Greavswasthegreatest
Vital Football Legend
Half time Oranges and peel droppings ha ha ......ice cold sponge and grass cuttings ha ha ....
...and don't forget the smell of the white liniment oil we used to rub in...Walthy
Good Morning Thread
- Thread starter Spursex
- Start date
Half time Oranges and peel droppings ha ha ......ice cold sponge and grass cuttings ha ha ....
...and don't forget the smell of the white liniment oil we used to rub in...Walthy
Forgot about the White Horse Oils Greavsie . The dressing room is a whole new episode in the weekly rituals . And learning a valuable life lesson , which had kept me in good stead today . Washing your hands . If you didn’t wash your hands after smothering yourself in White Horse Oils , you soon found out how many times you subconsciously had your hand on your gonads . !!!!! Didn’t that sting !!!!!! It also brought to life the longest hair on the human body , the one that connects the anal region with your head . If you don’t believe me , try yanking out one of the hairs on your sphincter region and watch as your eyes start to water .The same thing happened when you gave your balls a scratching with WHO on them .
there seems to be a connection here with WHO and Hand Washing .
Do you also remember , the good teams always turned up with a starting eleven and one or two that weren’t picked but turned up in their kit anyway , boots etc , and the shit teams always only had eight who could be arsed to get out of bed ! Sometimes the good team would “ lend “ the shit team a player !
Then there was the Ringer . The Ringer was the one who had just moved into the area but hadn’t signed on in time for the season and played under someone’s else’s name , the nerdy bloke who couldn’t be bothered anymore because he got beat every week .
The Ringer always got found out because someone broke the East End Code and grassed on him !
Do you remember having the bloke in your team that always got booked .? Always giving it large with the opposition , goading and winding them up . Whenever he eventually got booked he would tell the ref his name was M Mouse , or S Clause . Sometimes .although rarely , when the other team got the better of him , he would simply storm off the pitch , calling everyone a Jodrell Banker as he went and you wouldn’t see him again until you got to the pub !
Good morning all . Hope you are all well and safe . Weather seems to be set fair for the next week or so . Got a decent tan going at the moment . Allotment is good . Garden is good , car is still desperate for a wash and hoover , but it’s a bit of a work horse at the moment ferrying plants etc to the allotment .
Fencing arrived yesterday , well pleased with that . I will be giving it a coat of fence paint before I fit it all . It needs to be a bit cooler because that area is in full sun and I’ve got post holes to dig and the pubs are not open yet !
Keep well , keep safe . Keep posting
Fencing arrived yesterday , well pleased with that . I will be giving it a coat of fence paint before I fit it all . It needs to be a bit cooler because that area is in full sun and I’ve got post holes to dig and the pubs are not open yet !
Keep well , keep safe . Keep posting
Greavswasthegreatest
Vital Football Legend
All great memories Walthy. As I mught have mentioned the game never got called off due to the weather...rain snow fog. I remember one game where a smog descended on the Marshes. Even from the kick off you could not see either goal.....players would just appear out of the smog ,,,ha ha never saw the ref the whole game. I remember (now) playing a game and the centre half cream crackered me. I was helped up by the lads and the ref asked if I was ok. I said yep and played on...but when I got the ball I headed the wrong way towards my own goal. The ref blew for the final whitle and after shaking hands the teams headed off to the changing rooms whilst I headed off the wrong way. You just played on as you said, no subs. Never went to hospital for checkup either...silly I know but the pub beckoned, with strippers and baked potatoes and seafood (freeby on the counter)a and I seemed ok after afew pints ....although who could tell ha ha.
We were not a bad team of young whippets in the early days and played a good standard on Saturdays but why we decided to join a Sunday league at the Marshes as our home pitch I will never know.
The other teams tended to be made up of fat old ex players half pissed from the Sat night out and all they could do was try to maim us!
We of course won many more games than we lost as they could not catch us...we were too quick for their lunging tackles..sums up how important a real game of footie was to us poor east london lads. !!!!
Last edited:
Pompey Yid
Vital Champions League
Haha thanks for that, did think of it myself, but when suggested the answer I got cannot written on here in case it offends lol!A tin bath and soap suds might do the trick...
Pompey Yid
Vital Champions League
Afternoon all, further to the "hot tub" problem, I have ordered one, god knows how long before delivery, hope its sooner rather than later.
The missus needs it, so as to help with the continuous very sore pains in her legs, her nervous system is completely knackerd, for the life of me I do not know why I didn't think about it before, bad me I think.
The words we are getting on here regards local council football pitch's is a bloody good description of all n sundry/everywhere, mind it does bring back plenty of good and bad memories.
The missus needs it, so as to help with the continuous very sore pains in her legs, her nervous system is completely knackerd, for the life of me I do not know why I didn't think about it before, bad me I think.
The words we are getting on here regards local council football pitch's is a bloody good description of all n sundry/everywhere, mind it does bring back plenty of good and bad memories.
D
Departed
Guest
Good morning. 
Just started raining which is OK because I have a TON of work to do.
Looks like China is a little pissed off at Canada right now.
What the Meng Wanzhou ruling means, and how it could have gone the other way
Sean FineJustice Writer
Published 10 hours ago Updated May 27, 2020
34 Comments
% buffered
00:00
Open this photo in gallery/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/tgam/7HTJGCJJTVPF7EQ7DQP7NRJS24.jpg)
Meng Wanzhou, chief financial officer of Huawei, is seen in B.C. Supreme Court in Vancouver, on May 27, 2020, as Associate Chief Justice Heather Holmes, top, reads the ruling of double criminality in the extradition of Wanzhou.
Jane Wolsak/The Canadian Press
Canadian courts should not let alleged criminals escape prosecution by the country’s international extradition partners on the basis of technical legal arguments, a B.C. Supreme Court judge ruled on Wednesday in allowing the extradition case against Chinese telecom executive Meng Wanzhou to clear an important legal hurdle.
The United States has asked Canada to surrender Ms. Meng to face fraud charges. It accuses the chief financial officer of Huawei Technologies Co. Ltd. of lying to a bank about the company’s business dealings in a bid to evade U.S. sanctions against Iran. China has countered that Canada, which arrested Ms. Meng on Dec. 1, 2018, is engaging in a politically motivated prosecution.
The first phase of the court proceedings, held over four days in January, was to determine whether the alleged conduct would be a crime if committed in Canada, a principle known as double criminality. The Canadian government, representing the U.S. Justice Department, argued that the case is about fraud; Ms. Meng’s lawyers, led by Richard Peck of Vancouver, said it is really about U.S. economic sanctions against Iran. Canada does not have sanctions against that country.
Huawei executive Meng Wanzhou loses key decision in extradition hearing
Days before B.C. court decision on Huawei’s Meng, China threatens ‘damage’ to relations with Canada
Get ready. The chill with China is just going to get colder
Associate Chief Justice Heather Holmes ruled that this argument would put the basic purposes of extradition treaties at risk.
The evasion of sanctions, she wrote in a 23-page ruling, was mere context for an alleged fraud. And people accused of fraud should not be permitted to avoid accountability simply by citing situations in other countries that don’t exist in Canada.
“Ms. Meng’s approach to the double criminality analysis would seriously limit Canada’s ability to fulfill its international obligations in the extradition context for fraud and other economic crimes,” she wrote.
“The offence of fraud has a vast potential scope. It may encompass a very wide range of conduct, a large expanse of time, and acts, people, and consequences in multiple places or jurisdictions.” It should not be given an “artificially narrow scope" in extradition cases.
During the January hearing, Associate Chief Justice Holmes raised a question about whether some frauds might occur in a context offensive to Canadians. But in her ruling, she said that economic sanctions against Iran are “not fundamentally contrary to Canadian values in the way that slavery laws would be.”
Ultimately, she said, it is up to Justice Minister David Lametti to decide whether “prosecution according to the foreign laws could lead to an unjust or oppressive result according to Canadian values.” The minister decides, if a judge endorses the case for extradition, whether the individual should be extradited. And the courts can review that decision, giving further protection, the judge said, against an unjust result flowing from the context.
Canadian courts could have put Ms. Meng on trial for a similar offence committed in this country, she wrote. ″A domestic prosecution for fraud could properly, I suggest, take place in Canada on the basis of false statements made in Canada that put a U.S. bank at economic risk for violating U.S. sanctions."
Some legal observers said they were not surprised by the ruling. Double criminality is an “expansive concept,” University of New Brunswick law professor Anne Warner La Forest said, adding that “if you’re too narrow … you’re essentially rewarding some criminals.”
The Meng extradition case has put the Canadian justice system in an international spotlight. China arrested two Canadians, Michael Spavor and Michael Kovrig, in apparent reprisal for her arrest; they have been in prison for 535 days. Ms. Meng is on bail and living under a form of house arrest in a Vancouver mansion.
The ruling from Associate Chief Justice Holmes, a former prosecutor and criminal-law policy official, communicated the justice system’s “consistency," said Asad Kiyani, a law professor at the University of Calgary. “You see that Justice Holmes is looking back at the evolution of Canadian extradition, and identifying the broad-based approach." He said judges do “not insist that the laws of every country are perfectly in concordance and exactly mirror one another,” but look to see “that the spirit of the law, the essence of the law, is the same.”
Paul Stern, a Toronto lawyer, said the case “obviously could have gone the other way.” The ruling is “careful, clever, but comes down in favour of international co-operation with the United States as opposed to the liberty of the individual concerned.”
The proceedings still have a long way to go, and timing is uncertain, in part because of the COVID-19 pandemic. In the next court phase, Ms. Meng’s lawyers will argue an abuse of process, based on allegations of improper political motives and of violations of her rights when arrested. In a third phase, the court would have to decide whether enough evidence exists to send her to trial.
Canada’s Justice Department stressed the independence of the judicial process in a statement, adding that the government will work with defence counsel and the court to ensure the case moves as expeditiously as possible. Ms. Meng’s lawyers declined to comment. A Huawei spokesman expressed the company’s disappointment, saying the company expects Canada’s judicial system will ultimately prove Ms. Meng’s innocence. A spokesman for U.S. prosecutors in New York thanked the government of Canada "for its continued assistance pursuant to the U.S./Canada Extradition Treaty in this ongoing matter.”
With a report from Adrian Morrow
Just started raining which is OK because I have a TON of work to do.
Looks like China is a little pissed off at Canada right now.
What the Meng Wanzhou ruling means, and how it could have gone the other way
Sean FineJustice Writer
Published 10 hours ago Updated May 27, 2020
34 Comments
% buffered
00:00
Open this photo in gallery
Meng Wanzhou, chief financial officer of Huawei, is seen in B.C. Supreme Court in Vancouver, on May 27, 2020, as Associate Chief Justice Heather Holmes, top, reads the ruling of double criminality in the extradition of Wanzhou.
Jane Wolsak/The Canadian Press
Canadian courts should not let alleged criminals escape prosecution by the country’s international extradition partners on the basis of technical legal arguments, a B.C. Supreme Court judge ruled on Wednesday in allowing the extradition case against Chinese telecom executive Meng Wanzhou to clear an important legal hurdle.
The United States has asked Canada to surrender Ms. Meng to face fraud charges. It accuses the chief financial officer of Huawei Technologies Co. Ltd. of lying to a bank about the company’s business dealings in a bid to evade U.S. sanctions against Iran. China has countered that Canada, which arrested Ms. Meng on Dec. 1, 2018, is engaging in a politically motivated prosecution.
The first phase of the court proceedings, held over four days in January, was to determine whether the alleged conduct would be a crime if committed in Canada, a principle known as double criminality. The Canadian government, representing the U.S. Justice Department, argued that the case is about fraud; Ms. Meng’s lawyers, led by Richard Peck of Vancouver, said it is really about U.S. economic sanctions against Iran. Canada does not have sanctions against that country.
Huawei executive Meng Wanzhou loses key decision in extradition hearing
Days before B.C. court decision on Huawei’s Meng, China threatens ‘damage’ to relations with Canada
Get ready. The chill with China is just going to get colder
Associate Chief Justice Heather Holmes ruled that this argument would put the basic purposes of extradition treaties at risk.
The evasion of sanctions, she wrote in a 23-page ruling, was mere context for an alleged fraud. And people accused of fraud should not be permitted to avoid accountability simply by citing situations in other countries that don’t exist in Canada.
“Ms. Meng’s approach to the double criminality analysis would seriously limit Canada’s ability to fulfill its international obligations in the extradition context for fraud and other economic crimes,” she wrote.
“The offence of fraud has a vast potential scope. It may encompass a very wide range of conduct, a large expanse of time, and acts, people, and consequences in multiple places or jurisdictions.” It should not be given an “artificially narrow scope" in extradition cases.
During the January hearing, Associate Chief Justice Holmes raised a question about whether some frauds might occur in a context offensive to Canadians. But in her ruling, she said that economic sanctions against Iran are “not fundamentally contrary to Canadian values in the way that slavery laws would be.”
Ultimately, she said, it is up to Justice Minister David Lametti to decide whether “prosecution according to the foreign laws could lead to an unjust or oppressive result according to Canadian values.” The minister decides, if a judge endorses the case for extradition, whether the individual should be extradited. And the courts can review that decision, giving further protection, the judge said, against an unjust result flowing from the context.
Canadian courts could have put Ms. Meng on trial for a similar offence committed in this country, she wrote. ″A domestic prosecution for fraud could properly, I suggest, take place in Canada on the basis of false statements made in Canada that put a U.S. bank at economic risk for violating U.S. sanctions."
Some legal observers said they were not surprised by the ruling. Double criminality is an “expansive concept,” University of New Brunswick law professor Anne Warner La Forest said, adding that “if you’re too narrow … you’re essentially rewarding some criminals.”
The Meng extradition case has put the Canadian justice system in an international spotlight. China arrested two Canadians, Michael Spavor and Michael Kovrig, in apparent reprisal for her arrest; they have been in prison for 535 days. Ms. Meng is on bail and living under a form of house arrest in a Vancouver mansion.
The ruling from Associate Chief Justice Holmes, a former prosecutor and criminal-law policy official, communicated the justice system’s “consistency," said Asad Kiyani, a law professor at the University of Calgary. “You see that Justice Holmes is looking back at the evolution of Canadian extradition, and identifying the broad-based approach." He said judges do “not insist that the laws of every country are perfectly in concordance and exactly mirror one another,” but look to see “that the spirit of the law, the essence of the law, is the same.”
Paul Stern, a Toronto lawyer, said the case “obviously could have gone the other way.” The ruling is “careful, clever, but comes down in favour of international co-operation with the United States as opposed to the liberty of the individual concerned.”
The proceedings still have a long way to go, and timing is uncertain, in part because of the COVID-19 pandemic. In the next court phase, Ms. Meng’s lawyers will argue an abuse of process, based on allegations of improper political motives and of violations of her rights when arrested. In a third phase, the court would have to decide whether enough evidence exists to send her to trial.
Canada’s Justice Department stressed the independence of the judicial process in a statement, adding that the government will work with defence counsel and the court to ensure the case moves as expeditiously as possible. Ms. Meng’s lawyers declined to comment. A Huawei spokesman expressed the company’s disappointment, saying the company expects Canada’s judicial system will ultimately prove Ms. Meng’s innocence. A spokesman for U.S. prosecutors in New York thanked the government of Canada "for its continued assistance pursuant to the U.S./Canada Extradition Treaty in this ongoing matter.”
With a report from Adrian Morrow
Harry-Kari
Vital 1st Team Regular
Good to see someone standing up to the Chinese....their arrest of 2 Canadians shows what a juvenile yet dangerous group the Chinese leadership is...shame Boris doesn’t have a backbone.Good morning.
Just started raining which is OK because I have a TON of work to do.
Looks like China is a little pissed off at Canada right now.
What the Meng Wanzhou ruling means, and how it could have gone the other way
Sean FineJustice Writer
Published 10 hours ago Updated May 27, 2020
34 Comments
% buffered
00:00
Open this photo in gallery
Meng Wanzhou, chief financial officer of Huawei, is seen in B.C. Supreme Court in Vancouver, on May 27, 2020, as Associate Chief Justice Heather Holmes, top, reads the ruling of double criminality in the extradition of Wanzhou.
Jane Wolsak/The Canadian Press
Canadian courts should not let alleged criminals escape prosecution by the country’s international extradition partners on the basis of technical legal arguments, a B.C. Supreme Court judge ruled on Wednesday in allowing the extradition case against Chinese telecom executive Meng Wanzhou to clear an important legal hurdle.
The United States has asked Canada to surrender Ms. Meng to face fraud charges. It accuses the chief financial officer of Huawei Technologies Co. Ltd. of lying to a bank about the company’s business dealings in a bid to evade U.S. sanctions against Iran. China has countered that Canada, which arrested Ms. Meng on Dec. 1, 2018, is engaging in a politically motivated prosecution.
The first phase of the court proceedings, held over four days in January, was to determine whether the alleged conduct would be a crime if committed in Canada, a principle known as double criminality. The Canadian government, representing the U.S. Justice Department, argued that the case is about fraud; Ms. Meng’s lawyers, led by Richard Peck of Vancouver, said it is really about U.S. economic sanctions against Iran. Canada does not have sanctions against that country.
Huawei executive Meng Wanzhou loses key decision in extradition hearing
Days before B.C. court decision on Huawei’s Meng, China threatens ‘damage’ to relations with Canada
Get ready. The chill with China is just going to get colder
Associate Chief Justice Heather Holmes ruled that this argument would put the basic purposes of extradition treaties at risk.
The evasion of sanctions, she wrote in a 23-page ruling, was mere context for an alleged fraud. And people accused of fraud should not be permitted to avoid accountability simply by citing situations in other countries that don’t exist in Canada.
“Ms. Meng’s approach to the double criminality analysis would seriously limit Canada’s ability to fulfill its international obligations in the extradition context for fraud and other economic crimes,” she wrote.
“The offence of fraud has a vast potential scope. It may encompass a very wide range of conduct, a large expanse of time, and acts, people, and consequences in multiple places or jurisdictions.” It should not be given an “artificially narrow scope" in extradition cases.
During the January hearing, Associate Chief Justice Holmes raised a question about whether some frauds might occur in a context offensive to Canadians. But in her ruling, she said that economic sanctions against Iran are “not fundamentally contrary to Canadian values in the way that slavery laws would be.”
Ultimately, she said, it is up to Justice Minister David Lametti to decide whether “prosecution according to the foreign laws could lead to an unjust or oppressive result according to Canadian values.” The minister decides, if a judge endorses the case for extradition, whether the individual should be extradited. And the courts can review that decision, giving further protection, the judge said, against an unjust result flowing from the context.
Canadian courts could have put Ms. Meng on trial for a similar offence committed in this country, she wrote. ″A domestic prosecution for fraud could properly, I suggest, take place in Canada on the basis of false statements made in Canada that put a U.S. bank at economic risk for violating U.S. sanctions."
Some legal observers said they were not surprised by the ruling. Double criminality is an “expansive concept,” University of New Brunswick law professor Anne Warner La Forest said, adding that “if you’re too narrow … you’re essentially rewarding some criminals.”
The Meng extradition case has put the Canadian justice system in an international spotlight. China arrested two Canadians, Michael Spavor and Michael Kovrig, in apparent reprisal for her arrest; they have been in prison for 535 days. Ms. Meng is on bail and living under a form of house arrest in a Vancouver mansion.
The ruling from Associate Chief Justice Holmes, a former prosecutor and criminal-law policy official, communicated the justice system’s “consistency," said Asad Kiyani, a law professor at the University of Calgary. “You see that Justice Holmes is looking back at the evolution of Canadian extradition, and identifying the broad-based approach." He said judges do “not insist that the laws of every country are perfectly in concordance and exactly mirror one another,” but look to see “that the spirit of the law, the essence of the law, is the same.”
Paul Stern, a Toronto lawyer, said the case “obviously could have gone the other way.” The ruling is “careful, clever, but comes down in favour of international co-operation with the United States as opposed to the liberty of the individual concerned.”
The proceedings still have a long way to go, and timing is uncertain, in part because of the COVID-19 pandemic. In the next court phase, Ms. Meng’s lawyers will argue an abuse of process, based on allegations of improper political motives and of violations of her rights when arrested. In a third phase, the court would have to decide whether enough evidence exists to send her to trial.
Canada’s Justice Department stressed the independence of the judicial process in a statement, adding that the government will work with defence counsel and the court to ensure the case moves as expeditiously as possible. Ms. Meng’s lawyers declined to comment. A Huawei spokesman expressed the company’s disappointment, saying the company expects Canada’s judicial system will ultimately prove Ms. Meng’s innocence. A spokesman for U.S. prosecutors in New York thanked the government of Canada "for its continued assistance pursuant to the U.S./Canada Extradition Treaty in this ongoing matter.”
With a report from Adrian Morrow
Real Deal
Alert Team
I bought a hot tub a few years back. It's done wonders for my aching joints.
Will get you smashed in know time as well.
Pompey Yid
Vital Champions League
I did hear that about joints, that's why I decided to get one, should of realised earlier really because after "Hydro" therapy the missus feels brilliant.I bought a hot tub a few years back. It's done wonders for my aching joints.
Will get you smashed in know time as well.
D
Departed
Guest
And here I am taking ice-cold showers after skiing to rejuvenate.
Morning all.
Looking forward to 80’s match thread appearing on the site again . Can’t say I’m much looking forward to the football though . Going through the paces to satisfy contracts . IMO for what it’s worth . Hope you are all well . Make the most of the sunshine , storms are on the way next .
Hope Chiv comes back. And Raph, and Tel , and Total , and all the others that have been missing or lurking (You know who you are ! Ha ha ) .
keep well , keep safe , keep posting
Looking forward to 80’s match thread appearing on the site again . Can’t say I’m much looking forward to the football though . Going through the paces to satisfy contracts . IMO for what it’s worth . Hope you are all well . Make the most of the sunshine , storms are on the way next .
Hope Chiv comes back. And Raph, and Tel , and Total , and all the others that have been missing or lurking (You know who you are ! Ha ha ) .
keep well , keep safe , keep posting
SheringhamNo10
Vital Squad Member
So after two and a half months of being closed. Today is the day. I have a restaurant in the south of Ireland that im re-opening as a take away, having spent the past few weeks taking out furniture, installing safety glass screens etc etc. we are finally ready. I think all restaurants will be offering a take away service moving forward to supplement income from that lost through the impact of social distancing and the restriction on seating capacity that will bring. Who knows what the weekend will bring, bank holiday weekend here so fingers crossed. Time to start earning a few quid again. Enjoy your weekend everyone stay safe!
SmithAndJones
Vital 1st Team Regular
I guess we'll enjoy it Walt if a fully fit Spurs squad win nine on the bounce and qualify for the CL. Dreaming is allowed in lock down,
Spursex
Alert Team
I wish you all the luck in the World; a friend owns 4 restaurants one of which is next to The Globe in London (The Swan) and his businesses have been very hard hit; he too has already open as a takeaway and he's doing a roaring trade.
Fingers crossed for you.
Spursex
Alert Team
Anyway, these Isles are the best in the World when we get daily weather like this, and it's good to be alive.
Hope you all feel the same.
Normal will return soon, I'm convinced of it, but for a while longer, stay aware, stay save and stay alive - this thing is still deadly!
Hope you all feel the same.
Normal will return soon, I'm convinced of it, but for a while longer, stay aware, stay save and stay alive - this thing is still deadly!
Spursex
Alert Team
Good morning.
Just started raining which is OK because I have a TON of work to do.
Looks like China is a little pissed off at Canada right now.
What the Meng Wanzhou ruling means, and how it could have gone the other way
Sean FineJustice Writer
Published 10 hours ago Updated May 27, 2020
34 Comments
% buffered
00:00
Open this photo in gallery
Meng Wanzhou, chief financial officer of Huawei, is seen in B.C. Supreme Court in Vancouver, on May 27, 2020, as Associate Chief Justice Heather Holmes, top, reads the ruling of double criminality in the extradition of Wanzhou.
Jane Wolsak/The Canadian Press
Canadian courts should not let alleged criminals escape prosecution by the country’s international extradition partners on the basis of technical legal arguments, a B.C. Supreme Court judge ruled on Wednesday in allowing the extradition case against Chinese telecom executive Meng Wanzhou to clear an important legal hurdle.
The United States has asked Canada to surrender Ms. Meng to face fraud charges. It accuses the chief financial officer of Huawei Technologies Co. Ltd. of lying to a bank about the company’s business dealings in a bid to evade U.S. sanctions against Iran. China has countered that Canada, which arrested Ms. Meng on Dec. 1, 2018, is engaging in a politically motivated prosecution.
The first phase of the court proceedings, held over four days in January, was to determine whether the alleged conduct would be a crime if committed in Canada, a principle known as double criminality. The Canadian government, representing the U.S. Justice Department, argued that the case is about fraud; Ms. Meng’s lawyers, led by Richard Peck of Vancouver, said it is really about U.S. economic sanctions against Iran. Canada does not have sanctions against that country.
Huawei executive Meng Wanzhou loses key decision in extradition hearing
Days before B.C. court decision on Huawei’s Meng, China threatens ‘damage’ to relations with Canada
Get ready. The chill with China is just going to get colder
Associate Chief Justice Heather Holmes ruled that this argument would put the basic purposes of extradition treaties at risk.
The evasion of sanctions, she wrote in a 23-page ruling, was mere context for an alleged fraud. And people accused of fraud should not be permitted to avoid accountability simply by citing situations in other countries that don’t exist in Canada.
“Ms. Meng’s approach to the double criminality analysis would seriously limit Canada’s ability to fulfill its international obligations in the extradition context for fraud and other economic crimes,” she wrote.
“The offence of fraud has a vast potential scope. It may encompass a very wide range of conduct, a large expanse of time, and acts, people, and consequences in multiple places or jurisdictions.” It should not be given an “artificially narrow scope" in extradition cases.
During the January hearing, Associate Chief Justice Holmes raised a question about whether some frauds might occur in a context offensive to Canadians. But in her ruling, she said that economic sanctions against Iran are “not fundamentally contrary to Canadian values in the way that slavery laws would be.”
Ultimately, she said, it is up to Justice Minister David Lametti to decide whether “prosecution according to the foreign laws could lead to an unjust or oppressive result according to Canadian values.” The minister decides, if a judge endorses the case for extradition, whether the individual should be extradited. And the courts can review that decision, giving further protection, the judge said, against an unjust result flowing from the context.
Canadian courts could have put Ms. Meng on trial for a similar offence committed in this country, she wrote. ″A domestic prosecution for fraud could properly, I suggest, take place in Canada on the basis of false statements made in Canada that put a U.S. bank at economic risk for violating U.S. sanctions."
Some legal observers said they were not surprised by the ruling. Double criminality is an “expansive concept,” University of New Brunswick law professor Anne Warner La Forest said, adding that “if you’re too narrow … you’re essentially rewarding some criminals.”
The Meng extradition case has put the Canadian justice system in an international spotlight. China arrested two Canadians, Michael Spavor and Michael Kovrig, in apparent reprisal for her arrest; they have been in prison for 535 days. Ms. Meng is on bail and living under a form of house arrest in a Vancouver mansion.
The ruling from Associate Chief Justice Holmes, a former prosecutor and criminal-law policy official, communicated the justice system’s “consistency," said Asad Kiyani, a law professor at the University of Calgary. “You see that Justice Holmes is looking back at the evolution of Canadian extradition, and identifying the broad-based approach." He said judges do “not insist that the laws of every country are perfectly in concordance and exactly mirror one another,” but look to see “that the spirit of the law, the essence of the law, is the same.”
Paul Stern, a Toronto lawyer, said the case “obviously could have gone the other way.” The ruling is “careful, clever, but comes down in favour of international co-operation with the United States as opposed to the liberty of the individual concerned.”
The proceedings still have a long way to go, and timing is uncertain, in part because of the COVID-19 pandemic. In the next court phase, Ms. Meng’s lawyers will argue an abuse of process, based on allegations of improper political motives and of violations of her rights when arrested. In a third phase, the court would have to decide whether enough evidence exists to send her to trial.
Canada’s Justice Department stressed the independence of the judicial process in a statement, adding that the government will work with defence counsel and the court to ensure the case moves as expeditiously as possible. Ms. Meng’s lawyers declined to comment. A Huawei spokesman expressed the company’s disappointment, saying the company expects Canada’s judicial system will ultimately prove Ms. Meng’s innocence. A spokesman for U.S. prosecutors in New York thanked the government of Canada "for its continued assistance pursuant to the U.S./Canada Extradition Treaty in this ongoing matter.”
With a report from Adrian Morrow
The French have now stuck a big finger in China's eye, their announcement fo an Euro 8 billion investment in to EV vehicles in France in their car scrappage scheme means all their car manufacturers have scrapped their Chinese engine plant plans and are opening two new huge plants in Europe - and won't be using in Chinese parts.
This is a dangerous time as it's only the beginnig of the kick-back at the Chinese and their behaviour.
Last summer’s biggest rum our was Dybala whom I wanted at all costs which fizzled out for one reason or another. This time round it’s Couthinio whom I would like again at all costs. Will it fizzle out again for one reason or another? Or are these just rumors to keep our hopes up?.
Greavswasthegreatest
Vital Football Legend
Hope yer first name ain't Dominique mate! heh heh
