EU strategy to destroy the Chequers ‘agreement’... | Page 564 | Vital Football

EU strategy to destroy the Chequers ‘agreement’...

Its the same as accepting that the blairites just spent and wasted lots of money. I am no blairite and as you say PFI was a major mistake but - after the starvation of funds under the tories the schools and hospitals needed maintenance and during this period everywhere you went the building stock was being improved plus the staffing in the nhs was increased.

Milliband and the others were absolutely incompetent in electioneering.
 
I had an idea the banks were in the smelly brown stuff when they offered a 120% mortgage to a young couple at work. Both PhD students buying a flat in central London. That was 2005

The person who created the systemic risk was Clinton. That created the corruption of the Fannie Mae and Ginnie Mae pools. That lead to the CMO's/CDO's that lead to the CDS explosion that lead to calamity.

When the futures market drives the cash market the only end result is catastrophe. Every time it has happened it has resulted in a major economic event which hasn't turned out to well for the world.

And guess what they are up to it again.
 
Don't worry, when Labour get into power, they'll spend £400bn over night on their policies.

Yes its keynsian economics. Some call it investment that is needed to counter the coming economic collapse and the climate emergency.

At least you will have a choice in who to vote for instead of the blairite/tory policies or cameron/blairite policies lol.
 
Corbyn would know what to do if it smacked him in the face.

If you believe in Corbynomics take a long hard look at Greece that's us with Jezza and John in charge.

They will push debt over the 100% of GDP marker and if you think the French and the Germans won't use that then you really are naïve.

At best he is promising stuff he can never deliver in one parliament at worst he busts us.

Simple and basic economic fact is we are committed to a pensions funding obligations that means we have to have very good economic growth to sustain it.

Adding more debt to our existing and future known obligations is a recipe for financial ruin. People living longer means more state pension payments. no I am not advocating euthanasia before you start ranting what I am saying is we are simply not in a position currently to fund Corbyn and his pipe dreams of utopia.

Wee Jimmy Kranky is an excellent example of this.
 
Thankyou mr blair lol, this has nothing to do with an individual, its about a return to keynsian economics.

Would you compare Greece with the New Deal in the USA or the growth of the economy in Germany in the 30s?

Maybe you prefer the Thatcherite/ Blairite/Cameron elimination of our manufacturing base and the moving of thousands and thousands of uk jobs abroad?
 
The issue about people living longer is already being addressed by increasing the age at which the state pension can be drawn.

If the average lifespan continues to increase, so do your years of good health if you are lucky.

But are young people getting the message that the need to pay in to a private or vocational pension scheme early if they actually want to still retire at 60 or earlier?

I think the days when state pensions can be expected to provide for a comfortable retirement are well past. Another reason why unreliable employment in the zero hours and GIG economy makes things difficult.
 
But are young people getting the message that the need to pay in to a private or vocational pension scheme early if they actually want to still retire at 60 or earlier?

You`re so right to amplify this message, GillsBluenose. Any young people reading GB`s post - please take good heed; it`s imperative that you think ahead - even though retirement might seem an awful long way off.
 
FMOB, I don't think I want to retire until I am about 70, maybe later when I get there. At 65 my old man was 'cooked' and was ready to retire, but then he'd been through the 1930's and WW2 etc, so I think he had earnt it.
 
Thankyou mr blair lol, this has nothing to do with an individual, its about a return to keynsian economics.

Would you compare Greece with the New Deal in the USA or the growth of the economy in Germany in the 30s?

Maybe you prefer the Thatcherite/ Blairite/Cameron elimination of our manufacturing base and the moving of thousands and thousands of uk jobs abroad?

The Keynesian model is not one you can use in a modern world. The whole basis of the model the J curve was found to be inaccurate and central banks just had to stop using it. The error of margin became to large for its continued use. Its the only part of economics that Freidman ever got right IMHO.

Keynes acknowledged the curve would shift and that realignment would bring economic strife or benefit. Freidman pointed out that the number of contributing factors has increased vastly over the years and that made prediction of where the curve would end up impossible. This invalidation his demand side model.

Keynes himself said his work was not complete as he never fully investigated the supply side theories and that is the part that is screwing up his prediction model. He died before he could do it. He also never paid much attention to monetary policy because in a vastly expanding economy you really don't have to.

Lets be fair Keynes was no god he wanted Germany to pay reparations after WW1 that was the root cause of WW2 although not at the level the French imposed and accurately predicted the worldwide chaos it would cause.

So why you think a return to a fundamentally flawed economic prediction model will work when it hasn't work for at least 50 years needs some explanation.

People don't drop models because they still work they drop them because they don't work.

How you can equate an economic situation in the 30's to today i don t know they just aren't relevant examples in the modern world.

The unions killed manufacturing in this country pure and simple. Their refusal to move wit the times and out of date work practices in a world that could now move manufacturing to another continent was never going to end up in a good place.

Those people would love Corbyn and that is all you really need to know.

Your inability to see anything beyond centrally planned economies is the what holds you back. If you can point to one country that operates that system effectively I would be interested to know.

Corbyn will wipeout the Labour party at this election and it will be people like you who are responsible for it. If Miliband was too left wing to get elected and Corbyn already lost one election because he is too left wing, what on earth makes you think he can win this one. I have voted Labour all my adult life. Been a member for over 35 years man and boy I have left because of Corbyn and his band of malcontents.

They remind me of the French Revolutionaries running around trying to see who is not conforming and executing anybody who didn't follow their beliefs. Then being charged with the same crime by the next bunch of malcontents trying to seize power. It all ended up in a very dark place called Napoleon and millions died as a result.

It's not Corbyn you need to worry about, it's McDonnell he is very scary.
 
You`re so right to amplify this message, GillsBluenose. Any young people reading GB`s post - please take good heed; it`s imperative that you think ahead - even though retirement might seem an awful long way off.
When i was about 18, my Dad sat me down and gave me the pension speech, i thought he was mad as "being old" felt a million years away. Anyway, as soon as I could I joined my company pension scheme (I suppose to stop him nagging ?) but I've come to realise it's the best advice he ever gave me (well, apart from "stay away from the girl at number 72") and I have bored my own son with the same nagging speech.
 
The Keynesian model is not one you can use in a modern world. The whole basis of the model the J curve was found to be inaccurate and central banks just had to stop using it. The error of margin became to large for its continued use. Its the only part of economics that Freidman ever got right IMHO.

Keynes acknowledged the curve would shift and that realignment would bring economic strife or benefit. Freidman pointed out that the number of contributing factors has increased vastly over the years and that made prediction of where the curve would end up impossible. This invalidation his demand side model.

Keynes himself said his work was not complete as he never fully investigated the supply side theories and that is the part that is screwing up his prediction model. He died before he could do it. He also never paid much attention to monetary policy because in a vastly expanding economy you really don't have to.

Lets be fair Keynes was no god he wanted Germany to pay reparations after WW1 that was the root cause of WW2 although not at the level the French imposed and accurately predicted the worldwide chaos it would cause.

So why you think a return to a fundamentally flawed economic prediction model will work when it hasn't work for at least 50 years needs some explanation.

People don't drop models because they still work they drop them because they don't work.

How you can equate an economic situation in the 30's to today i don t know they just aren't relevant examples in the modern world.

The unions killed manufacturing in this country pure and simple. Their refusal to move wit the times and out of date work practices in a world that could now move manufacturing to another continent was never going to end up in a good place.

Those people would love Corbyn and that is all you really need to know.

Your inability to see anything beyond centrally planned economies is the what holds you back. If you can point to one country that operates that system effectively I would be interested to know.

Corbyn will wipeout the Labour party at this election and it will be people like you who are responsible for it. If Miliband was too left wing to get elected and Corbyn already lost one election because he is too left wing, what on earth makes you think he can win this one. I have voted Labour all my adult life. Been a member for over 35 years man and boy I have left because of Corbyn and his band of malcontents.

They remind me of the French Revolutionaries running around trying to see who is not conforming and executing anybody who didn't follow their beliefs. Then being charged with the same crime by the next bunch of malcontents trying to seize power. It all ended up in a very dark place called Napoleon and millions died as a result.

It's not Corbyn you need to worry about, it's McDonnell he is very scary.

Lol. I never said I was in favour of a centrally controlled system and well aware of political and economic history, you seem to have some hangup, understandable as you are really a blairite /thatcherite. Both left and right end up with dictatorship.
Not sure keynes advocated central control and planning of an economy lol.
 
Rambol, why were you ever in the Labour party?

Honest question.

Unions have not always helped themselves in the distant past but a blanket blaming of them for our industry going down the toilet is quite extraordinary for someone who claims to have been active in the Labour party.

Were you in fact a "mole"?

Perhaps your moniker should be "rambolamole"
:-)
 
I think the mood of utter cynicism, this doesn't matter, we're screwed whatever we do was shared by unions and management equally in British manufacturing. The car industry is the obvious example. And the mood prevailed at a time when other countries which had stared into the abyss during the war were saying just tell us what we have to do and we'll get on with it -proving that stuff did matter and there were right and wrong ways of going about things.
 
Lol. I never said I was in favour of a centrally controlled system and well aware of political and economic history, you seem to have some hangup, understandable as you are really a blairite /thatcherite. Both left and right end up with dictatorship.
Not sure keynes advocated central control and planning of an economy lol.


Yes he did advocate the central planning of economies just not to the level the Communists would go. Too some extent we all do because the largest spender in any economy is the government.

I firmly believe that Keynes would have moved to include monetary or supply side economics if he were around today. In the age he lived it wasn't the key driver demand was economies were growing at 5% of GDP annually.
 
China is a country that benefited from central planning but that is not popular with the ‘name one successful socialist country’ gang lol.
In reality they are a mixed economy where central planning is still dominant at present.

The UK will remain a mixed economy no matter who is in charge. We do however lack long term planning and encouragement from the government. This is needed now as the climate crisis and infrastructure needs an organised boost.
 
Don't worry, when Labour get into power, they'll spend £400bn over night on their policies.
Much of that will be on capital projects that will generate a return whether it be through tax collections, increase in productivity, better outcomes in the NHS, more doctors, nurses, engineers etc etc
 
When i was about 18, my Dad sat me down and gave me the pension speech, i thought he was mad as "being old" felt a million years away. Anyway, as soon as I could I joined my company pension scheme (I suppose to stop him nagging ?) but I've come to realise it's the best advice he ever gave me (well, apart from "stay away from the girl at number 72") and I have bored my own son with the same nagging speech.
When I joined my first company and subsequent employer, pension fund membership was obligatory. Then Mrs Thatcher said it should be the individual's choice and what happened - many didn't bother. Look where we are now with many bereft of a decent pension. Keep on nagging Nobby