Bishop Injury?

[cherryexile]

Taylor being subbed every game is very strange he certainly doesn't looked injured and was absolutely furious on Saturday when subbed.
House stays on and looking like he's struggling.

If I was a sports journalist covering the Imps I'd asking why he's subbed, is it just to bring on fresh legs upfront?

I think the Taylor substitutions are as much about changing the style a little and playing a different way. Both Draper and Makama bring more height, physical presence and the ability to hold up the ball, which aren't Taylor's strengths. This means we can pump the ball forward a little more and hold it in the opposition half.

I don't think I would be feeling too comfortable as a centre-half having played 65 minutes seeing either of our replacements running onto the field.

 

[imp_floyd]

Stats for league games this season*

Total minutes played

Rank	Player	Minutes played
1​	L Jensen	3870​
2​	E Erhahon	3649​
3​	L Sorenson	3548​
4​	P O'Connor	3164​
5​	S Roughan	3065​
6​	A Alex Mitchell	2783​
7​	E Hamilton	2541​
8​	A Jackson	2456​
9​	R Hackett-Fairchild	2219​
10​	D Mandroiu	2003​
11​	E Bishop	1953​
12​	J Burroughs	1818​
13​	J Taylor	1312​
14​	T Eyoma	1245​
15​	B House	1228​
16​	A Smith	1042​
17​	J Makama	953​
18​	H Adelakun	875​
19​	D Duffy	822​
20​	J Moylan	737​
21​	F Draper	638​
22​	J Brown	385​
23​	C McGrandles	368​
24​	J Vale	346​
25​	T Walker	197​
26​	J Wright	90​
27​	O Shodipo	85​
28​	O Gallagher	2​

As you would expect, this correlates with number of starts:

Rank	Player	Starts
1​	L Jensen	43​
2​	L Sorenson	41​
2​	E Erhahon	41​
4​	P O'Connor	35​
5​	S Roughan	34​
6​	A Alex Mitchell	32​
7​	E Hamilton	29​
8​	R Hackett-Fairchild	28​
9​	A Jackson	27​
10​	D Mandroiu	24​
11​	E Bishop	22​
12​	J Burroughs	21​
13​	J Taylor	17​
14​	B House	15​
15​	T Eyoma	13​
16​	A Smith	11​
17​	H Adelakun	9​
18​	J Makama	8​
19​	J Moylan	7​
19​	F Draper	7​
19​	D Duffy	7​
22​	C McGrandles	4​
22​	J Brown	4​
24​	T Walker	2​
24​	J Vale	2​
26​	J Wright	1​

Source: https://www.soccerbase.com/teams/team.sd?team_id=1559&season_id=156&teamTabs=results

*Includes minutes played in the abandoned Leyton game (which Bishop started, but didn't play in the replay). This is a mistake in the source data

 

[Ruskingtony]

Until Skubala came I was firmly in the 'let Bishop go at end of contract' camp.
But Ted has flourished under Skubala who has recognised were to play him. I honestly think he has been a massive part of our storming run up the table.
Sadly he has got injured again at probably the worst time for us.
If this is an unfortunate injury that any player could get and not a reoccurring one that could keep coming back then I would seriously think about offering Ted another short term contract with an option to extend.
But obviously Ted at this stage of his career will have to way up his future and any financial stability for his family and may get offers from elsewhere. But I am sure the club will handle any decision in the right way and probably already have their plans well sorted for next season.

 

[clanfordimp]

Yeh I know all that about Taylor.

But you need to decide if you want to try to win things or not. Good players win games and we now have some good players.

We have some good players injured Hackett, Montsma, Hamilton, McGrandles, Walker, Bishop and have had others Mandroiu, House out at various times.

...but if one good player gets injured and you have another one, you will be okay.

Mandroiu or Moylan or whoever will step in.

Now more than ever, we can cope with 30 odd lots of 70 minutes of Bishop, interspersed with 25 lots of 70 minutes from Mandroiu and so on.

It's about good players...and Bishop is a good player.

By contrast...we have Ali Smith a player who will probably play 50 games on the trot and be not quite good enough.

Just ask yourself Bishop or Ali Smith most likely to help us beat Portsmouth...

...and that will apply next season.

The only worry I have is will he get a better offer.

Well, yeah I see your point but then I suppose its up to the club on whether they can afford to keep up his level of wages for the amount of games we get out of him and whether they are prepared to offer him a new contract knowing his injury record.

As I say I like Bishop as a player but for me I think we now have to take it up a notch. There are good players out there and we have to try and build on this second half of the seasons success.

For me we are now past that stage of signing good players on the cheap because of their injury record, Walsh, Bridcutt, Walker, Bishop, all of them good players but spent most of the time sat on the treatment table, not their fault because all players want to play, but you can't be a good player and contribute if your not playing, not to mention the amount of wages you are draining out of the club.

You have to make hard nose business decisions and I think that as much as i like Bishop and as much as a fit Walker is a decent player their injury records tell me that they probably will be out injured more than they would be available to play.

Based on that I would release them both but that is only my own personal opinion and I totally respect and get peoples opinions on making a case for keeping Bishop but not Walker.

 

[cdhIMP]

There is no doubt that on his day Teddy is one of the best players in the division.

However, given his availability over the three year period and perhaps given his recent availability has only been higher due to needing a new deal, I wouldn't be too keen on keeping him.

Montsma, Bishop and Walker are all likely to be in the top 10 earners in the squad and we need our top earners (which should be our best players) to be available regularly. Of course it is through no fault of their own that they are injured but all three had historical and regular injuries issues prior to joining us.

 

[Ruskingtony]

I believe Walker has another year on his contract so almost certainly won't be going anywhere next season.
I have already said what I think re Bishop.
But Montsma another difficult one. Saw him at the Wigan game mingling with fans and always smiling and interacting positively with them. I am sure he is being assessed constantly by the club.A fit Montsma would fit right into a Skubala team. If our medical team consider him fully fit I would again consider offering a short term contract with an extension clause in it.

 

[mikeosullivan]

Even apart from Bishop's low number of starts over the three years of his contract, I think most would agree (apart from a very few) that Bishop would not be starting for us now if Hamilton and McGrandles were fit. The midfield would be Erhahon, McGrandles, and Hamilton

What we have learned with Bishop over the last two months is that he is not consistently fit enough to reliably deputise for any of those three. Something we are really suffering from at the most important time of the season for us.

Its pure economics that you can't have one of your highest earners unable to contribute in this way.

I don't mind Bishop staying as a back up and impact sub, but it has to be a one year deal on a much reduced contract. If we gets a better offer elsewhere, then that would be fine. As we found with Walsh, there are equally good alternatives out there who can play 40 games a season.

If we miss the playoffs by a very small margin, most will look back and say it was because of unfortunate long term injuries in midfield at exactly the wrong time of the season. However when your most experienced midfielder is not one of those long term injured and still can't step in to deputise and contribute, then he is just not an asset. However talented he can be.

 

[cdhIMP]

I believe Walker has another year on his contract so almost certainly won't be going anywhere next season.
I have already said what I think re Bishop.
But Montsma another difficult one. Saw him at the Wigan game mingling with fans and always smiling and interacting positively with them. I am sure he is being assessed constantly by the club.A fit Montsma would fit right into a Skubala team. If our medical team consider him fully fit I would again consider offering a short term contract with an extension clause in it.

Yes Walker has another year. Just mentioned him as he has been injured all season not that he is out of contract :)

 

[cdhIMP]

Even apart from Bishop's low number of starts over the three years of his contract, I think most would agree (apart from a very few) that Bishop would not be starting for us now if Hamilton and McGrandles were fit. The midfield would be Erhahon, McGrandles, and Hamilton

What we have learned with Bishop over the last two months is that he is not consistently fit enough to reliably deputise for any of those three. Something we are really suffering from at the most important time of the season for us.

Its pure economics that you can't have one of your highest earners unable to contribute in this way.

I don't mind Bishop staying as a back up and impact sub, but it has to be a one year deal on a much reduced contract. If we gets a better offer elsewhere, then that would be fine. As we found with Walsh, there are equally good alternatives out there who can play 40 games a season.

If we miss the playoffs by a very small margin, most will look back and say it was because of unfortunate long term injuries in midfield at exactly the wrong time of the season. However when your most experienced midfielder is not one of those long term injured and still can't step in to deputise and contribute, then he is just not an asset. However talented he can be.

If we did somehow make the play offs then I assume Ali Smith would rejoin the squad for the play offs? Well, at least be available.

 

[Skip155]

I believe Walker has another year on his contract so almost certainly won't be going anywhere next season.
I have already said what I think re Bishop.
But Montsma another difficult one. Saw him at the Wigan game mingling with fans and always smiling and interacting positively with them. I am sure he is being assessed constantly by the club.A fit Montsma would fit right into a Skubala team. If our medical team consider him fully fit I would again consider offering a short term contract with an extension clause in it.

If you seek out Montsma’s Instagram account he posted photos of him ‘on the grass’ 14 hours ago. That was his first Instagram post. Fingers crossed he’s progressing well.

 

[nlondonimp]

Even apart from Bishop's low number of starts over the three years of his contract, I think most would agree (apart from a very few) that Bishop would not be starting for us now if Hamilton and McGrandles were fit. The midfield would be Erhahon, McGrandles, and Hamilton

What we have learned with Bishop over the last two months is that he is not consistently fit enough to reliably deputise for any of those three. Something we are really suffering from at the most important time of the season for us.

Its pure economics that you can't have one of your highest earners unable to contribute in this way.

I don't mind Bishop staying as a back up and impact sub, but it has to be a one year deal on a much reduced contract. If we gets a better offer elsewhere, then that would be fine. As we found with Walsh, there are equally good alternatives out there who can play 40 games a season.

If we miss the playoffs by a very small margin, most will look back and say it was because of unfortunate long term injuries in midfield at exactly the wrong time of the season. However when your most experienced midfielder is not one of those long term injured and still can't step in to deputise and contribute, then he is just not an asset. However talented he can be.

You say: "What we have learned with Bishop over the last two months is that he is not consistently fit enough to reliably deputise for any of those three. Something we are really suffering from at the most important time of the season for us."
Your timing in making this point seems to be way off.
You need to include both Hamilton and mcgrandles as well, in saying what we are missing in central midfield right now.

Both have also been absent for all of, or a very large part of, a run of 1 defeat in 18.

The best two central midfielders to support erhahon (the absolute lynchpin of the midfield, and star midfielder at the club) might be debatable. Surely what is not in dispute is we are currently enjoying the best run of results for many seasons without two of the ones you mention.

What I see is a squad that on results is about second or third in the second half of the season table. And a coaching team that have successfully adapted the midfield to cover lots of changes due to injuries, and set up midfield differently to suit lots of opposition, as they continued to do as recently as Tuesday.

Unfortunately injuries are a fact of life the way football is today, and thank goodness skubala has said it is a squad game. he has not said it is a game where you need just your three best midfielders available every game. This includes subbing players off to suit the coach, as much as due to fitness to carry on - finishers - as per rugby Union. Prime example would be moylan as recently as Tuesday night.

 

[cdhIMP]

If you seek out Montsma’s Instagram account he posted photos of him ‘on the grass’ 14 hours ago. That was his first Instagram post. Fingers crossed he’s progressing well.

Wish him all of the best and hope he does get back playing. To have done your ACL three times is often career ending at the elite level.

If he can prove his fitness, perhaps he could be retained on a one year deal on lower terms that suit us.

 

[Davidimp]

I think the Taylor substitutions are as much about changing the style a little and playing a different way. Both Draper and Makama bring more height, physical presence and the ability to hold up the ball, which aren't Taylor's strengths. This means we can pump the ball forward a little more and hold it in the opposition half.

I don't think I would be feeling too comfortable as a centre-half having played 65 minutes seeing either of our replacements running onto the field.

Very fair analysis mate

 

[Davidimp]

If we did somehow make the play offs then I assume Ali Smith would rejoin the squad for the play offs? Well, at least be available.

League one and two both finish next Saturday so that may add a few bodies to the squad if nothing else as you say.

 

[Red Wimp]

Totally agree with mike and have never changed my stance in the Bishop situation.

I like him, he's a great footballer but he is also one of those players that must be a nightmare for the coach because when he's fit and on song he's one of the first on the team sheet, but unfortunately for Teddy he's never been able to get a real run of consistent selection in the team because of the amount of injuries he has picked up.

No doubt you can manipulate the figures to suit your narrative but 17 starts in 3 seasons is way below what you would expect from a coach for one of you senior players. I would think based on that it not be a wise football or business decision to be offering him a new contract especially because he will be a high earner in the squad and the return you are getting on your investment is negligible and that money could be spent a lot more wisely.

Harsh, maybe but he is not getting any younger and his body will only deteriorate faster as he gets older so for me it would be purely from a business sense taking in his previous appearance record and the amount of time he has been out injured or only fit enough for the bench that we don't offer him a new contract.

Where does 17 starts in 3 seasons come from?

 

[Red Wimp]

Any reliable source for the oft repeated (on here at least) claim that he is one of our highest paid players? I would have thought signings made more recently with the US investment might be?

 

[cdhIMP]

Where does 17 starts in 3 seasons come from?

Given it appears from this article that he has made 21 starts in League One this season, the original claim is full 90 minutes completed.

Teddy Bishop - Detailed stats (Detailed view)

This is the detailed performance data of Teddy Bishop of Lincoln City. It shows the data (goals, bookings, etc.) at {vereinsZuweisung} in the 23/24 season.

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

 

[Davidimp]

Completed 90 minutes 17 times?

 

[clanfordimp]

Given it appears from this article that he has made 21 starts in League One this season, the original claim appears to be garbage.

Teddy Bishop - Detailed stats (Detailed view)

This is the detailed performance data of Teddy Bishop of Lincoln City. It shows the data (goals, bookings, etc.) at {vereinsZuweisung} in the 23/24 season.

www.transfermarkt.co.uk

Without throwing him under the bus the quote was from @Scotimp. Post #30

Having looked at it again it looks like that he is quoting completed games having played the full 90 minutes.

He may well have started other games that he did not complete and was substituted for whatever reason.

 

[cdhIMP]

Without throwing him under the bus the quote was from @Scotimp. Post #30

Having looked at it again it looks like that he is quoting completed games having played the full 90 minutes.

He may well have started other games that he did not complete and was substituted for whatever reason.

Yes have amended my post accordingly cheers. Crossed wires apologies for my part in it.