Bad news for Buddha & travellers in general | Page 2 | Vital Football

Bad news for Buddha & travellers in general

shotshy said:
Talking of Wild Campers, the Exmoor Rangers have traditionally turned a blind eye because the hardcore campers used to stay a night or two in one place and clean up after themselves so you wouldn’t know they had been there.
Now the problem is wild camping by the Festival types who rock up, make a mess and leave all their crap behind, including tents and sleeping bags.
It’s a big problem for the wildlife and the Rangers are saying that clearing up is taking up half their time.
Same old story unfortunately, some ruining things for others.
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Maybe Buddha should be looking down that way for some work ? Recycling rubbish , a couple of months hard graft and you can take the rest of the year off.
 
chris who said:
I don't know if we can help change things but I have just got quite a influential family member to sign.She is a retired teacher and has influence at a church so let's hope she can help get a few more for you.
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I've no doubt the petition will succeed , now that it might receive some divine intervention 👍
 
valenciagill said:
I've no doubt the petition will succeed , now that it might receive some divine intervention 👍
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Little acorns. I would say I lead a very insignificant life in the grand scheme of things.i would not expect you to understand how in the end good will always defeat evil.
 
Another subject where people look at the smaller picture and allow our right to be eroded.

If we have held the freedom of movement across our lands for thousands of years without anyone having the rights to stop us moving from place to place or in a time of crisis to have the ability to camp for safety then exactly why are we giving up those freedoms?
 
chris who said:
I don't know if we can help change things but I have just got quite a influential family member to sign.She is a retired teacher and has influence at a church so let's hope she can help get a few more for you.
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This is what the law is designed to prevent

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/herne-bay/news/travellers-pitch-up-near-supermarket-230997/

Trespass is currently a civil offence so is down to councils to sort out. The law makes it a criminal offence, so the police can sort it out.

If people that sign the petition have got a drive would offer it to a traveller family to park on?. If they wouldn't, they are hypocrites to sign
 
Jerryattrick said:
Another subject where people look at the smaller picture and allow our right to be eroded.

If we have held the freedom of movement across our lands for thousands of years without anyone having the rights to stop us moving from place to place or in a time of crisis to have the ability to camp for safety then exactly why are we giving up those freedoms?
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We are not giving up freedoms. You can't pitch up on someone else's property now. This law is changing the offence from civil to criminal.
 
Buddha said:
With regard to the article, Abbie Kirkby is a good friend of mine. And one of the photos is from Hedge-U-Cation and the two blokes in the picture are mates of mine. The blue horsebox in the background belongs to another friend of mine.

Hedge-U-Cation is held during the Spring half-term holiday and is a new traveller festival mainly (but not entirely) for the kids. New travellers from all over the country come to Hedge-U-Cation and set up workshops for the kids. It's really good and the kids get to do loads of traditional arts and crafts including woodwork, metalwork, basketry, wild food foraging and making preserves. It wasn't held this year because of Covid but I've taken the library bus there the last few years.


And then my mates playing, with the briefest glimpse of me at the back, taking a swig of beer!

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If your foot doesn't start tapping to that, it'll tap to nothing. Great music.
 
ThreeSixes said:
We are not giving up freedoms. You can't pitch up on someone else's property now. This law is changing the offence from civil to criminal.
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If we already have ancient freedoms and they are stopped then we must be losing freedoms.
A simpler more aimed law could have easily resolved the problem.

This is why we have a second chamber so that laws can be reviewed for long term unintended consequences.
 
ThreeSixes said:
The Petition;

Don’t criminalise trespass
The Government's manifesto stated “we will make intentional trespass a criminal offence”: an extreme, illiberal & unnecessary attack on ancient freedoms that would threaten walkers, campers, and the wider public. It would further tilt the law in favour of the landowning 1% who own half the country.
▼More details
For a thousand years, trespass has been a civil offence – but now the Government is proposing to make trespass a criminal offence: a crime against the state. Doing so could:
- Criminalise ramblers who stray even slightly from the path;
- Remove the ability of local residents to establish new rights of way;
- Criminalise wild camping, denying hikers a night under the stars;
- Clamp down on peaceful protest, a fundamental right and essential part of our democracy;
- Impact Traveller communities.

They've sugar-coated that!
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They clearly haven't read the Govt's Consultation.
 
Buddha said:
And Tarian wonders why I call them *****.
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I feel sure that the last time this came up, you tried to make out this wasn't your sort of language.
Maybe I'm mis-remembering.:rolleyes:

But to the point....
Buddha said:
I've known about the proposed legislation for some while but had hoped that Covid might have knocked it down their list of priorities.

It is bad news. And George Monbiot is right, if this becomes law it wont simply be used against travellers.

There is so much I could say about this but it is literally too close to home for me and I'm not really up for discussing it too much on here.

I don't want to live in this shithole of a country anyway. I'm only still here because my son aint grown up yet. But he nearly is. Then I'm off. You lot can keep your Tory Britain..
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Have you actually read the ideas floated in the Consultation ?
(or as so often, relied on the Guardian...?)

In fact has any one of those complaining at the "Tory Government" read them ?

Because they do not propose what:
a) the Traveller Times says
b) that Petition says.

To save you some time, the Consultation says:
A) "...undertake a review into how this Government can criminalise the act of trespassing when setting up an unauthorised encampment in England and Wales, learning from the trespass legislation that exists in the Republic of Ireland."

So NOT as critics claim, "criminalising general roaming on private land" "ancient rights", whatever.


B) "we would like to test the appetite to go further and broaden the existing categories of criminal trespass to cover trespassers on land who are there with the purpose of residing in their vehicle for any period"

So quite narrowly "residing in vehicles".


C) For those still claiming some sort of "Trojan Horse" to extend criminalisation to things like motorists kipping in their car.

"Amending section 61 of the Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994 to lower the number of vehicles needing to be involved in an unauthorised encampment before police powers can be exercised from six to two or more vehicles."

So you'd only be at risk in a convoy of two or more.

The next is a guess, but here goes....
I'm pretty sure that "unauthorised encampment" has been tested in law.
I doubt if a couple of vehicles resting overnight in a lay-by would be affected.
 
Buddha said:
For what it's worth, there is a petition here:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/300139
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My MP Joe Churchill (Conservative)come out in support of your campaign and peace loving travelers like yourself. I have just received a email hopefully enough have listened.Thank you to everyone who signed the petition it at least changed one MPS opinion. She was only against the new law because of Ramblers the first e mail.
 
chris who said:
My MP Joe Churchill (Conservative)come out in support of your campaign and peace loving travelers like yourself. I have just received a email hopefully enough have listened.Thank you to everyone who signed the petition it at least changed one MPS opinion. She was only against the new law because of Ramblers the first e mail.
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Bless your heart, Chris. Many thanks.
 
Criminalisation of trespassing is the godsend a lot of those of us who live in rural areas and communities have been hoping for for years. I've seen first hand the mess that some travellers leave behind on other people's private land or public land and the hassle and expense good, hard-working law-abiding people have in getting them off their land and clearing up after them.

Has any one seen a petition in support of this?
 
SteveTreacle said:
Criminalisation of trespassing is the godsend a lot of those of us who live in rural areas and communities have been hoping for for years. I've seen first hand the mess that some travellers leave behind on other people's private land or public land and the hassle and expense good, hard-working law-abiding people have in getting them off their land and clearing up after them.

Has any one seen a petition in support of this?
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So what you are saying is Buddha is a criminal in your opinion and should be treated as such?
In my opinion there are far bigger problems in society caused by people with millions in the bank who live and use this country as their home but don't pay taxes.If they did the country could afford to employ more people to look after the homeless and people struggling to stay alive because they do not have the riches that many others take for granted .Some of which put no more funds in than the people they and their political friends now want to criminalise.
 
chris who said:
So what you are saying is Buddha is a criminal in your opinion and should be treated as such?
In my opinion there are far bigger problems in society caused by people with millions in the bank who live and use this country as their home but don't pay taxes.If they did the country could afford to employ more people to look after the homeless and people struggling to stay alive because they do not have the riches that many others take for granted .Some of which put no more funds in than the people they and their political friends now want to criminalise.
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If he trasspasses on other people's land, he is acting against the law. At present, it is not criminal, but I hope it soon is and support making trespassing a criminal offence. It may not matter to you, but it does to me and a lot of other people and your attempt at "whataboutery" (and trite rambling on about homeless people and poor people struggling) doesn't really wash. What;s that got to do with about the matter in hand other than trying to divert the subject and irelevantly gain sympathy for your argument? I, like you, am against people who evade tax, but the principle of what they are doing is no different to people trespassing on other people's land and not paying to stay there.

As I said above, I live in the sticks and myself and my family (and there are a few of us who live there) have some decent land. One of our biggest fears is seeing some of these freeloaders turn up on our land one day, not being able to get rid of them (and taking huge time and expense to do so) and then have to clear up after them. This comes not from prejudice, but having seen it happen dozens of times in the local area first hand. If there is anything that can be done to make it difficult for them to stop them (and punish them for doing it), I'm all over that to be honest and rambling on abot "other problems in society" doesn't mean water that down.
 
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