#COVID19 | Page 681 | Vital Football

#COVID19

Will.NFFC said:
Too late.

The deficit for this will take decades to pay back. The oldest generation will have passed anyway and you can’t just expect the boomers to never retire.

The young have been completely thrown under the bus from this since day 1. They’ve had a 0.02% chance of dying from it and yet the hospitality industry has been totally shut down, where there’s mass over employment of younger people.

They’ve as such had their prospects completely ruined, their ability to live lives, get an education and meet people taken away, will take on the huge debts through ridiculous taxation and to top it all off, get stupid wankers called Barbara in her 60’s who’s retired telling them “don’t be so selfish, we fought a war, all you have to do is stay at home”... despite the fact that she had fuck all to do with any war and has actually been part of the generation that’s had it pretty dam good for years.

Still cannot believe that people think lockdown and draconian tiers is the way to go... we’ve only done it 3 times I suppose for it to keep coming back.

The fact that they’re now creating new higher tiers to manipulate people already in tier 3 into feeling lucky they aren’t now in the worst tier, whilst cleverly getting around bringing people down a tier says it all.

The government who were supposedly concerned about lockdowns because of what it would do to the economy now apparently couldn’t give a shit about that lost cause and there’s still absolutely zero ambition to discuss how we get back to a normal way of living through a different strategy.

2021 will be another depressing shit show of all work/no life for those ‘fortunate’ enough to have a job, and pure depression for the other ‘selfish’ hundreds of thousands of young trying to have a life.
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I agree with most of this.

I don't know about lockdowns. I would like to agree with you, but the hospitals are almost full now and the numbers dying are scary as it is

The reality is that if this vaccination doesn't work then it won't take forever before the young decide that the old are not worth the cost to them. Humans are social creatures and won't consent to live like this forever when the alternative of the vulnerable completely taking on the burden themselves by isolating themselves exists.
 
Will.NFFC said:
But most other countries in Europe did lock down much quicker than us and it remains a shit show so I don’t know why you think it makes a difference, particularly given we did get deaths down to about zero.

Also, the science on this has hardly been a beacon of truth. The government had to retract their own death projection because watch dog found that it was greatly exaggerated.

In regards to your question on being left unchecked - my point isn’t about leaving it left to its own devices but around having a targeted approach rather than an utterly ridiculous blanket one.

What’s being completely forgotten in all the chaos is that this virus has a 99.6% survival rate and if you’re under 40, you’re about as likely to die from
It as being hit by a bus.... that’s not suggesting that the unfortunate few that do aren’t a tragedy - of course they are, but all loss of life is a tragedy and the measures are frankly an abomination and have been in place for nearly a whole year with no sign of let up.

I think the reason I get so irate about it, is that the government have shown ZERO statistical evidence to back up these measures.

No stats by hospital about how many are overrun, which was a key argument from the pro lockdown side. No discussion about WHY counties and cities are going to certain tiers when the rate of infection is lower than others. Then there are things like false positives and how that impacts the total number and people who have allegedly passed from Covid when the tested negative!!!

These are HUGE factors and I’m in total shock that the population don’t DEMAND these figures/issues explained or justified given so many of our liberties have been taken away.

As somebody who finds this government so repugnant and dishonest (me too btw), do you not find it unbelievable that they’ve not been put to task on this and the media haven’t heaped that pressure on?
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Dont be that surprised, from a population that has been blagged into brexit. For all our superior nation shit, as a country, we are not the sharpest tools in the box are we.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
I agree with most of this.

I don't know about lockdowns. I would like to agree with you, but the hospitals are almost full now and the numbers dying are scary as it is

The reality is that if this vaccination doesn't work then it won't take forever before the young decide that the old are not worth the cost to them. Humans are social creatures and won't consent to live like this forever when the alternative of the vulnerable completely taking on the burden themselves by isolating themselves exists.
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I'm doing this already. But Because of my health I'm able to do this.
Not everyone that're vulnerable can though. Lot's are still having to go to work or care for others.
 
radfordinlondon said:
Dont be that surprised, from a population that has been blagged into brexit. For all our superior nation shit, as a country, we are not the sharpest tools in the box are we.
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Fair. At least with brexit there’s been actual media scrutiny. Disgusted by how the media have behaved. Not an ounce of questioning.

I’d happily never discuss leaving the EU again if it meant lifting these Covid measures.
 
Will.NFFC said:
But most other countries in Europe did lock down much quicker than us and it remains a shit show so I don’t know why you think it makes a difference, particularly given we did get deaths down to about zero.

Also, the science on this has hardly been a beacon of truth. The government had to retract their own death projection because watch dog found that it was greatly exaggerated.

In regards to your question on being left unchecked - my point isn’t about leaving it left to its own devices but around having a targeted approach rather than an utterly ridiculous blanket one.

What’s being completely forgotten in all the chaos is that this virus has a 99.6% survival rate and if you’re under 40, you’re about as likely to die from
It as being hit by a bus.... that’s not suggesting that the unfortunate few that do aren’t a tragedy - of course they are, but all loss of life is a tragedy and the measures are frankly an abomination and have been in place for nearly a whole year with no sign of let up.

I think the reason I get so irate about it, is that the government have shown ZERO statistical evidence to back up these measures.

No stats by hospital about how many are overrun, which was a key argument from the pro lockdown side. No discussion about WHY counties and cities are going to certain tiers when the rate of infection is lower than others. Then there are things like false positives and how that impacts the total number and people who have allegedly passed from Covid when the tested negative!!!

These are HUGE factors and I’m in total shock that the population don’t DEMAND these figures/issues explained or justified given so many of our liberties have been taken away.

As somebody who finds this government so repugnant and dishonest (me too btw), do you not find it unbelievable that they’ve not been put to task on this and the media haven’t heaped that pressure on?
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99.6% survival rate leaves 268,000 dead IF the health service continues to function well, which of course it wouldn't because the beds and corridors would be full and the staff would be isolating, sick, or dead. So the death toll would be much higher than that. More people would be off work due to grief, more people would have long covid, the mental health toll would likely be worse still, and so on. It would not save the economy.

You might not have seen it but there is an avalanche of data with respect to the questions you have. It isn't only happening in the UK either. There has been a lot of scrutiny. There are many countries with differing strategies against which we can compare our performance. It isn't good.
There was an argument on here last week about whether we were actually the very worst in the world, or only about 5th or 6th!
 
in_the_top_one said:
99.6% survival rate leaves 268,000 dead IF the health service continues to function well, which of course it wouldn't because the beds and corridors would be full and the staff would be isolating, sick, or dead. So the death toll would be much higher than that. More people would be off work due to grief, more people would have long covid, the mental health toll would likely be worse still, and so on. It would not save the economy.

You might not have seen it but there is an avalanche of data with respect to the questions you have. It isn't only happening in the UK either. There has been a lot of scrutiny. There are many countries with differing strategies against which we can compare our performance. It isn't good.
There was an argument on here last week about whether we were actually the very worst in the world, or only about 5th or 6th!
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How can you possibly conclude that mental health would be worse than it currently is now. I’m sorry but that is pure tunnel vision - it’s on its knees. There are THOUSANDS of jobs lost and the suicide rate is considerably higher.

Can you also advise how trying to get people back into work and opening up the rest of the world wouldn’t help the economy?

There simply isn’t an avalanche of data at all that explains my questions. If you can point me in the direction that would be appreciated, but more importantly, why should anyone have to trawl the internet to find data.

It should be a given that measures as restrictive as these come with very clear rationale and explanation from the government, particularly the tiering. There hadn’t been anywhere near enough on false positives and false deaths attributed to Covid.

Hospitality industry also has a low transmission rate and yet schools remain open whilst pubs and clubs continue to be completely handicapped.
 
From the Guardian website:
Trump claims to be 'working tirelessly' but leaves Covid relief in disarray

  • President flies to Florida after throwing party ‘under a bus’
This is fake news. Even an idiot like Trump would find a better place to have a party.
 
Will.NFFC said:
How can you possibly conclude that mental health would be worse than it currently is now. I’m sorry but that is pure tunnel vision - it’s on its knees. There are THOUSANDS of jobs lost and the suicide rate is considerably higher.

Can you also advise how trying to get people back into work and opening up the rest of the world wouldn’t help the economy?

There simply isn’t an avalanche of data at all that explains my questions. If you can point me in the direction that would be appreciated, but more importantly, why should anyone have to trawl the internet to find data.

It should be a given that measures as restrictive as these come with very clear rationale and explanation from the government, particularly the tiering. There hadn’t been anywhere near enough on false positives and false deaths attributed to Covid.

Hospitality industry also has a low transmission rate and yet schools remain open whilst pubs and clubs continue to be completely handicapped.
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Ok. Why are people losing their jobs?
 
Will.NFFC said:
But if lockdowns haven’t worked, how do you do it?
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A) they have 'worked' - not completely, that's impossible unless we all had an allotment and no contact with anyone. But it's clear that taking them dramatically slows the spread, it's also clear that doing them too late along with a mediocre T&T programme (that sadly lost much public confidence before it started) means they are less effective and take longer to work.

B) There just isn't a solution to a pandemic, it's also going to be a balancing act between freedoms, economics and saving lives. All require sacrifices, all have consequences for the other.
 
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