Magnificent seven | Page 3 | Vital Football

Magnificent seven

But the party they represent is also listed TB.

Our local MP used to be Lindsay Hoyle (before boundary changes), and I had a Tory supporting mate who voted for Hoyle merely because of the qualities of the man. I think similar circumstances might apply with some of the 7.

To initiate a by-election would seem to be the honourable thing to do though.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
MP's are listed on ballot forms as individuals not parties and as such are not required to vacate the seat when they leave a party. Although they may campaign on party lines they are free to move away at any time.

The only system that would prevent this from happening would be Proportional Representation where voting is for the party manifesto and parliament is made up based on the percentage of votes received. Each party then puts forward its candidates to take up the seats allocated, therefore in the case of an MP defecting or leaving the party they would automatically be replaced by another from the same party.
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Correct but the party they are standing for is also on the ballot paper.
I agree they are playing the rules, the rules need changing.
In any event they are morally bankrupt.
I hope they do set up a party and campaign for the pathetically named "peoples vote"
Oblivion calling ....!
 
moonay said:
But the party they represent is also listed TB.

Our local MP used to be Lindsay Hoyle (before boundary changes), and I had a Tory supporting mate who voted for Hoyle merely because of the qualities of the man. I think similar circumstances might apply with some of the 7.

To initiate a by-election would seem to be the honourable thing to do though.
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He's also mine and I agree with your mate he's a very decent MP involved in local issues.
 
The rules have been in place for hundreds of years and just because 7 MP's have decided to resign from a party I don't see a need to change them. If you want a change then why not have PR, at least it would give the smaller parties a chance. For instance UKIP polled more votes than the Lib Dems yet had no MP's, how is that representative of the countries votes.
 
The argument for PR is another thing all together TB...... though it's one which has a lot of merit.

Currently though, I reckon that the number of folk who vote for the MP is fairly small compared to those who vote for the party.
 
Only brought it in as it is the only system that would automatically see an incumbent MP replaced if they shift allegiance.

I agree most look for the party first on the ballot paper and very few know enough about the candidate to vote for the individual. I must admit I think a few of the out and out Labour supporters in Wigan would not have voted for Lisa Nandy if they knew anything about her background. Given that she is the daughter of a millionaire, talk about champagne socialist.
 
hindleymonwafc said:
Some of us have seen all this before and strangely enough Hatton was involved then as well under Corbyn's hero Tony Benn. Then as now these breakaways just couldn't stomach the nastiness, intimidation and anti-semitism of the far left. I applaud them for their actions though.
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Absolute bollocks, Tony Benn had nothing to do with Hatton or was ever in any sub groups that hatton was a member of.
 
We all know the majority of people in this country vote along party lines, this is shown by the amount of terrible politicians who keep getting re-elected year on year with landslides because their area is dyed in the wool for the party.

If Lisa Nandy and the Conservative choice at the last GE would have swopped parties it wouldn't have made any difference to the final result as Wigan is a Labour town.

These 7 self serving MPs have been pushing to water down or cancel Brexit for the past 2 and a half years - they now see a referenfum rerun as their best hope of sabotaging the initial vote. But it's genreally only the hardcore Remainer MPs who can't accept the first result who want another vote in the hope of getting the answer they want this time, the vast majority of Leavers don't want another vote we just want them to stop messing us around honour the promise to implement our decision. But anyone who voted for one of these to be a Labour candidate is matter of fact not getting that in their constituencies and i imagine there is quite a number of their constituencies that voted for them that feel this represents a significant change and would like a say - especially considering all of them stood on a manifesto saying they'd leave the EU and now their main policy is to cancel Brexit - they know at least the 2 of them from the Leave areas would be very possibly voted out but i suspect very few of them would retain their seat if they faced a by election and they know it.

They are just hypocrits, there is a vastly stronger case for them to run a by election than there is for the second referendum they keep telling us about. If they wont face 'a peoples vote' after they effectively changed sides on their electorate then they've not got a leg to stand on demanding a rerun of the largest vote we ever had for anything in our countries history. But they wont put their fat wages on the line - in fact them jumping is more an attempt to try and cling to power as they knew they'd likely be deselected if they hung around much longer.
 
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Made in Wigan said:
It's the same argument being used yesterday, as I said a rational one. However in light of the fact Nandy and others have openly stated they've acted against the majority in their constituencies on a massive issue and werent deselected, then the same argument that there should be by elections in the seats held by the magnificent seven who deserted the racist Labour Party doesn't hold water.
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Am I racist, is my wife, my daughter many of my friends, no and never have been. In my youth fought physically the national front in Bolton and am proud of that and would fight again against any racist party or person, your rhetoric and agenda is sickening, racism accusations against the Labour party and its grass root members is contrived and a stick to beat us down, funny how there was never talk of antisemitism until Corbyn defeated the blairites and they will use any despicable method to oust him.
 
Brexit - and the desire for a second (confirmatory) referendum - isn't the primary driver behind each one of the 7 leaving KDZ.

As I've already said, given their length of tenure as an MP, I really wouldn't be surprised if at least 2 of them held their seats if a by-election were to be called.......based on the "Hoyle effect".
?
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
We all know the majority of people in this country vote along party lines, this is shown by the amount of terrible politicians who keep getting re-elected year on year with landslides because their area is dyed in the wool for the party.

If Lisa Nandy and the Conservative choice at the last GE would have swopped parties it wouldn't have made any difference to the final result as Wigan is a Labour town.

These 7 self serving MPs have been pushing to water down or cancel Brexit for the past 2 and a half years - they now see a referenfum rerun as their best hope of sabotaging the initial vote. But it's genreally only the hardcore Remainer MPs who can't accept the first result who want another vote in the hope of getting the answer they want this time, the vast majority of Leavers don't want another vote we just want them to stop messing us around honour the promise to implement our decision. But anyone who voted for one of these to be a Labour candidate is matter of fact not getting that in their constituencies and i imagine there is quite a number of their constituencies that voted for them that feel this represents a significant change and would like a say - especially considering all of them stood on a manifesto saying they'd leave the EU and now their main policy is to cancel Brexit - they know at least the 2 of them from the Leave areas would be very possibly voted out but i suspect very few of them would retain their seat if they faced a by election and they know it.

They are just hypocrits, there is a vastly stronger case for them to run a by election than there is for the second referendum they keep telling us about. If they wont face 'a peoples vote' after they effectively changed sides on their electorate then they've not got a leg to stand on demanding a rerun of the largest vote we ever had for anything in our countries history. But they wont put their fat wages on the line - in fact them jumping is more an attempt to try and cling to power as they knew they'd likely be deselected if they hung around much longer.
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Most of them, if not all, are jumping because they have been deselected or were about to be, Chris Leslie not for his political beliefs but because he is a nasty piece of work, how dare he accuse anyone of bullying he is a bully who demanded sexual favours from staff.
 
loudmouthblue said:
........ , funny how there was never talk of antisemitism until Corbyn defeated the blairites and they will use any despicable method to oust him.
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Credit re the first part of your post LMB, but surely, you must acknowledge that there must be some truth in some of the antisemitism & bullying accusations.

Maybe Corbyn is trying to get rid of it..... but don't deny its existence.
 
moonay said:
Credit re the first part of your post LMB, but surely, you must acknowledge that there must be some truth in some of the antisemitism & bullying accusations.

Maybe Corbyn is trying to get rid of it..... but don't deny its existence.
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This is a topic that has been done to death at Wigan CLP, we have debated it and asked searching questions about it , we have contacted numerous other CLP's and asked them to have them do the same as us and see where this cancer is, overwhelmingly the reports back tell us no one, I repeat no one knows or gives a flying fok what religion other members practice.

We even purposely asked Bury South CLP to debate the accusations as their MP Ivan Lewis is one of the most vociferous with antisemitism claims and have a large Jewish community, they told us of some prejudice but it was all on social media from accounts that they could not identify, they enlisted the police to help find if it was any labour member and still could not find any, Lewis is an blair supporter of the highest and hates Corbyn with a passion, he will be another for this new group.
 
loudmouthblue said:
Am I racist, is my wife, my daughter many of my friends, no and never have been. In my youth fought physically the national front in Bolton and am proud of that and would fight again against any racist party or person, your rhetoric and agenda is sickening, racism accusations against the Labour party and its grass root members is contrived and a stick to beat us down, funny how there was never talk of antisemitism until Corbyn defeated the blairites and they will use any despicable method to oust him.
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Part of the problem is this denial of racism within the party. Are you suggesting it doesn't exist and that Berger for example is telling lies about the racism she has experienced? Let alone the many others who have raised it. Sadly the leadership on this issue has been utterly woeful and Corbyn by his inability to tackle it is giving encouragement to those to carry on with their anti semantic behaviour. By members denying there is a problem - when it's abundantly clear there is one - then it is validating the behaviour whether or not that is the intention. It maybe difficult for you to accept if you don't hold those views yourself, but sadly that is the reality.
 
Fair enough.......... but the Luciana Berger stuff has (I thought) been proven.

Louise Ellman (used to be leader of Preston Council before being an MP) has also confirmed that she's been a victim.

No smoke baht fire.
 
loudmouthblue said:
But he is anti brexit, so please tell us all how he differs from Lisa Nandy
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For starters he's not on question time or tv every other day bragging about his views on the subject and publicly trying to stay in. As I said he's a decent MP and I voted for him in the last but one election, but last time out there was no way I could do so given the bigger picture.
 
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