Mr Khan

[loudmouthblue]

He was demonstrating. That's all.

watch the footage and read what i have just posted, he was as culpable as the rest of the idiots.

 

[daleks.at.the.monaco]

I absolutely agree those figures are terrifying and far more needs to be done. As president, Trump has consummately failed to address it, and he's guilty as charged...

But as much as I can't abide Trump, to lay it solely at his door is disingenuous. The same criticism can be levelled at Obama, Clinton, Bush (x2), Reagan... In fact every president who has failed to address the fact that guns are far too easily available and (especially in cities) violence is the accepted norm to a lot of people.

It's an American problem, not specifically a Trump problem. There's a million things we can legitimately slate Trump for, and this is pretty low on the list of things that specifically Trump needs to be pilloried for.

Sure you will not agree, but here goes

If the USA problems are not all down to Trump, then neither are Khans

Especially as Khan is only Mayor and not in national government.
Oh and Trump is POTUS with executive powers. Powers that even our PM does not have.

 

[loudmouthblue]

LMB...I have indeed watched the video now and although he did kick out after ( which was also out of order ) he was no doubt surrounded and then assaulted by a mob who were out of control. My dad used to tell me that if anybody hit me I had to hit them back
..I would have launched that bastard skywards.

Even his opening comment in the footage is "bring it on" in an aggressive manor.

 

[Made in Wigan]

Two wrongs, yes, but given that one has mocked the disabled, bragged about molesting women, and has childish nicknames (sometimes bordering on racist) for his opponents, I think that Khan and Corbyn have a way to go yet.

You are the worst person on here for "engaging in debate", you insult and cry down everyone that disagrees with you. l

Look at the footage and tell me he wasn't involved, normal people (either side, which you are to bigoted to see) would walk away at any hint of trouble, this victim didn't he got stuck in, even the police woman told him to move away.

https://www.lbc.co.uk/watch-videos/anti-trump-protest-violence-milkshake-supporter/

He was asked to move for his own protection, though he was allowed to be there and protest as much as everyone else and it was shameful he had to be led away from that hate filled mob. You think he should have walked away to justify their behaviour which is entirely wrong as he had every right to be there.

Oh and please - pot, kettle, black

 

[Made in Wigan]

Two wrongs, yes, but given that one has mocked the disabled, bragged about molesting women, and has childish nicknames (sometimes bordering on racist) for his opponents, I think that Khan and Corbyn have a way to go yet.

I think they’ve already arrived pal. Authorising offensive blimps, whipping up hate rallies, snubbing the queen - how much further do you want them to go?

 

[piemon]

Snubbing the queen? Is that an argument? Ffs ???

 

[moonay]

watch the footage and read what i have just posted, he was as culpable as the rest of the idiots.

Ive watched it, and I can't work out how you think that.

He was being called a fascist...... So he called it them back.

Then the jostling...... Which looked like he was initially on the receiving end of.

He then retaliated a little

And then he had that vile woman in his face screaming Nazi scum.

Sorry pal......... Only one side were intent on causing an affray there.

 

[moonay]

I think they’ve already arrived pal. Authorising offensive blimps, whipping up hate rallies, snubbing the queen - how much further do you want them to go?

If you're not sufficiently objective to agree that in the "who's disrespected most people, in the most despicable ways" standings, that Trump is Premier league, compared to Corbyn and Khan in the Fred's Van Rental league, Southern section, then I see little point in pushing it any more.

Shame.

 

[The_Pon]

Sure you will not agree, but here goes

If the USA problems are not all down to Trump, then neither are Khans

Especially as Khan is only Mayor and not in national government.
Oh and Trump is POTUS with executive powers. Powers that even our PM does not have.

I have no strong feelings either way about Khan. I don't live in London, and I don't really care what goes on there, so Khan isn't on my radar all that much.

Only thing I will say is that whilst Trump is an awful human being and I can't abide him, he is the POTUS, and whilst I have zero respect for him personally, I do respect the office he holds; if Khan wants to be considered a statesman rather than a petulant wannabe politico by point scoring with cheap stunts and sound bites, then he too should respect the office of POTUS, regardless of personal feelings on the individual who holds that office.

It's called being a grown up, and for senior politicians to not get it is a tragic reflection on the low calibre of people in UK politics at the moment.

 

[loudmouthblue]

Ive watched it, and I can't work out how you think that.

He was being called a fascist...... So he called it them back.

Then the jostling...... Which looked like he was initially on the receiving end of.

He then retaliated a little

And then he had that vile woman in his face screaming Nazi scum.

Sorry pal......... Only one side were intent on causing an affray there.

I will put it another way moonay, if two groups of opposing football fans 'kick off' and you just happen to be at the game, or more often travelling to or away from it, what do you do if you see the types that get involved, normal people move away even though you are as entitled as anyone to stand your ground, knob heads get closer and involved in the action.


The demonstration by anti trump protesters was well documented, why would anyone go to a counter demonstration in the same place if they were not 'up for' anything that transpired and why would you wear a inflammatory item of clothing (his cap) that might inflame the situation, if you look the trouble escalated when someone knocked his hat off and he became angry and abusive, he was no victim.

I am not condoning what either side did, what I find pathetic are those seeking to blame just one side.

 

[daleks.at.the.monaco]

I have no strong feelings either way about Khan. I don't live in London, and I don't really care what goes on there, so Khan isn't on my radar all that much.

Only thing I will say is that whilst Trump is an awful human being and I can't abide him, he is the POTUS, and whilst I have zero respect for him personally, I do respect the office he holds; if Khan wants to be considered a statesman rather than a petulant wannabe politico by point scoring with cheap stunts and sound bites, then he too should respect the office of POTUS, regardless of personal feelings on the individual who holds that office.

It's called being a grown up, and for senior politicians to not get it is a tragic reflection on the low calibre of people in UK politics at the moment.

Fair points, I agree
I think it all started when Khan stuck up for London, after Trump reposted those BNP (or similar) videos from Katie Hopkins in 2018

 

[moonay]

............ I am not condoning what either side did, what I find pathetic are those seeking to blame just one side.

II acknowledge your football fans comparison, but all the initial aggression appeared to be one way.

Then, as you say, his hat was knocked off...... by someone making the first move.

However ill advised he may have been to be there, and however inflammatory his headwear, he didn't start the verbal or physical encounter.

He may not have been an angel, but he wasn't the aggressor.

 

[Made in Wigan]

If you're not sufficiently objective to agree that in the "who's disrespected most people, in the most despicable ways" standings, that Trump is Premier league, compared to Corbyn and Khan in the Fred's Van Rental league, Southern section, then I see little point in pushing it any more.

Shame.

You are trying to justify your argument on who's behaviour is worst. It's like trying to say Jack the Ripper isn't as bad as the Yorkshire ripper so he's okay.

 

[Made in Wigan]

I will put it another way moonay, if two groups of opposing football fans 'kick off' and you just happen to be at the game, or more often travelling to or away from it, what do you do if you see the types that get involved, normal people move away even though you are as entitled as anyone to stand your ground, knob heads get closer and involved in the action.


The demonstration by anti trump protesters was well documented, why would anyone go to a counter demonstration in the same place if they were not 'up for' anything that transpired and why would you wear a inflammatory item of clothing (his cap) that might inflame the situation, if you look the trouble escalated when someone knocked his hat off and he became angry and abusive, he was no victim.

I am not condoning what either side did, what I find pathetic are those seeking to blame just one side.

He was allowed to peacefully demonstrate. Verbally abusing, threatening and assaulting him isn't justified because he holds an alternate view. It's akin to saying an anti racism campaigner deserved a kicking because they were counter demonstrating at a BNP rally.

 

[moonay]

You are trying to justify your argument on who's behaviour is worst. It's like trying to say Jack the Ripper isn't as bad as the Yorkshire ripper so he's okay.

I suppose I was.......... but I was initially merely trying to show why Trump wasn't deserving of any respect...... from anyone.

The comparison though is more like Fred West and Fred Dibnah.

I do agree with The Pon though....... its arguable that (from politicians at least) the position deserves respect, even though the individual doesn't.

 

[Made in Wigan]

I suppose I was.......... but I was initially merely trying to show why Trump wasn't deserving of any respect...... from anyone.

The comparison though is more like Fred West and Fred Dibnah.

I do agree with The Pon though....... its arguable that (from politicians at least) the position deserves respect, even though the individual doesn't.

Which is exactly what I have been saying. How on earth politicians such as those two can bang on about not abusing and showing respect toward MPs when they behave opposite to that is beyond me. Hypocrisy at its best.

 

[moonay]

Still no comparison re their respective disrespectful acts though MiW.

 

[Made in Wigan]

Still no comparison re their respective disrespectful acts though MiW.

I don't concur, so we'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[The_Pon]

Fair points, I agree
I think it all started when Khan stuck up for London, after Trump reposted those BNP (or similar) videos from Katie Hopkins in 2018

I think you're right about the tweets. I'm certainly not going to defend Trump, nor do I think he should be above being challenged because of the office he holds, but the US, love 'em or loathe 'em, are our closest political ally, and there are right and wrong ways to go about challenging their (democratically elected... somehow) president's behaviour.

Trump is basically a man-child and is proven to not be above slanging matches and primary school standard name calling in public, but we don't have to sink to his level. Name calling and childish blimps don't send the right message about what sort of country we are (or want to be at least). I think it would be all the more impactful on an international stage to calmly challenge his behaviour in a mature and statesman like manner. If/when he goes off on one, then he's only proving our point further.

That way, you give him the rope to hang himself. If we get involved in tit for tat childishness, then we're seen as being disrespectful to the the most powerful country in the world and our closest ally, which doesn't benefit anyone. It also gives Trump a level of defence that he was provoked into a response, where if we challenge him in an adult, statesmanlike way and he still goes off on one, we get the high ground under international scrutiny, and can't be accused of being disrespectful to an international leader (however awful he may be on a personal level).

I'm sure most of us would like to give him a slap, but this is international politics at its most high profile... We have to do it the right way. Just a shame some of our politicians can't understand that.

What I find very questionable is that Sajid Javid wasn't invited to the banquet. As a senior cabinet minister, he should've been. I fully understand why Khan wasn't there based on his own behaviour, but the only reason I can think of for Javid not being there is that he's a Muslim, which is disgusting. I don't think that should be allowed to be brushed under the carpet. If it was a decision taken by UK officials, then they need to be held to account, but I suspect it was more likely a request from the US delegation who are ultimately answerable to Trump. If that's the case, then it should be made public. If they seriously think that the UK Home Secretary represents a security threat to the POTUS, then their paranoia is at a whole new (and frankly terrifying) level.

 

[Hampton]

What right has POTUS got to comment about the internal affairs in another country

Just to be objective would you be as indignant if he critisized Macron about Gillet Jaune

Whay has Khan done to cause the deaths, what has he not done
Then consider the effect of central Government funding cuts

As much right as Obama had commenting on the referendum pre vote - difference being Trump is right - not excuse for either if them sticking their beaks in (sorry Michael G)