Charlton game thread | Page 22 | Vital Football

Charlton game thread

Hardy Forest said:
Sorry Pope, I wasnt critisising you, it was others.
No, I don't think we will be challenging, but I think we should be, after all the sackings and promises, otherwise what was the point?
Consistently poor decision making when it comes to managers and players.
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I agree.

If you look at models of clubs that have won promotion, which one are we following?

Every so often a team wins a surprise promotion with little money spent and we spent years never hearing the end of it. Sheffield United now, previously it has been Huddersfield, Burnley or Blackpool. We aren't following their models for promotion.

Far more often is a fairly recently relegated side with already good players (Norwich) or a team that just spends a lot of money over a period of time.

We aren't following those models either.

I'm not exactly sure what path to promotion we are forging. Maybe if it works they'll name it after us and 'doing a forest' won't mean spending 3 years in league one
 
What I like so far:

His faith in the likes of Cash and Worrall which has been amply repaid.

Our defensive solidity - kudos to Lamouichi here.

How we've reacted to being under the cosh.

The last 30 minutes v Brum.

The managers honesty.

What concerns me (apart from our incompetence off the pitch):

Our reliance on Grabban.

Our inability to create - which was by far the biggest issue we needed to address.

Ball retention.


I'm currently neutral on:

Style, I understand why we've gone out to be solid first and play second but that does need addressing.

New players, I think we've seen glimpses of potential here, some more than others and it's not an easy adaptation to make. Though nobody has shown more than glimpses.
 
I wouldn't disagree with much of that CP. Not so sure about the honesty bit though. He was last game, but there have been other games where his post match interview sounded pretty clueless. The West Brom one for a start. Though I guess the language barrier does play a part.
 
Hardy Forest said:
I wouldn't disagree with much of that CP. Not so sure about the honesty bit though. He was last game, but there have been other games where his post match interview sounded pretty clueless. The West Brom one for a start. Though I guess the language barrier does play a part.
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I think possibly you're just a bit pissed off about managerial and recruitment decisions over the last umpteen years and you're allowing it to cloud your perspective a touch. Not that you don't make valid points but I think you'd decided your pint was half empty before the season even started.

Just as it could be argued that I'm biased again fascist, terrorist, cheating, drug dealers..
 
Hardy Forest said:
Exactly my point Apollyon. A team gutted of a lot of their best players, having to bring in a raft of cheap replacements. So starting in a worse position than us, but having an excellent start.
Your using the excuse of new players etc, but doesn't seem to be effecting them too much?
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You really need to check your facts when you repeat garbage like "a team gutted of their best players".

They disposed of 17 players in the close season, 7 of whom had not played a single game for the first team.

Of those 17 players, 13 were released upon the end of their contracts, 2 went on free transfers and 2 sold for money - one for 2m and one for 180k.

Hardly gutting the first team, is it?

The incoming players cost next to nothing, but that is hardly surprising as Duchatelet has refused to invest any of his own money into the Club; they were, however, a distinct upgrade on the players they let go.
 
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I've seen both home games live and Charlton on ifollow.

After four tough fixtures we've done OK - for a side with too many new players to even use the word 'team' yet.

If Silva's shot in injury time had gone in we'd be in the top six.

Not altogether happy with the way we shoehorn new managers and players in, but SL has something about him and I hope he gets us into the sunny uplands. Tomorrow is another big test.
 
We'll see if Lamouchi can set us up well defensively tomorrow like he did at Leeds. Pope alluded to it after the game at Bellend Road. I'd be delighted to come away with a battling point at Fulham.
Pope John XXIII said:
Manager- ? - still not sure. Not convinced I like him. I would love to say this was a Karanka like masterclass of preparation and defensive nous. Not quite sure I totally believe that though
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Calvin Plummer said:
What I like so far:

His faith in the likes of Cash and Worrall which has been amply repaid.

Our defensive solidity - kudos to Lamouichi here.

How we've reacted to being under the cosh.

The last 30 minutes v Brum.

The managers honesty.

What concerns me (apart from our incompetence off the pitch):

Our reliance on Grabban.

Our inability to create - which was by far the biggest issue we needed to address.

Ball retention.


I'm currently neutral on:

Style, I understand why we've gone out to be solid first and play second but that does need addressing.

New players, I think we've seen glimpses of potential here, some more than others and it's not an easy adaptation to make. Though nobody has shown more than glimpses.
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I concur with that, I would only add that with carv out and lolly not hitting full throttle yet ( and now taking a knock) we are looking likely to improve in the creativity area that you are concerned about. We are building a foundation for the season at this point and I am far more content than I was six months ago.
 
InvincibleBrianMan said:
I concur with that, I would only add that with carv out and lolly not hitting full throttle yet ( and now taking a knock) we are looking likely to improve in the creativity area that you are concerned about. We are building a foundation for the season at this point and I am far more content than I was six months ago.
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Agreed, however we had a very in form Lolley last year and there's no guarantee he'll replicate, nor is he a unknown proposition to teams now - watch him being regularly doubled up on now. We also don't know if Carvalho will kick on (I tend to think he will).

However assuming they both replicate their succes from last year, along with Grabban, that still leaves us 20 goals shy of where we want to be. Right now it's hard to see where they're coming from.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
Standard for promotion, which is what I was talking about. We could alternatively talk pedantry while you start an argument again if you prefer?

Or better still, you could muster an actual argument rather than just asking questions of others.

Do you believe the squad we have signed this summer is capable of winning promotion under this manager? Bare in mind that the evidence doesn't point to him having years to achieve this
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The answer is that I don't know what this team or manager is capable of after so few games. If I did, I would stick a wedge on
 
Calvin Plummer said:
We are lucky to go back to Nottingham with a point because they played much better than us, especially in the first half.

They were quicker, more aggressive and more compact.

It was not before the 40th minute when we made more than three passes.

We played very bad.
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Thanks CP , agree we were lucky in that we were sh-t and didn’t lose. Don’t agree we were lucky due to bad finishing from Charlton
 
Hardy Forest said:
Sorry Pope, I wasnt critisising you, it was others.
No, I don't think we will be challenging, but I think we should be, after all the sackings and promises, otherwise what was the point?
Consistently poor decision making when it comes to managers and players.
Click to expand...

Jury still out on that. Every year this question/statement is raised and the answer is the same every time. Still too early.

We can only assess indicators at this point imo
 
It's far too early to say whether we will finish top 10, bottom 10.
There are green shoots and a defensive improvement under Lamouchi. The jury is out on several players and Lamouchi must do more to create chances.

CP is spot on as this was the area needing quality recruitment.
There is something about Mir that I like, no idea what, but there are glimpses of a decent player. Grabban is struggling in the lone striker role and the sooner Carvalho returns, the better. Although there needs to be a change in formation as Carvalho may struggle as an orthodox midfielder in a 433.

The partnership of Worrall and Dawson is looking good. Dawson is mentoring Worrall and we can all see the improvement shown by Worrall.

Providing we aren't bottom of the table I would like to see the owner show faith in Lamouchi and let him manage for his entire contract.
A large part of our problem stems from the ridiculous turnover of managers. Some continuity would go a long way and I genuinely believe Lamouchi is a good manager.
 
Sometimes you also just have to give kudos to the opposition. Yes we were disappointing especially early on, but actually they just played really well and limited what we could achieve.

We wont always come up against teams in great form and the fact we hung in there and ultimately took some control and a point (thanks especially to our CBs and keeper) is a good sign.
 
I love the way people always think we have a tough run of games. If it's a club like Stoke or west brom then they are prem quality or if Charlton or Brum then, unbeaten or a boggie team. The fixtures are tough but if we have expectations of doing well it shouldn't matter. On a separate point, what are pants, bridcutt, Cummings, Clough, ariyibi, yacob and Murphy actually doing? Do they train with first team, get the weekends off?
 
Mike78 said:
I love the way people always think we have a tough run of games. If it's a club like Stoke or west brom then they are prem quality or if Charlton or Brum then, unbeaten or a boggie team. The fixtures are tough but if we have expectations of doing well it shouldn't matter. On a separate point, what are pants, bridcutt, Cummings, Clough, ariyibi, yacob and Murphy actually doing? Do they train with first team, get the weekends off?
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We'll have played the two best teams in the division away plus two bogey sides at home by the end of the month.

It's isn't 'always' a tough run of fixtures. October looks a great month for picking up points
 
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