Shamima Begum | Page 16 | Vital Football

Shamima Begum

valenciagill said:
We should have the death penalty for treason.
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I thought I'd look up the legal definition of treason and discovered that the treason laws were created to stop lowlifes shagging royalty. Obviously, they have changed since the 14th century, but James Hewitt coukd have been charged with high treason for showing Lady Di a bit of TLC....so glad I turned her down🤫
 
Britain stands on rights for all citizens under British values and rights fought for over hundreds of years.

This is about those rights and not about this one case. What if in the future we decide that any british citizen living abroad should lose their citizenship without legal redress for whatever crime or supposed misdemeanour then where is the British fair play.
This is similar to freedom of speech, protection of the individual protects us all.
 
Jerryattrick said:
This is similar to freedom of speech, protection of the individual protects us all.
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In theory , yes Jerry. But in practice ?

Somewhere in the UK , someone will be losing their job/career because they express perfectly legitimate views , that might not be accepted as 'woke'
 
valenciagill said:
In theory , yes Jerry. But in practise ?

Somewhere in the UK , someone will be losing their job/career because they express perfectly legitimate views , that might not be accepted as 'woke'
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We have fought for and held our freedoms since medieval times plus magna carta and the declaration of rights. Need to protect them whether we agree with the persons actions or speech or not.
 
No one seems bothered about the rights of the Brits that she watched being beheaded (her words) or the victims of the Manchester bombing (mainly children) that she said was a justifiable act.
I'm all for people having their rights but if you're happy having someone who harbours those thoughts about the children of this country living here, then good luck. I'm dreading the day we all look back after some atrocity and people question the police and security services for "losing track" of her, allowing her to plan it.
I'd love for her to stand trial for the things she has said about our citizens but we all know she won't.
 
Islamic Fundamentalism was never my speciality but as a citizen, I’d say that she should be returned to stand trial for belonging to a prescribed terrorist organisation.
If convicted, then off to jail.
It’s irrational to think that we can dump our criminals on to other countries.
 
Nobby_66 said:
No one seems bothered about the rights of the Brits that she watched being beheaded (her words) or the victims of the Manchester bombing (mainly children) that she said was a justifiable act.
I'm all for people having their rights but if you're happy having someone who harbours those thoughts about the children of this country living here, then good luck. I'm dreading the day we all look back after some atrocity and people question the police and security services for "losing track" of her, allowing her to plan it.
I'd love for her to stand trial for the things she has said about our citizens but we all know she won't.
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I share your feelings about her words regarding those atrocities but that's the second issue. The first is one of citizenship, which will be decided by the courts. I think she is our responsibility and that she should be admitted back into her country. I believe that she will then face the courts a second time for any crimes committed but we need to accept that words are less serious than actions and that evidence is essential.

Leave her in a camp and she and others will raise another generation of haters radicalised by camp life. She or they could one day come back to haunt us, or others. There is no simple FU answer to this but emptying the camps and putting as many as possible through a legal process is essential for the victims and to deter future recruits.
 
Nobby_66 said:
No one seems bothered about the rights of the Brits that she watched being beheaded (her words) or the victims of the Manchester bombing (mainly children) that she said was a justifiable act.
I'm all for people having their rights but if you're happy having someone who harbours those thoughts about the children of this country living here, then good luck. I'm dreading the day we all look back after some atrocity and people question the police and security services for "losing track" of her, allowing her to plan it.
I'd love for her to stand trial for the things she has said about our citizens but we all know she won't.
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Thats the whole point. The law must be upheld, anyone coming back here must be tried and if the laws are not tight enough then change the law.

Many have already come back so why do the media and politicians not make as much, if any noise about them, lets just pick on one individual for a knee jerk reaction. Take away her citizenship without a trial and its all sorted, lets ignore the others. Solves nothing.
 
Nobby_66 said:
No one seems bothered about the rights of the Brits that she watched being beheaded (her words) or the victims of the Manchester bombing (mainly children) that she said was a justifiable act.
I'm all for people having their rights but if you're happy having someone who harbours those thoughts about the children of this country living here, then good luck. I'm dreading the day we all look back after some atrocity and people question the police and security services for "losing track" of her, allowing her to plan it.
I'd love for her to stand trial for the things she has said about our citizens but we all know she won't.
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As a copper, I thought that you would believe in the principle of ‘innocent until proven guilty’. It’s worrying that a policeman has formed an opinion of guilt before any trial.

Nobody is saying that her behaviour is acceptable.

Nobody is saying that the victims of terrorism don’t matter.
 
Trashbat said:
As a copper, I thought that you would believe in the principle of ‘innocent until proven guilty’. It’s worrying that a policeman has formed an opinion of guilt before any trial.

Nobody is saying that her behaviour is acceptable.

Nobody is saying that the victims of terrorism don’t matter.
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Where have I said she is guilty of anything?

What worries me is that someone would deliberately misquote me in an attempt to discredit me
 
Normally someone accused of a crime stands trial in the country where the alleged offence was committed. This should apply in her case. If found innocent then she is allowed to return to the UK. If guilty, then after she has served her sentence.
 
Nobby_66 said:
Where have I said she is guilty of anything?

What worries me is that someone would deliberately misquote me in an attempt to discredit me
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You didn’t. You implied that she may still be radicalised and may be “allowed to plan”. I couldn’t conclude from the last paragraph whether you think she committed crimes through her speech but that this Government will intentionally give her the slip (I noted the speech marks around lose track earlier, as well as the quote above). Otherwise you think she hasn’t committed crimes but in a perfect world her speech etc would count as crimes.
 
Trev_GFC said:
You didn’t. You implied that she may still be radicalised and may be “allowed to plan”. I couldn’t conclude from the last paragraph whether you think she committed crimes through her speech but that this Government will intentionally give her the slip (I noted the speech marks around lose track earlier, as well as the quote above). Otherwise you think she hasn’t committed crimes but in a perfect world her speech etc would count as crimes.
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Would be interesting to know if her words are deemed as hate speech.
 
Jerryattrick said:
Would be interesting to know if her words are deemed as hate speech.
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It would Jerry.
The definition is specific.
To the very best of my knowledge, she hasn’t actually been accused of committing any crime.
She may be guilty of belonging to a terrorist organisation.
 
PhilK66 said:
Normally someone accused of a crime stands trial in the country where the alleged offence was committed. This should apply in her case. If found innocent then she is allowed to return to the UK. If guilty, then after she has served her sentence.
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What country and what crime? From what I have read, she hasn't actually been charged with anything...anywhere!
 
Why cant she go to Bangladesh to be with her father? He's made some comments that suggest he supports her and her past.
 
She shunned her British citizenship in favour of becoming a citizen of the Islamic state, as I said earlier, once every other citizen suffering any sort of hardship in the country finds a resolution, then we can consider wasting time and money on looking at the case of someone who hold our country in contempt.
 
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