A sense of perspective is required | Vital Football

A sense of perspective is required

mao tse tung

mao tse tung

Vital Champions League
The manager is doing and saying the right things; a string of consistently good performances will surely follow!

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...karanka-championship-spending-spree-Newcastle

Asked how far away Forest are from reaching top gear, Karanka admits his team need time. “Hopefully it’s as soon as possible, but the aim is always the following game,” he says. “The expectations are really high, not just here in the city but the expectations of Nottingham Forest are really high. We have a plan, we know the plan and we cannot change every single week if we have lost or not played the best.


“In the way they are training every day, the way they are approaching the games, you can feel the desire to win games in their faces. One day everything will be perfect and we will win a lot of games, for sure.”
 
I hope he’s right and trust he is. But in truth it’s kind of boring talking about it now, the only statements off any real worth will now be on the pitch (or not). Not worth revisiting for at least another 5 or 6 games.
 
mao tse tung said:
The manager is doing and saying the right things; a string of consistently good performances will surely follow!

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...karanka-championship-spending-spree-Newcastle

Asked how far away Forest are from reaching top gear, Karanka admits his team need time. “Hopefully it’s as soon as possible, but the aim is always the following game,” he says. “The expectations are really high, not just here in the city but the expectations of Nottingham Forest are really high. We have a plan, we know the plan and we cannot change every single week if we have lost or not played the best.


“In the way they are training every day, the way they are approaching the games, you can feel the desire to win games in their faces. One day everything will be perfect and we will win a lot of games, for sure.”
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fair comment. Fwiw this sums up exactly where I am at.

Think we can all be more critical cos the bar has risen but one or two should take the time to actually digest what is being said.
 
We were poor tail end of last season. First game against Bristol we could have been 3 down by halftime. Improved second half but was lucky to get a draw.
WBA played really good football. Could have been a couple up, but change of formation and tiring meant we were hanging on for last 15 mins and were lucky to get a draw. Reading we were awful whole game and lucky to get anything not alone a win. Bury, one shot on goal. Awful again. Wigan could have been three down by halftime. Lucky draw. Brum again, second best. Lucky to get draw.
I am not seeing anything that gives a great deal of hope. Poor defending, soft midfield and rigid formation. The opposition know exactly how to set up against us. Too slow, too predictable.
I do not see a string of consistency or positive results being anywhere near the horizon, nor round the corner without some major changes.
 
I always thought that not losing when you are obviously 2nd best in a game was the mark of a good side. The players will learn more about each other fighting back from behind in games to strolling to 3-0 wins everygame. We've seen glimpses of what level we can play at bit we have also seen the character and togetherness of the squad in refusing to lie down and be beaten.

Still a lot to improve on but I doubt under karanka we will ever have a team that just rolls over like we have had in recent years.
 
I think there is genuine reasons for both perspectives right now, negative or positive. Im usually prone to be over optimistic I admit and have suffered through it as much as all of us. So it does try and make me be more rational in my serious moments. That rationality makes me think all of this can still go either way and im more in hope than expectation after the first month of play.

Concerning to see grabban out again. with a knock. What sort of knock does an expensive striker yet to score a goal need to miss games? personally nothing less than a broken leg should keep them from chomping at the bit to get on the pitch. With me already questioning his fitness and thinking he hasnt sprinted at 100% once yet then it has to be a worry.
 
apocalypse said:
I always thought that not losing when you are obviously 2nd best in a game was the mark of a good side. The players will learn more about each other fighting back from behind in games to strolling to 3-0 wins everygame. We've seen glimpses of what level we can play at bit we have also seen the character and togetherness of the squad in refusing to lie down and be beaten.

Still a lot to improve on but I doubt under karanka we will ever have a team that just rolls over like we have had in recent years.
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When you arent playing very well but can still defend and keep yourself in games due to that good solidity is when that applies. We could have been 3 or 4 down in a few of those games. It was luck and poor finishing, not resolute defending by any stretch
 
Heard it all before he can talk a good game all he wants or demand respect like his equally Park the bus mate but it’s what he does performance & results wise that matter. It is too early to judge but the Boro fans comments are coming to fruition more & more.

Also good interviews Dour Doug could talk a good game all he wanted while KING BILL made a complete dick of himself but who delivered the results & performances?
 
Woanz said:
Heard it all before he can talk a good game all he wants or demand respect like his equally Park the bus mate but it’s what he does performance & results wise that matter. It is too early to judge but the Boro fans comments are coming to fruition more & more.

Also good interviews Dour Doug could talk a good game all he wanted while KING BILL made a complete dick of himself but who delivered the results & performances?
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results and performances on the same day were quite rare, certainly when it actually counted
 
paz1967 said:
results and performances on the same day were quite rare, certainly when it actually counted
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Better than dour Dougs though me owd. You can give all the great “pressers” you want but it’s the pitch that’s important.
 
Woanz said:
Better than dour Dougs though me owd. You can give all the great “pressers” you want but it’s the pitch that’s important.
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I understand that rating BD better than a dozen of our previous managers is fair. Just doesnt make him any good ;) We reallly need Kranks to be better whichever way we look at it ;)_
 
paz1967 said:
I understand that rating BD better than a dozen of our previous managers is fair. Just doesnt make him any good ;) We reallly need Kranks to be better whichever way we look at it ;)_
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We do but I have my doubts on him being that or getting the required time given big Marz record in Greece.
 
Woanz said:
Heard it all before he can talk a good game all he wants or demand respect like his equally Park the bus mate but it’s what he does performance & results wise that matter. It is too early to judge but the Boro fans comments are coming to fruition more & more.

Also good interviews Dour Doug could talk a good game all he wanted while KING BILL made a complete dick of himself but who delivered the results & performances?
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I know you're partly on the wind up but it's worth noting that AK's record is pretty similar to BD's at the same stage of his first tenure.

During the early part of BD's first spell we saw some dreadful football and in the first few games of the 2009-10 season there was little to suggest we would have a successful season.
 
You aren't going to get a sense of perspective.

Look at what you see.

The team hasnt lost yet but results aren't good enough. No one can quite say what good enough is.

The manager is being slaughtered because he has been offered a load of money to spend on a tight timescale for promotion and has had the audacity to use it. Some of our fans hate that because they fantasize about being successful for very little money. Some would prioritise that over having success at all.

Players that haven't ignited after three games are being slated as bad buys while Warburton players that were poor over a season such as McKay are having their performances here and elsewhere inflated.

Performances are being slagged off in general. Even performances like Bristol, generally said by those that went to be good, have now become 'poor'.

Last season is being used as further damning evidence. Apparently we got steadily worse towards the end of the season, which is a very interesting interpretation of the facts.

The reality is that some people just don't want what Karanka is selling. Some fans are wedded ideologically to a certain style they want to see, would rather see even if it were harmful to success. That's their choice.

I don't blame them because I was a similar position with Warburton. I don't have a set style I want to see but I certainly never wanted that shit and shit it was.

It would be better if they would stop with the spurious scraping the barrell justifications for their dislike and just admit it for what it is.

I said when he was appointed that I couldn't see Karanka working simply because we have too many fans who would never accept his style because it isn't 'pure' enough.

There is a real bi-partisan funk around the fanbase and we desperately need a successful manager to break that
 
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Good post. saved me having to tell Woanz go back a pip.

The idea of purest forest philosophy makes me laugh- clough openly admitted he'd sell his gran for 3 pts. I actually do care about the football we play but this has to be tempered with effectiveness.
 
paz1967 said:
When you arent playing very well but can still defend and keep yourself in games due to that good solidity is when that applies. We could have been 3 or 4 down in a few of those games. It was luck and poor finishing, not resolute defending by any stretch
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Still had the desire,work ethic and team spirit to get draws when undoubtedly we deserved to lose. Under warbs,Pearce,montanier etc the team would've capitulated and lost. While that spirit is there and the work ethic is there you have chance.
Would rather have that than a bunch of bottlers who give up when things go against them.
While they are together as a squad and believe in karanka then there is hope as there is some definite quality in the squad now.

Big improvements still needed but the sort of form we have shown was to be expected with the number of new faces.
Personally I think it takes more than August to be able to make a proper informed judgement
 
Pope John XXIII said:
You aren't going to get a sense of perspective.

Look at what you see.

The team hasnt lost yet but results aren't good enough. No one can quite say what good enough is.

The manager is being slaughtered because he has been offered a load of money to spend on a tight timescale for promotion and has had the audacity to use it. Some of our fans hate that because they fantasize about being successful for very little money. Some would prioritise that over having success at all.

Players that haven't ignited after three games are being slated as bad buys while Warburton players that were poor over a season such as McKay are having their performances here and elsewhere inflated.

Performances are being slagged off in general. Even performances like Bristol, generally said by those that went to be good, have now become 'poor'.

Last season is being used as further damning evidence. Apparently we got steadily worse towards the end of the season, which is a very interesting interpretation of the facts.

The reality is that some people just don't want what Karanka is selling. Some fans are wedded ideologically to a certain style they want to see, would rather see even if it were harmful to success. That's their choice.

I don't blame them because I was a similar position with Warburton. I don't have a set style I want to see but I certainly never wanted that shit and shit it was.

It would be better if they would stop with the spurious scraping the barrell justifications for their dislike and just admit it for what it is.

I said when he was appointed that I couldn't see Karanka working simply because we have too many fans who would never accept his style because it isn't 'pure' enough.

There is a real bi-partisan funk around the fanbase and we desperately need a successful manager to break that
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Some of this is accurate, the rest is your usual Anti-MW wank material. For the record MacKay was 10x the player Clough was last season and one you chose to defend, the other pillar. Guess which is which...You're as guilty of biased nonsense as anyone on here.
 
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