Premier League Match Thread: West Ham United Vs Nottingham Forest, Sponsored by the Cenotaph Exclusion Zone | Vital Football

Premier League Match Thread: West Ham United Vs Nottingham Forest, Sponsored by the Cenotaph Exclusion Zone

Pope John XXIII

Vital Football Legend
I went to this away game last year and I'm going again on Sunday. A 6.30 coach down to London, where I'll be attending a fan event featuring Marlon Harewood. My task is to tell him how much I still love that fucking amazing goal he scored against Crystal Palace (beating about five players) without being found out and ending up in the hospital rather than London stadium.

Once again I'll be sat in the home end. Last season Forest made it exceedingly easy to not get my head stoved in by collapsing into a 4-0 goal horror show in 20 minutes. This season may not be so easy. We are a far better team.

Thinking back to that game last year, our future was so uncertain. We were above the relegation zone but nowhere near safe or even good. So much seemed to be riding on it.

Far less now. I feel fairly comfortable that I'll have another chance to see this ground next year because I think we should be fine. They will be fine too. In fact, there is only a point between us both- in midtable this time. What progress is that? They have some superb players but we have every chance of competing fairly evenly with them.

West Ham Style of Play

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West Ham's strengths and weaknesses chart looks almost exactly like ours (they have more defensive weaknesses than we do).

They are a counter-attacking team who, like us, struggle against teams that don't want possession and seek to counter them. The low and medium block is absolutely the way here. They have some outstanding players, but they won't do much if we play like we did against Villa.

At home they tend to score more from open play (as we do) because teams do not set up how they want to play. They don't score many at home (fewer than us) and the majority of the open play goals came against Chelsea and Blades.
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They have an even attacking profile- very similar to us on that they plan more in their own third than the opposition's.

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It's the middle where we have to look out for the shots primarily - we'll see more from Benrahma or JWP coming from the right than from Kudus or Alvarez on the left.

Formation

Moyes has employed a 4-4-2 at times, but he heavily favours the 4-2-3-1 he deployed against Olympiakos- and the below is definitely his favoured team.
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Players

Let's be clear; for the most part, West Ham have better players than us. They don't have a striker as good as Awoniyi, or a defender as good as Murillo. They don't have a bastard as good as Dominguez. But their attacking four is a real nightmare and better than the players we have available pound for pound. And we have to be careful not to give JWP a free kick.

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That said, the fact that we have even some better players and expect to compete is quite remarkable progress.

Up front then is likely to be Jarrod Bowen. Their top scorer, an incredibly tricky player and one of the opposing attackers I most fear from the teams around us. We saw him in the championship, we saw him in the Premier League last year. He's bloody good. But he's not bloody good all the time. He did nothing at the CG and does have games where he is barely there. He's also not really a lone forward.

If he starts there, it's because Michail Antonio is off form. He's their battering ram lone forward (and scored from the bench last year) but he hasn't scored since August. He got an assist at Brentford but his overall impact hasn't been great. Moyes may prefer him as a physical presence against his old club and he is a real threat to us. But I suspect he'll be benched.

Danny Ings may be possible. We bought Wood, they bought Ings. I think he scored two against us just after both signed, and many said Wood was the weaker player and we signed the wrong one. But Ings only started 7 games for them and those two goals are all he has managed for them. Longer term, Wood has been the better signing

Behind them is a truly superb player who Man City wanted for a fortune; Lucas Paqeta. This guy is a bloody nightmare; a 26 year old Brazillian who has 6 goals (in all comps) and a couple of assists already. We may rave about MGW, but he's not really in the same League as Paqeta- yet. He was injured last year, I fear him this year.

Saïd Benrahma I thought was a pillock last year, shushing our crowd after scoring only to see it ruled out and be petulant about it. He managed 6 goals last year, none this year in the PL. He's a good player though and another free kick taker.

Mohammed Kudus may play on their right. A really tricky Ghanaian dribbler, only 23, he has six goals for West Ham across all competitions. He is yet another great free kick taker.

Alternatively we could see Pablo Fornels, the 27 year old Spaniard who plays on the left. Not having his best season, he is a counter attacking threat; which is why I suspect he may not play. One we probably won't see Maxwell Cornet, who thought himself far too good to sign for us last year- but barely played for West Ham and has managed one minute this season.

Another option for the centre would be Tomas Soucek, who impressed me last year at the CG. He's more of a central or defensive midfielder because of his blocking and interception ability and may play in the double pivot

Certain to play is James Ward-Prowse. Everyone knows about him. He's not even all that good once you take away the free kicks, of which I believe he has scored 18 or 19 in the PL. He has, however, been a revelation for West Ham as a replacement for Declan Rice. His passing, final ball and long shots are top drawer, though as a DCM he tends to commit forward more than defensively.

Edson Alvarez may play if Soucek does not- and that has tended to be the case recently. Alvarez- is Mexican and outstanding in the air.

At the back will be Konstantinos Mavropanos, the Greek CB we pursued for much of the summer. He has mostly played in the Europa League with only one PL appearance. But with Kurt Zouma just coming back from injury and possibly not ready to play against us, we may see him.

Alongside will be Neyef Ageurd, a 27 year old Moroccan. Not the best in the air. They are ok, but between the two are vulnerable and I would bet on Murillo and Niakhate being better.

At fullback they Vladimir Coufal on the right. He was a massive danger to us last year and is to everyone this, with 4 assists in the PL alone so far.

At LB is Emerson, an Italian who is ok but less of an attacking threat. There is also Aaron Cresswell as their aging deputy.

Here is the whole squad:

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Form

For once we are playing a team whose form is not great

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They have lost five of the last 7 PL games after a great start, beating only the terrible Blades. They did beat Olympiacos on Thursday, but it was an effort and I'm delighted they had to work hard and have just two clear days rest compared to our six.

Head to head

Some interesting games here, and probably only a couple I didn't physically go to.

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The 3-2 loss in the FA Cup was a terrific game. The 2-1 last minute win after Clough had died.

The 5-0 under Davies II in the FA Cup.

Some real crackers. But also some in the championship where they wiped the floor with us.

Weather

A cloudy 9°C moving to rain later in the day.

Why do we actually do the weather anyway? Who started it and why do we bother?
 
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I'll be attending a fan event featuring Marlon Harewood. My task is to tell him how much I still love that fucking amazing goal he scored against Crystal Palace (beating about five players) without being found out and ending up in the hospital rather than London stadium.
I don't think he gets enough credit for that one, very rarely mentioned in people's lists of favourite Forest goals, and yet it was up there with the best for me
 
Have to say West Ham have some good players and on paper should score enough to win at home.

If we defend as well as we did against Villa I could see an away win, but I'd settle for a point right now.
 
@Pope John XXIII - interested to know your experience of watching an away game amongst the home fans.

I've done it once before at Old Trafford, but really didn't enjoy it (particulalry as we went 1 up) as if I'm amongst the Forest fans, I'm typically very 'rowdy' and excitable and decided never to do it again.

That was before the days of easily being able to see pretty much any game somehow, so I could see the merit in it then, but interested to know what your enjoyment levels are, or is it simply so you can say that your opinion on the game is superior to those watching on TV as you managed to find a way to watch the game live from inside the stadium?
 
@Pope John XXIII - interested to know your experience of watching an away game amongst the home fans.

I've done it once before at Old Trafford, but really didn't enjoy it (particulalry as we went 1 up) as if I'm amongst the Forest fans, I'm typically very 'rowdy' and excitable and decided never to do it again.

That was before the days of easily being able to see pretty much any game somehow, so I could see the merit in it then, but interested to know what your enjoyment levels are, or is it simply so you can say that your opinion on the game is superior to those watching on TV as you managed to find a way to watch the game live from inside the stadium?
To be fair, I've only done it the once so far for a Forest game. It's a big stadium so you kind of get lost a bit anyway. We just stood up and politely applauded where everyone else was cheering the teams coming on, etc and then just chatted as normal and kept anything about the game low key and neutral; more out of respect to the other fans than fear. I don't want to be that arsehole who sits in the home end and is just blatent about supporting the other team.

Forest made it very easy last year by losing 4-0 and barely having a shot, so I wasn't really put to the test in terms of "what if forest score or win". Hopefully a problem I'll have tomorrow
 
@Pope John XXIII - interested to know your experience of watching an away game amongst the home fans.

I've done it once before at Old Trafford, but really didn't enjoy it (particulalry as we went 1 up) as if I'm amongst the Forest fans, I'm typically very 'rowdy' and excitable and decided never to do it again.

That was before the days of easily being able to see pretty much any game somehow, so I could see the merit in it then, but interested to know what your enjoyment levels are, or is it simply so you can say that your opinion on the game is superior to those watching on TV as you managed to find a way to watch the game live from inside the stadium?
I was at that game, in the home end behind the goal. Bad atmosphere anyway at Millennium Stadium. I did the same at Spurs last season, where there was at least a goal and a penalty to cheer ( then missed by Ayew). I went in the home end at Fulham the promotion season, where a canny 1 0 win for Forest was more challenging to self control.
 
I was at that game, in the home end behind the goal. Bad atmosphere anyway at Millennium Stadium. I did the same at Spurs last season, where there was at least a goal and a penalty to cheer ( then missed by Ayew). I went in the home end at Fulham the promotion season, where a canny 1 0 win for Forest was more challenging to self control.

In the Championship it makes more sense as its difficult to see games on TV but perhaps easier to get a home ticket but my thoughts are that the benefits of being able to see the game are negatively outweighed by constantly having to check yourself and your emotions.

Saying that, me and a few mates sat together once in the home end at the CG with a mate who was a Derby fan for a Forest Derby game. I thoroughly enjoyed that as it as piss funny watching him having to bite his lip and then we all overly celebrated with him and gave him a cuddle to take the piss when we scored.

Must have been horrible for him mind, bit perhaps made more bearable by being with mates who were having a laugh with him and also able to protect him if anybody twigged and things kicked off.