NEW THREAD FOR ALL THINGS TAKEOVER | Page 96 | Vital Football

NEW THREAD FOR ALL THINGS TAKEOVER

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ZAKKY said:
I have to say In all honesty this last couple of months has stressed me out pretty much more than any other time in my life.Its eating me up that such despicable people are trying to take away something that has been a huge part of my life
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Think we’re all feeling it Zakky. Hang on in there, we should have a resolution one way or another soon.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
Genuine question admin said they are entitled to a percentage of sell ons - so if we get liquidated do they become entitled to the full amount of all the future sell ons? Is that a possibility?

If they were able to do that, could it be why they are so reluctant to compromise on the price despite continuing to devalue the club through sales? As they could know they have a fall back built in to get paid - potentially even more in the long term?

It's not an accusation but a question - but one that should be asked. Along with the other liquidation questions at this point about how admin get paid in that event, do they get paid more? Do they take priority over any remaining creditors? Do they get access the add ons we are due from player sales that were done before we fell into admin? Can they make potentially make money if we go bust?
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I will try to answer the questions you pose.

Regarding the percentage on sell on's. They are entitled to a percentage of any add on's as they have already referred to, any money over and above that would be added to the monies set aside for creditors, whether that be next year or any time in the future and would be divided amongst them.

I don't see that that would give them any reason to hold the sale back as they will get their percentage regardless of the sale.

If a sale is not agreed then they will move on to liquidation and raise whatever they can, including any residual balance from the previous sales, which will then be distributed amongst the creditors in accordance with the law. They would be preferred creditors along with HMRC and be paid first all other creditors, including Football Creditors will then receive a percentage distribution of any balance left.

As the company wouldn't exist then the add on's from before the administration period would probably not be payable.

They will make money if we go bust, but only the same money that they would have got if the club had been sold, however they would probably have to wait longer to receive any payment due.

Hope that answers all your questions.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
I will try to answer the questions you pose.

Regarding the percentage on sell on's. They are entitled to a percentage of any add on's as they have already referred to, any money over and above that would be added to the monies set aside for creditors, whether that be next year or any time in the future and would be divided amongst them.

I don't see that that would give them any reason to hold the sale back as they will get their percentage regardless of the sale.

If a sale is not agreed then they will move on to liquidation and raise whatever they can, including any residual balance from the previous sales, which will then be distributed amongst the creditors in accordance with the law. They would be preferred creditors along with HMRC and be paid first all other creditors, including Football Creditors will then receive a percentage distribution of any balance left.

As the company wouldn't exist then the add on's from before the administration period would probably not be payable.

They will make money if we go bust, but only the same money that they would have got if the club had been sold, however they would probably have to wait longer to receive any payment due.

Hope that answers all your questions.
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So basically if they hold out for 3.5m all bidders walk before liquidating us they will get all of their fees in full eventually. In fact by dragging out the process they would get more fees and is the liquidation process additional cost on top of administration?

But if they negotiate with any buyer to lower the fee they may have to give up some of their fee.

So there is no incentive to negotiate and if no one will pay the asking price it is better for them for us to be liquidated than lower the price?
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
Not a conclusion more a clarification I was asking for to ensure I haven't misunderstood. If you think I've got wrong end of stick happy to hear how.
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TB finished with ...They will make money if we go bust, but only the same money that they would have got if the club had been sold, however they would probably have to wait longer to receive any payment due.

......yet you concluded... In fact by dragging out the process they would get more fees

On second thoughts, I suppose you meant from longer time period aspect. ....... I initially thought you meant that they were going to get additional fees ....... which is your liquidation question following the quote.

Sorry for my misinterpretation.
 
Seriously despite loads of comments on here from TB, Moonay, KDZ, Pies'r'Us etc al......does anyone myself included really know where we are in regards to how we are as a club, how much we owe, how much is outstanding, how much the vultures erm Admin will gleen from future sales, will we/ won't we have a sale , will we / won't we have a club. IMO so so much has gone on re sales, preferred bidders, poss bidders, sale of this that & the other that I'm totally bamboozled by it all n haven't got a clue where we're up to.....what i do know as fact is - today we got beat 2-0, we still have a team of sorts, we're due to play again soon but that's about it.....
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
So basically if they hold out for 3.5m all bidders walk before liquidating us they will get all of their fees in full eventually. In fact by dragging out the process they would get more fees and is the liquidation process additional cost on top of administration?

But if they negotiate with any buyer to lower the fee they may have to give up some of their fee.

So there is no incentive to negotiate and if no one will pay the asking price it is better for them for us to be liquidated than lower the price?
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Sorry KDZ, I thought I had made it simple, there is no financial gain to be had from dragging it out any longer than necessary. They will actually lose out if they do that as it will mean that they have to wait longer to be paid.

Their fees are set in their original document when the administration commenced and there will be no extra fees for the liquidation as it is just an extension of the process.

They can however continue to play the club in administration so long as there is sufficient cash available to pay the bills, they cannot run up bills they can't pay. One or two clubs have successfully been run in administration for long periods but it would be difficult at present to do this with no significant income through the gates.

That was why I was asking the question about the add on fees and solidarity payments. If they are due and come in they could be used, as the supporters club funds were, to allow the club to function until the crowds were allowed back in and given that our wage bill and overheads are significantly lower we may be able to get through till Christmas.
 
jocklatic said:
Seriously despite loads of comments on here from TB, Moonay, KDZ, Pies'r'Us etc al......does anyone myself included really know where we are in regards to how we are as a club, how much we owe, how much is outstanding, how much the vultures erm Admin will gleen from future sales, will we/ won't we have a sale , will we / won't we have a club. IMO so so much has gone on re sales, preferred bidders, poss bidders, sale of this that & the other that I'm totally bamboozled by it all n haven't got a clue where we're up to.....what i do know as fact is - today we got beat 2-0, we still have a team of sorts, we're due to play again soon but that's about it.....
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Short answer........ No!
 
jocklatic said:
Seriously despite loads of comments on here from TB, Moonay, KDZ, Pies'r'Us etc al......does anyone myself included really know where we are in regards to how we are as a club, how much we owe, how much is outstanding, how much the vultures erm Admin will gleen from future sales, will we/ won't we have a sale , will we / won't we have a club. IMO so so much has gone on re sales, preferred bidders, poss bidders, sale of this that & the other that I'm totally bamboozled by it all n haven't got a clue where we're up to.....what i do know as fact is - today we got beat 2-0, we still have a team of sorts, we're due to play again soon but that's about it.....
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That's the admins game Jock create confusion to cloud what's really going on, max up the fees both for now and for later by stringing it out as long as possible. Wait until there is no more value in it for them then move on to the next victim.
Their earlier statement that there would be no fire sale of fixed ir player assets was, is and always will be completely false.
They've had a plan from day 1 and they ain't changing it. Meanwhile the EFL sit idly by and let the feckers get on with it.
As there is almost nothing left to sell they will be off soon one way or another either claiming a great job of saving the club or blaming the whole world except themselves if we are liquidated.
For sure no shit will be sticking on them - past and future masters of this game these scumbags
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
Sorry KDZ, I thought I had made it simple, there is no financial gain to be had from dragging it out any longer than necessary. They will actually lose out if they do that as it will mean that they have to wait longer to be paid.

Their fees are set in their original document when the administration commenced and there will be no extra fees for the liquidation as it is just an extension of the process.

They can however continue to play the club in administration so long as there is sufficient cash available to pay the bills, they cannot run up bills they can't pay. One or two clubs have successfully been run in administration for long periods but it would be difficult at present to do this with no significant income through the gates.

That was why I was asking the question about the add on fees and solidarity payments. If they are due and come in they could be used, as the supporters club funds were, to allow the club to function until the crowds were allowed back in and given that our wage bill and overheads are significantly lower we may be able to get through till Christmas.
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This was taken from the document and shared on line last week.

Seems to suggest fees aren't fixed and liquidation incurs additional costs.
 

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People are assuming that the admins are charging by the day for their work, just to clarify, their hours will be logged and charged on a scale of charges from the main admins, Krasner & co, at the top end to the minor admin staff at the lower end.

Very few if any will be devoting an entire 8 hours a day to this administration and as the time draws on there will be fewer and fewer hours worked as the work load lessens.

Originally more hours would be logged as they tried to understand the business and were the money, if any, was. As time goes by the amount of time lessens as they will have sorted this out and moved on to the day to day running, which would require less input from the higher paid of them.

Krasner will likely only be involved for short periods as they try to negotiate with bidders and so the charges will be lower. In my experience the longer the admin goes on the smaller the input from the higher grades and the lesser the charges become. Towards the end of the admin period that I was involved in most of the work was being done by junior clerks whose charges were reasonably rated, although I must admit their reasonable rates are a darn sight higher than most junior clerks are paid.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
This was taken from the document and shared on line last week.

Seems to suggest fees aren't fixed and liquidation incurs additional costs.
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As I said the liquidation is an extension of the administration process and the fees would continue at the appropriate rate. There is no one off charge or extra fees to continue with the liquidation as far as I am aware.

I know you doubt what is being said by the admins but they did confirm in a statement in the last week or so that their charges had not yet reached the estimate originally given.

Edit:

Have you any idea were that extract came from as I would like to read the full documents.
 
Hampton said:
Meanwhile the EFL sit idly by and let the feckers get on with it.
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Not so sure about that. Last year they sent out regular updates with deadlines for Bury and Bolton. With us - none. They allowed us to carry on ‘verbally’ according to krasner. We don’t know what else they told him and is perhaps telling it hasn’t been communicated publicly or put down in writing. I think (no evidence I hasten to add) they’ve set a soft deadline to get this sorted. They know admin can’t fund us for a season and realistically the only ones in are the yanks they keep dissing.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
As I said the liquidation is an extension of the administration process and the fees would continue at the appropriate rate. There is no one off charge or extra fees to continue with the liquidation as far as I am aware.

I know you doubt what is being said by the admins but they did confirm in a statement in the last week or so that their charges had not yet reached the estimate originally given.

Edit:

Have you any idea were that extract came from as I would like to read the full documents.
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I believe it was from the documument previously discussed on here where it had the itemised creditors and admins hourly rates charged.

But my point is the longer it goes the more days, hours they work and the fee total ticks up.

So asuming admin are happy to wait to get their fees then there wouldn't be any incentive to avoid liquidating the club. Especially if haggling down the price at all eats into their fees. Is that correct?
 
Made in Wigan said:
Not so sure about that. Last year they sent out regular updates with deadlines for Bury and Bolton. With us - none. They allowed us to carry on ‘verbally’ according to krasner. We don’t know what else they told him and is perhaps telling it hasn’t been communicated publicly or put down in writing. I think (no evidence I hasten to add) they’ve set a soft deadline to get this sorted. They know admin can’t fund us for a season and realistically the only ones in are the yanks they keep dissing.
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Admin set their own deadline and then didn't stick to it. Add it to the list.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
People are assuming that the admins are charging by the day for their work, just to clarify, their hours will be logged and charged on a scale of charges from the main admins, Krasner & co, at the top end to the minor admin staff at the lower end.

Very few if any will be devoting an entire 8 hours a day to this administration and as the time draws on there will be fewer and fewer hours worked as the work load lessens.

Originally more hours would be logged as they tried to understand the business and were the money, if any, was. As time goes by the amount of time lessens as they will have sorted this out and moved on to the day to day running, which would require less input from the higher paid of them.

Krasner will likely only be involved for short periods as they try to negotiate with bidders and so the charges will be lower. In my experience the longer the admin goes on the smaller the input from the higher grades and the lesser the charges become. Towards the end of the admin period that I was involved in most of the work was being done by junior clerks whose charges were reasonably rated, although I must admit their reasonable rates are a darn sight higher than most junior clerks are paid.
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TB, could you please repeat your entire post in Chinese, maybe then n maybe only then will I be able to make sense of anything you have posted!!
Joking aside TB, it dont make sense to me so apologies for being so thick or a lack of understanding but imo we're getting f@cked over by these admin regardless!!!
 
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