would be, which was depressing.

I was amazed when Harris was announced but do not necessarily agree about his stock and reputation as I believe he had been out of the game for quite a while after leaving Cardiff, presumably not through choice (Hughes ended up at Bradford after being in the same position). I still thought he had done well at both Millwall and Cardiff, so it was quite a coup.

I do agree that something has been evolving in the background since then and it could be that NH agreed to start this season with a bargain budget team, thinking he could improve and motivate them to, say, mid table. Shorey was meant to identify the players, but his previous record involved shopping at a higher level, which would explain why the gamble has not worked and has embarrassed them both.

Harris would not be in a position to make a stand over Shorey's dismissal as, being a football man, he would be able to see the reason why he has been let go. He also knows that any new owner may want a different man in charge, if they were not involved in his original appointment.
 
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I guess with everything, it's let him do his job and see how he gets on.

I've scanned his profile. There are a few worries for me:

Level 1 Talent ID is one of them... that's the most basic of courses. I did it for giggles so I'm as qualified in the scouting arena as he is, which bugs me.

I guess that means he's not going to be unearthing anyone. It'll be all about connections.

The website of his agency is:
https://specialist4sports.co.uk/

You can actually request the up to date men's list here: Representation – Specialist4sports

It's only a few years old. Wouldn't pass the sniff test where I'm working, let's put it that way...1670401292107.png
 
NWBluesFan said:
I guess with everything, it's let him do his job and see how he gets on.

I've scanned his profile. There are a few worries for me:

Level 1 Talent ID is one of them... that's the most basic of courses. I did it for giggles so I'm as qualified in the scouting arena as he is, which bugs me.

I guess that means he's not going to be unearthing anyone. It'll be all about connections.

The website of his agency is:
https://specialist4sports.co.uk/

You can actually request the up to date men's list here: Representation – Specialist4sports

It's only a few years old. Wouldn't pass the sniff test where I'm working, let's put it that way...View attachment 61847
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I believe this announcement was just a smokescreen. What it’s really saying is we are going to be buying in January and we don’t trust our management team to make the right decisions. I doubt this will cost a penny unless a signing is made and that will depend on whether the takeover/investment will actually happen.
 
The most encouraging thing about that seems to be that I think it fits the way sport seems to be run in America if you are hoping for Galinson. High on glossy presentation, but questionable about substance.

May possibly be similar to the Brentford model, but I can not believe that scouting and personal judgement does not have a place in any structure.

As NW says, King is clearly not involved in scouting, whereas Shorey was, however unsuccessful. Regardless of any faults, I am sure Peter Taylor would have found us better or more suitable players for League Two level.
 
NWBluesFan said:
I guess with everything, it's let him do his job and see how he gets on.

I've scanned his profile. There are a few worries for me:

Level 1 Talent ID is one of them... that's the most basic of courses. I did it for giggles so I'm as qualified in the scouting arena as he is, which bugs me.

I guess that means he's not going to be unearthing anyone. It'll be all about connections.

The website of his agency is:
https://specialist4sports.co.uk/

You can actually request the up to date men's list here: Representation – Specialist4sports

It's only a few years old. Wouldn't pass the sniff test where I'm working, let's put it that way...View attachment 61847
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I would guess that the new owner is looking at a certain manager he possibly has a idea of the sort of players that manager requires.I am sure it has been debated well into the night. This being the case the job might be about watching certain players not identifying players. It is a short term appointment. My own view is NH probably knows he is on borrowed time .This appointment over possibly a better candidate (Shorey has definitely got a better CV on arrival)but one who is connected to NH possibly shows that clearly.
 
Trashbat said:
People still talking about a new owner.

At the moment, all we have is a loan facility secured by the stadium. Maybe it’ll stay that way.
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That isn't sustainable. Route to liquidation short term spending might boost our season. But long term in a bigger mess no thanks.
 
Trashbat said:
People still talking about a new owner.

At the moment, all we have is a loan facility secured by the stadium. Maybe it’ll stay that way.
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And we don`t even know who the owner is - or might be! Something`s going on and my water is telling me that it`s positive. However, a new owner might be this Gallinson fellow, but it might not - particularly if the aforementioned is acting as a facilitator.
 
LancsGordoRoad said:
And we don`t even know who the owner is - or might be! Something`s going on and my water is telling me that it`s positive. However, a new owner might be this Gallinson fellow, but it might not - particularly if the aforementioned is acting as a facilitator.
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Over on the fans forum, Fred is being very positive. He says it IS a takeover and from “what he’s heard” they seem to have all the right intentions.

I’ll say again, like or loathe, he’s often right (which irks me 😁).

To give him a little bit of credit. I thought he’d start slagging off other things about GFC to keep his little band of disciples going. But, assuming it does all happen, he’s actually really encouraging fans to get behind the club, attend, buy merch, get season tickets etc etc. once a takeover is announced. Fair play.
 
OneSirKeefy said:
Over on the fans forum, Fred is being very positive. He says it IS a takeover and from “what he’s heard” they seem to have all the right intentions.

I’ll say again, like or loathe, he’s often right (which irks me 😁).

To give him a little bit of credit. I thought he’d start slagging off other things about GFC to keep his little band of disciples going. But, assuming it does all happen, he’s actually really encouraging fans to get behind the club, attend, buy merch, get season tickets etc etc. once a takeover is announced. Fair play.
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But it's not fair play is it? The methods he and his little pals have used to get to this point are a symptom of much that is wrong with society these days. I'm ashamed they support the same club as me. He'll be fêted as some sort of messiah by his sycophantic followers, when in fact he's just a very naughty boy.
 
In my experience, those who stop going on an issue rarely return when things change.
As example, my brother’s son in law and his family were all long-standing Charlton fans.
They all decided to boycott, as did many of their friends, due to issues with the owner.
Three owners on, they have never returned.
They simply got out of the habit.
He’s still a Charlton fan but goes to about one or two games a season which attract him.
Once you’ve lost them, they are lost.
 
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