Aston Villa v Norwich City Match Thread - Thu 26 Dec, 3pm | Page 30 | Vital Football

Aston Villa v Norwich City Match Thread - Thu 26 Dec, 3pm

Villan57 said:
They are are not Wingers in the traditional sense, nothing like wingers they are strikers, when as anyone described Salah or Mane as a winger or even a wide player?
Click to expand...

They are indeed strikers, just spread around the pitch a bit.

I've no doubt that having such top quality players as those in the forward line contributes heavily to Liverpool's success - life is so much easier for everyone else when the opposition really has to worry about having players like that on the ball in their final third.

It's precisely what we don't have of course and I still maintain that we'd look a lot better team if we had a couple of players with at least some presence up front to take pressure off our midfield and there's almost no presence provided by Wesley and Ghazi up there. Trez isn't great at keeping the ball but at least he runs around an awful lot and gives the defence something to think about.
 
tarzansbrother said:
Surely his main role and the reason he is on the pitch is to have shots on target?
Click to expand...
Not if you listen to what Dean Smith has said multiple times about Wesley's role. Tammy's goal-scoring numbers went down significantly under Dean Smith too. He sees the number nine as a link player, to occupy centre-backs and create opportunities for others. It's a fallacy to judge our number 9 on goals scored.
 
gmvillan said:
Not if you listen to what Dean Smith has said multiple times about Wesley's role. Tammy's goal-scoring numbers went down significantly under Dean Smith too. He sees the number nine as a link player, to occupy centre-backs and create opportunities for others. It's a fallacy to judge our number 9 on goals scored.
Click to expand...

Can't wait to see the stick Davis gets who is twice the player Wesley is at that sort of thing
 
Villan57 said:
Great balls in from Elmo yesterday and he's nowhere to be seen BB, Targett got the byline second half fired the ball in and Wesly is still on the edge of the box watching hands on hips
Click to expand...

That headed ball that went through El Ghazi's legs on the six yard line in Norwich's box, Wesley was a yard behind El Ghazi and just stood with his arms spread, no attempt to get the ball.
He's got no desire at all. I'd be fining him a weeks wage every time he didn't have two shots on target.
The kids have an 18 year old forward, Vassilev, whose difficult to knock off the ball, who puts himself about and knows where the net is. I'd give him 10 or 15 minutes at the end of 5 or 6 games to see what he can do.
He's too young a lot will cry but, Greenwood at Man U is 18 and regularly gets minutes and has notched 8 goals this season so far.
 
gmvillan said:
Not if you listen to what Dean Smith has said multiple times about Wesley's role. Tammy's goal-scoring numbers went down significantly under Dean Smith too. He sees the number nine as a link player, to occupy centre-backs and create opportunities for others. It's a fallacy to judge our number 9 on goals scored.[/QUOTE
gmvillan said:
Not if you listen to what Dean Smith has said multiple times about Wesley's role. Tammy's goal-scoring numbers went down significantly under Dean Smith too. He sees the number nine as a link player, to occupy centre-backs and create opportunities for others. It's a fallacy to judge our number 9 on goals scored.[/QUOTE. Great idea , let's tell Wes the plan,now watch us go.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Grealish gave Targett a proper bollicking. The difference in desire and class is obvious. I hope Dean and the coaching staff can improve Targett to a level equal to his purchase price because having to admit defeat and find yet another left back would be a very poor judgement on our recruitment policy.
Grealish is irreplaceable and I can’t help feeling that we’re a long Super Jack injury layoff from relegation.
 
gmvillan said:
Not if you listen to what Dean Smith has said multiple times about Wesley's role. Tammy's goal-scoring numbers went down significantly under Dean Smith too. He sees the number nine as a link player, to occupy centre-backs and create opportunities for others. It's a fallacy to judge our number 9 on goals scored.
Click to expand...

For £22m I expect a striker that can create his own chances and also have shots on target. If we need a player like you have described let’s get Glenn Murray in 🤣
 
1958Villan said:
That headed ball that went through El Ghazi's legs on the six yard line in Norwich's box, Wesley was a yard behind El Ghazi and just stood with his arms spread, no attempt to get the ball.
He's got no desire at all. I'd be fining him a weeks wage every time he didn't have two shots on target.
The kids have an 18 year old forward, Vassilev, whose difficult to knock off the ball, who puts himself about and knows where the net is. I'd give him 10 or 15 minutes at the end of 5 or 6 games to see what he can do.
He's too young a lot will cry but, Greenwood at Man U is 18 and regularly gets minutes and has notched 8 goals this season so far.
Click to expand...

That's the thing that surprises me most about our bench considering the lack of experience anyway why is the not one single young up and coming player on it .
 
ironside said:
Grealish gave Targett a proper bollicking. The difference in desire and class is obvious. I hope Dean and the coaching staff can improve Targett to a level equal to his purchase price because having to admit defeat and find yet another left back would be a very poor judgement on our recruitment policy.
Grealish is irreplaceable and I can’t help feeling that we’re a long Super Jack injury layoff from relegation.
Click to expand...

Worryingly Deano see's an England left-back in Targett , I see a pansy
 
ldgavfc said:
I personally think we need to win the next two. We needed to win against Norwich and Southampton, losing to Southampton was bigger than we think. Lose to Watford which looks likely and we are in trouble, dont get anything against Burnley and we have Man City after that. Dont want to be bottom of the league in February do we?
Click to expand...
Is this the same saints team that turned the over spent on players Chelsea over?
Why do you think we will lose to Watford before we have even kicked a ball?
A draw would be a great result against a relagation rival away. If we are bottom or in the bottom 3 in Feb so be it. As long as we are still in touching distance with 8 games to go with new players bedding in, bring it on.
Imagine if we win the next 3 games, will you be expecting European football so we could be near those teams.
 
Villan57 said:
Worryingly Deano see's an England left-back in Targett , I see a pansy
Click to expand...

When the talk was about taking a left-sided defender from Soton I was arguing for McQueen instead of Targett, mainly because he could play left midfield, or left wing, as well as left fullback.
 
1958Villan said:
When the talk was about taking a left-sided defender from Soton I was arguing for McQueen instead of Targett, mainly because he could play left midfield, or left wing, as well as left fullback.
Click to expand...

I was never impressed by Bertrand when we had him and he was keeping Targett out of the Southampton side. I seem to remember saints fans taking the Micheal out of us signing him for so much, which is nearly always what fans do.
He might however make a wing-back with Hause behind him
 
Villan57 said:
We'll disagree on that one our wingers are wingers their, "wingers" are 20+ season goalscorers and you don't score goals like that from the corner flag or touchline
Click to expand...
I think we are disagreeing on the definition of a winger to be honest, because I usually agree with you on player abilities and i think we both know our wide players aren't good enough.

Whatever Ashley Young was, a winger or a wide forward, whatever, that's what we need. Someone to create and score from wide positions instead of whatever the hell Trez and El Ghazi do for 90 minutes. Grealish can obviously do a world class job out there but he likes a more central free role and if we want to keep anyone happy, its him.
 
1958Villan said:
The role of a winger changed a long time ago.
As for your list, none of them are traditional wingers, they all play as strikers who interchange positions regularly. None more so than the Liverpool front three, even Firmino will be out wide now and again. Both Salah and Mane end up in the box playing inside the width of the goalposts more often than not. The same can be said for Sterling and Sane and to a lesser extent Mahrez.
When was the last time you saw Hudson-Odoi or Willian play as out and out wingers, the answer is you don't because they play as midfielders who will, play needing, drift out wide.
Click to expand...

Saying the role of a winger changed doesn't take away from the fact that we need wingers. Saying wingers play as strikers is false, wide players have been drifting inside for decades and scoring goals, doesn't make them strikers. Sterling and Mane play wide as possible during build up to stretch play and then drift inside when time and play suits. Salah I agree will sit quite narrowly and sometimes plays as an out and out forward, especially last season, but hes still a winger. Willian is an old fashioned winger, rarely cuts inside.
 
ldgavfc said:
I think we are disagreeing on the definition of a winger to be honest, because I usually agree with you on player abilities and i think we both know our wide players aren't good enough.

Whatever Ashley Young was, a winger or a wide forward, whatever, that's what we need. Someone to create and score from wide positions instead of whatever the hell Trez and El Ghazi do for 90 minutes. Grealish can obviously do a world class job out there but he likes a more central free role and if we want to keep anyone happy, its him.
Click to expand...

Ashley didn't bang in 20 a season from the wing though. My point is Liverpool play 3 strikers we play with one, who couldn't striker a match and two wingers who stay wide and couldn't cross the road never mind a football.
We don't even have 3 strikers to play that system.

He needs to go 442 or 4231 not this ineffective 433 which ends up 451
 
gmvillan said:
Not if you listen to what Dean Smith has said multiple times about Wesley's role. Tammy's goal-scoring numbers went down significantly under Dean Smith too. He sees the number nine as a link player, to occupy centre-backs and create opportunities for others. It's a fallacy to judge our number 9 on goals scored.
Click to expand...

I'm sure you're right - the problem I have is that pretty much any player can do that so spunking £22m on such a player seems like folly if that's all they can do and I'm not so sure, in the English game where you're up against centre-backs who can be both strong and relatively quick, that he's up to the job - yet at least.

I'm probably at the end of my shit-giving on Wesley, however, until he sees the ball more often. It's probably an exagerration to say he only touches the ball half a dozen times per game but it feels like that.

Hence why I give more shit to Ghazi who sees the ball 4x more than Wesley but rarely does anything with it and I don't think either of them do enough work off the ball to make up for their shortcomings although yesterday was an exception perhaps.

Both of them could use a confidence boost for sure but this is EPL football, nobody is going to gift that to you - we just mentioned Liverpool's epicly talented front three but look at the shifts they put in on top of their talent, that's why they're miles away from everyone else.

Players like Wesley and Ghazi are never going to match that level of talent but matching that work rate is entirely in their own hands ...
 
1958Villan said:
That headed ball that went through El Ghazi's legs on the six yard line in Norwich's box, Wesley was a yard behind El Ghazi and just stood with his arms spread, no attempt to get the ball.
He's got no desire at all. I'd be fining him a weeks wage every time he didn't have two shots on target.
The kids have an 18 year old forward, Vassilev, whose difficult to knock off the ball, who puts himself about and knows where the net is. I'd give him 10 or 15 minutes at the end of 5 or 6 games to see what he can do.
He's too young a lot will cry but, Greenwood at Man U is 18 and regularly gets minutes and has notched 8 goals this season so far.
Click to expand...

Indiana Vassilev?

With a name like that how can you not try him?

If he replaces Ghazi then perhaps there's nothing to lose there.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.