What Is Happening To Defensive Football | Page 2 | Vital Football

What Is Happening To Defensive Football

steveperryman said:
Yeah i've noticed that as well. Thing is there are an awful lot of teams playing a high line, very badly.

The rule changes have favoured attackers as defensive units are still coming to terms with them. Until they're clarified or ammended by the powers that be, i don't expect that to change anytime soon.
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I think I read or heard somewhere that the rule changes were to favour the attackers, thus more goals and more entertainment, I could be wrong.
 
meee93 said:
How spursy of us to hire arguably the best defensive manager of all time, only for football to change so that defending becomes more difficult and attacking more rewarding.
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Yep best defensive coach = best attacking team lol! I actually think JM said that himself.
 
Welshtel said:
I’m all for attacking and it’s great to see us breaking down defences and getting the ball in the net but I want to see clean sheets. I thought Villa were terrific in taking Liverpool part, what great forward passes and shooting. Can we have some of that please?
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Am with you there Welshy, but though Villa attacked brilliantly they still conceded 2 goals.
 
Rule changes to favour attackers.
Lack of preseason to help get organised.
A focus on defenders having the skill to pass rather than the focus being to defend first.
RBs and LBs are asked to be wingers so inevitably their defensive ability suffer.
Wing backs being so high up the pitch that it is difficult to keep a solid back 4.
More managers adopting philosophies that encourage risk taking build up play rather than safety first clearing your lines
More and more being asked of players physically for many years so potentially it is starting to impact.
Fatigue of the short break and lack of preseason mean players can't press as effectively.
Players are generally better physically conditioned so are able to punish any small lapse.

Maybe the lack of fans are having an impact too, but I think we'll have to judge that over a longer time period. Maybe the last few weeks have just been an anomaly and teams will become better organised and we will see a drop in the number of goals.

Maybe we have the best CBs in the world after all but football has changed so they can't be blamed for the lack of clean sheets...
 
Spursex said:
There is another sinple reason, normally in pre-season coaches will work their defensive units hard to be aware, be tight ,work on maintiainng a line, working to a system etc - this time around alot of these defensive units look like they are strangers playing together. I've just watched the leicester and Villa games - and the defenders are running around like headless chickens with no defensive dicipline at all - give it a month and we'll all be moaning at the lack of goals in the PL...
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Ex, but there is no explanation whatsoever why Pool's defence was all over the place. Same back line that won the PL at a canter. Furthermore, very unusual for Klopp to allow that to continue for full 90 mins.

May be the managers can't give out discreet instructions for the fear of being heard on the other side of the echo chamber!
 
Critical_Spur said:
Ex, but there is no explanation whatsoever why Pool's defence was all over the place. Same back line that won the PL at a canter. Furthermore, very unusual for Klopp to allow that to continue for full 90 mins.

May be the managers can't give out discreet instructions for the fear of being heard on the other side of the echo chamber!
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Credit to Villa though. They took a chance and pushed Grealish and McGinn right up on Liverpool's backline. They wouldn't have done that a year ago.

And maybe Klopp doesn't have a plan B!
 
Gary Onedaysoon said:
Credit to Villa though. They took a chance and pushed Grealish and McGinn right up on Liverpool's backline. They wouldn't have done that a year ago.

And maybe Klopp doesn't have a plan B!
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Grealish was superb and Villa have figured out how to use him to his best.

Everytime I watch him now, I almost cry at how close we came to getting him for a paltry £15 million.

Villa have invested well in this window and I expect to see a big difference in where they finish this season, my bet is they'll be top 10.
 
Gary Onedaysoon said:
Credit to Villa though. They took a chance and pushed Grealish and McGinn right up on Liverpool's backline. They wouldn't have done that a year ago.

And maybe Klopp doesn't have a plan B!
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Just a shame the media couldn’t give credit to Villa as well.
Same story, Villa didn’t play well and outthought and outplayed the bindippers , it was just that the reds played terribly .
I know a couple of their goals were deflections but they were all over them .
Maybe Everton gave us a game , but we have been all over teams in the PL so far .
It’s bizarre.
It’s also a shame the international break has happened at this time .
 
Walthamstow wanderer said:
Just a shame the media couldn’t give credit to Villa as well.
Same story, Villa didn’t play well and outthought and outplayed the bindippers , it was just that the reds played terribly .
I know a couple of their goals were deflections but they were all over them .
Maybe Everton gave us a game , but we have been all over teams in the PL so far .
It’s bizarre.
It’s also a shame the international break has happened at this time .
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Yes Walt, 100% agree with you there regards the bloody media, both winning teams, Spurs n Villa, get about 5mins each, but the two losers get hours of breakdown why they lost, does my head in sometimes, but then again ignore us and slowly but surely we stick to the rails creeping up.
 
I still believe whoever figures out how to play defense first will win the league. Defense has always and will always be decisive in winning championships. (on average)
 
Yup, sixteen goals from four games again, fifteen from three, plus a missed penalty and a highly controversial disallowed goal. Even a Steve Bruce team conceding four, and that doesn't happen often.
And that's all before we score five today.
 
Nick Real Deal said:
We have conceded 10 goals in 8 games so far. More than I'd like but not too shabby. If the trend continues we could do very well this season. Out of interest how do the new rule changes help attackers ?[/QUOTE]

The below is Muttley's initial response Nick when I first opened this thread. I think that he made some valid points, particularly regarding the interpretation of hand ball, which strongly favours attackers. It does seem daft to watch defenders play with their hands and arms behind their backs. Conversely though we have seen numerous instances of goals being disallowed, where the offence has been so marginal that defenders have often seemed to get the benefit of the doubt. Possibly though this is more of a VAR than a rules issue.

I'd like to think however that managers and coaches are increasingly moving away from the Pulis and Hughton style of 'hold on to what we've got' football, and are perhaps recognising that their defences aren't good enough to take that risk. Increasingly more teams seem to be seeking to put the game to bed rather than hanging on to a slender lead, and that can only be a good thing.

'My theory is the rule changes and the new interpretation of the rules by the refs. They are all designed to create more goals. I think the crowd expectations is a good point as well.

So the true art of defending is dying in the game. You can't hold a perfect line across the back four for a free-kick. You can't step out as a defence for fear of someone running from an onside position. You definitely can't tackle even the slightest bit out of control.

I also think the transition to the modern full-backs and the move away from 4-4-2 has changed the game.'
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Is the rule change this daft hand ball rule which the refs have suggested they will now not be so rigid on it ? If it is that rule, more pens will show up in the stats. Or is it that defenders are afraid to be more physical in the box ?
 
Personally I think that without the pressure of the crowds players all over the pitch are taking more risks. It's so much easier to make a mistake when you haven't got thousands of fans baying for your blood.

Defenders will play out from the back more and play riskier passes. Midfielders and AMs will play more attacking passes. Forwards will probably pass less and shoot more than normal and in more difficult situations.

I haven't seen the stats but maybe players aren't quite giving 100% without the scrutiny of the fans?

No doubt the alternative factors that others have mentioned are also contributing but most of those were in play before this new season. Once the crowds return I wouldn't be surprised to see a return to something more akin to normality.
 
Gary Onedaysoon said:
Personally I think that without the pressure of the crowds players all over the pitch are taking more risks. It's so much easier to make a mistake when you haven't got thousands of fans baying for your blood.

Defenders will play out from the back more and play riskier passes. Midfielders and AMs will play more attacking passes. Forwards will probably pass less and shoot more than normal and in more difficult situations.

I haven't seen the stats but maybe players aren't quite giving 100% without the scrutiny of the fans?

No doubt the alternative factors that others have mentioned are also contributing but most of those were in play before this new season. Once the crowds return I wouldn't be surprised to see a return to something more akin to normality.
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Agree with this totally, there can't be anything worse than having sixty thousand people on your back when you are having a 'mare. Players can go out currently and have a 'mare in relative comfort, at least until they get back in the dressing room.
 
SmithAndJones said:
Agree with this totally, there can't be anything worse than having sixty thousand people on your back when you are having a 'mare. Players can go out currently and have a 'mare in relative comfort, at least until they get back in the dressing room.
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Not with Jose on the sidelines they can't!
 
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