The Plastic Crisis/Environment Thread | Page 51 | Vital Football

The Plastic Crisis/Environment Thread

wittonite said:
Fully agree. Oil prices have been tumbling, but as usual fuel prices stay high.Another big business con. Maybe legal extortion is a better word.As regards elections, not a lot of choice really is there?
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And as we've said before, given current advancements it is long time to change the OPEC mark up where gas is basically low-flated in place of electric, when electric has far more sustainable and cheaper options of provision.

It's the one thing Rishi and others constantly ignore, we don't need the same gas to provide electric as even 5 years ago, so why is the price still basically set at 20 years ago?

I'd go with legal extortion mate, my issue with con is the wider environment, but there's no doubting they are a fucking cartel, often Government backed because at worst they turn a blind eye.

Re elections there are, not a perfect one, and no one is 100% happy, but there is still the better of devil's. But I wholeheartedly agree (different thread) we are back to why do you select a PM via a local MP count? Democracy at best is coalition (each reining the other in, whilst pushing slightly different agendas - yes the Libs fucked that lol) I see no problem in voting for a different party MP whilst voting for different party county councillors or PM even.

Unless you truly believe in the policy, make them work against each other for your best interest.

When you have the system we now have, is it any wonder Tory's can line their own, and friends pockets with our money without recourse, and how many times is Rishi going to appoint the company he has shares in to run things?

Oh, he got to talk to Elon Musk tonight. Make a wish you short fucker, these kids would do better.
 
Anybody who has read my posts on Solar Panels will know that I am a great believer in the benefits of them and I have stated on many occasions that every building that can have them fitted should have them.
However something that I have never considered is what happens to them when they break down or come to the end of their life and are no longer of any use. Well I now know.
I recently read a report on it saying that the world is heading for a disaster greater than the plastic crisis.
There is nothing in a solar panel that is worth recycling nor is it financially worth doing anything with them.
Therefore millions and millions of them are all going to end up in landfills around the world.
They really started to be introduced after 2000 and really took off after 2010. Mine were installed in 2015 so it wont be long before the problem kicks in.
There is only one factory in the UK, I think it said in Wakefield that can deal with them but that is not yet in operation and all they are doing is stockpiling the old panels. They are building another factory.
The biggest factory in the world is in France but like the UK one its not yet open and doing nothing.
According to the paperwork with mine it states that they should last for between 25 and 30 years, so a long way off.
Unless Governments around the world are prepared to heavily subsidise companies to come up with a way to deal with them the problem wont go away.
I still think they are great and they save me hundreds of pounds a year.
Something else for the younger generations to worry about.
 
astonion2 said:
Anybody who has read my posts on Solar Panels will know that I am a great believer in the benefits of them and I have stated on many occasions that every building that can have them fitted should have them.
However something that I have never considered is what happens to them when they break down or come to the end of their life and are no longer of any use. Well I now know.
I recently read a report on it saying that the world is heading for a disaster greater than the plastic crisis.
There is nothing in a solar panel that is worth recycling nor is it financially worth doing anything with them.
Therefore millions and millions of them are all going to end up in landfills around the world.
They really started to be introduced after 2000 and really took off after 2010. Mine were installed in 2015 so it wont be long before the problem kicks in.
There is only one factory in the UK, I think it said in Wakefield that can deal with them but that is not yet in operation and all they are doing is stockpiling the old panels. They are building another factory.
The biggest factory in the world is in France but like the UK one its not yet open and doing nothing.
According to the paperwork with mine it states that they should last for between 25 and 30 years, so a long way off.
Unless Governments around the world are prepared to heavily subsidise companies to come up with a way to deal with them the problem wont go away.
I still think they are great and they save me hundreds of pounds a year.
Something else for the younger generations to worry about.
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This is something I am aware of , because as you may have read on this thread,thousands of acres of beautiful green Cornish farmlands are turning black under these things. Grab the cash and fuck the consequences. I hate them. They are more intrusive than wind turbines. That being said if I had a property with a bit of acreage and it could accommodate a sufficient number without being an eye sore too other people, I would probably install some, purely on cost efficiency grounds, but not if electricity was cheaper from the usual source.This is part of the problem with green alternatives, we never ever get the full picture, warts and all, with regards to total production costs, total pollution costs from the mining of all the precious metals that go into things, total pollution from the industry that produces things, so you can never get a true picture. Disposal cost and environmental damage are a huge part of this, but as you say, that's for someone else to deal with. The usual thing, kick the can down the road.You just get sold a green concept and told that the alternative is bad.( gas,oil.)
 
mike_field said:
And as we've said before, given current advancements it is long time to change the OPEC mark up where gas is basically low-flated in place of electric, when electric has far more sustainable and cheaper options of provision.

It's the one thing Rishi and others constantly ignore, we don't need the same gas to provide electric as even 5 years ago, so why is the price still basically set at 20 years ago?

I'd go with legal extortion mate, my issue with con is the wider environment, but there's no doubting they are a fucking cartel, often Government backed because at worst they turn a blind eye.

Re elections there are, not a perfect one, and no one is 100% happy, but there is still the better of devil's. But I wholeheartedly agree (different thread) we are back to why do you select a PM via a local MP count? Democracy at best is coalition (each reining the other in, whilst pushing slightly different agendas - yes the Libs fucked that lol) I see no problem in voting for a different party MP whilst voting for different party county councillors or PM even.

Unless you truly believe in the policy, make them work against each other for your best interest.

When you have the system we now have, is it any wonder Tory's can line their own, and friends pockets with our money without recourse, and how many times is Rishi going to appoint the company he has shares in to run things?

Oh, he got to talk to Elon Musk tonight. Make a wish you short fucker, these kids would do better.
Click to expand...
Further to your point Mike, Friday, Express and Daily Mail ran an article about supermarket fuel prices and the fact that oil prices have dropped and they are ripping people off ( con)🤣 and this was disputed. However toping up the car today Morrisons fuel price Sunday was £1.62 litre, today £1.52 litre. A whole 10p off. Corporate theft.
 
astonion2 said:
Anybody who has read my posts on Solar Panels will know that I am a great believer in the benefits of them and I have stated on many occasions that every building that can have them fitted should have them.
However something that I have never considered is what happens to them when they break down or come to the end of their life and are no longer of any use. Well I now know.
I recently read a report on it saying that the world is heading for a disaster greater than the plastic crisis.
There is nothing in a solar panel that is worth recycling nor is it financially worth doing anything with them.
Therefore millions and millions of them are all going to end up in landfills around the world.
They really started to be introduced after 2000 and really took off after 2010. Mine were installed in 2015 so it wont be long before the problem kicks in.
There is only one factory in the UK, I think it said in Wakefield that can deal with them but that is not yet in operation and all they are doing is stockpiling the old panels. They are building another factory.
The biggest factory in the world is in France but like the UK one its not yet open and doing nothing.
According to the paperwork with mine it states that they should last for between 25 and 30 years, so a long way off.
Unless Governments around the world are prepared to heavily subsidise companies to come up with a way to deal with them the problem wont go away.
I still think they are great and they save me hundreds of pounds a year.
Something else for the younger generations to worry about.
Click to expand...

I think it's an element the newer solar film addresses as opposed to panels. It's more easily disposable, degradable or the least easier to recycle and reuse.

Like most things, it's the lack of forethought and planning - give me a Gov that forward plans.
 
wittonite said:
Further to your point Mike, Friday, Express and Daily Mail ran an article about supermarket fuel prices and the fact that oil prices have dropped and they are ripping people off ( con)🤣 and this was disputed. However toping up the car today Morrisons fuel price Sunday was £1.62 litre, today £1.52 litre. A whole 10p off. Corporate theft.
Click to expand...

Who the hell disputed it? It's common knowledge lol
 
Actually builds from other thread about JSO, but this is the right home I think. I wrote it there, and realised here was the better thread.

----

And to prove the point, this jury should be verbally shot the utter bunch of wet wipes. In fairness so should the judge, and quite frankly the CPS - where were the lawful instructions informing them that in law there was no option to find them not guilty, there is no way they didn't wilfully commit criminal damage and they offered absolutely no lawful defence for their actions.

They went with the intention, tooled and carried it out. You can argue whether a poster is criminal damage, paint (given clean up carries a real cost, as would paint to a person which is different) and so on. But causing physical, destructive damage, that they admitted?

Whether the repair bill was accurate (they weren't repaying it), whatever their motive, whatever their excuses - they are mitigation on sentence only - not guilt. Okay I wasn't expecting prison, we are talking 12-18 months suspended, but a Monopoly pass?

Nine climate protesters have been cleared by a jury of causing £500,000 worth of criminal damage to the windows at the headquarters of HSBC bank in London.
www.theguardian.com

Jury clears climate protesters of causing damage to HSBC London HQ

Nine women used hammers and chisels to shatter building’s windows in April 2021 as part of Extinction Rebellion protest
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

Cockwombles all of them. That defence lawyer must be putting money on the lottery now given how fucking lucky they were. That judge needs to be struck allowing that to happen.

Provocation in law has never been a defence other than self defence related, so how this was allowed to pass is beyond me. It'll embolden idiots further, it'll turn normal folks more against 'their cause (of being self important and getting their names in the press' and it'll push our Gov into being harsher on rightful free protest given the Nazi/1984 obsessed wankers they already are.

This is a complete failure on every level.
 
wittonite said:
Guess.
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I don't drive, but we have three close stations around here depending on which 3/4 directions you take. Two to my memory are the same company. All 3 differ by up to 10/15p usually. Ironically the closest to us is the most expensive in general (convenient close). The one on the main route is actually the cheapest owing to foot fall, the third middle of the road but further away and not on such a busy stretch.

I'll let you say con here PMSL So much is sadly.
 
wittonite said:
Good article from The Graun that lays bare the huge financial costs of net zero. The enthusiasm for it is waning all over the industrialized world.
www.theguardian.com

Climate fatigue isn't a sign that Europeans are in denial – it's a sign of their fear | Francesco Grillo

While Europe is battered by the climate crisis, governments must reassure voters that green costs will be fairly shared, says Francesco Grillo of the thinktank Vision
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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It bounces around a bit in terms of intention, but wraps pretty well I thought (sounds like most of my rants lol). Not a lot I can disagree with in that - it's what I've said (and many others inc you), people want the truth, real things they can do, that don't instantly cost the earth (no pun) but stuff they can do that is in their bracket - whilst acknowledging anything Europe does is a stop gap, and buying time for the likes of India, China, US and sadly Russia to really play catch up, which then buy the likes of Brazil and others to really catch up.

Again, the solution is joined up and we aren't in this country, let alone the world. New solar flannels/roof tiles are a thing, far more easily recyclable than panels (last longer with less degradation, and then components more easily reused) but guaranteed Gov funding for two such plants after roll out still haven't been released is what I last heard. Like the foils, they are also cheaper on installation.

Same as gigawat builds that the National Grid is still waiting for cash/manpower to connect to, so they are sitting their dormant, costing money as opposed to making and saving money.

Wouldn't be me if I didn't criticise something in the media and the Gruniad.

It's opinion not news, and it mentions McKinsey related to costs. Put those in the bin, if they say it costs £10 look for a second quote. If they say it costs £10 and only they can source it, look for five quotes. That isn't the cost, and it certainly doesn't account for the savings that would be made that more than ultimately covers OPEC related related issues, their bite back, and the new jobs and so on and definitely don't forget we find money when needed and kick the can down the road.

Enthusiasm isn't waning, knowing what to do is becoming tiresome.

Those are its two main downfalls for me. But again, other than that, if what is claimed happened in other Euro countries (thinking Italy in particular which wouldn't surprise me with a false mark up), I'm broadly in agreement and we've outlined a better way here ourselves during chats, which basically aligns with the thrust of that article.

This stuff really isn't that confusing if we can work it out lol
 
mike_field said:
I don't drive, but we have three close stations around here depending on which 3/4 directions you take. Two to my memory are the same company. All 3 differ by up to 10/15p usually. Ironically the closest to us is the most expensive in general (convenient close). The one on the main route is actually the cheapest owing to foot fall, the third middle of the road but further away and not on such a busy stretch.

I'll let you say con here PMSL So much is sadly.
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CON . Our local garage, the only one, is , not surprisingly the most expensive. The DEnext nearest is eleven miles away, Morrison, usually only a penny cheaper, no competition, but then the next nearest is Plymouth or Bodmin who will be about four pence cheaper because they have competion, but twenty plus miles away, so spend what you save getting there.
CON.
 
A slight tangent maybe, but this is where the free market does not work. Like many things we can talk about - something isn't suddenly more expensive based on a postcode unless it's artificial. Economies of scale effect it, but not as is across an individual company.
 
Cornwall council have today given planning permission for 208 acres of prime agricultural land, 33 fields to be covered with solar panels, despite massive objections from everybody except the farmer who will become an overnight millionaire. These fuckin things are a total eyesore that produce expensive energy.
 
I had an e mail from my energy supplier this week inviting me to go green. Add £10 a month to my bill. They keep on telling us that renewables are a cheaper way to produce our needs so how come we keep being asked to pay more?
I have a better idea lets keep on burning oil, gas and coal, its far more economical.
 
astonion2 said:
I had an e mail from my energy supplier this week inviting me to go green. Add £10 a month to my bill. They keep on telling us that renewables are a cheaper way to produce our needs so how come we keep being asked to pay more?
I have a better idea lets keep on burning oil, gas and coal, its far more economical.
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Another green con here mate. Consumers getting hammered again.
www.standard.co.uk

Families replacing gas boilers 'could be hit with £120 green levy'

Boiler firms say Government changes could force them to pass on higher charges to consumers
www.standard.co.uk www.standard.co.uk
 
Nothing to do with 'green' lads, it's companies taking the piss and hiding behind a fallacy when it comes to the boiler's.

On the other point, solar is cheaper, but until the Gov disassociate solar elec from gas prices, companies will again keep swimming in the cash and you all know where I stand on this topic, but I would never pay more for 'green energy' as it's public relations fraud in effect.

I also wouldn't get too upset about the new £16 quid price cap rise Ofgem are talking about as it pertains to 'those in debt'. That will become a trade off for the removal or significant reduction in standing charges that everyone pays.

Smoke and mirrors.
 
I noticed on the news last night they made a big thing reporting it was 30C in Southern Spain yesterday and said its July temperatures over there . So i rang my Mrs who is over there and she said no, it was 21c .
The BBC and their weather reporting should be taken with a pinch of salt , i know they have to keep pushing this global boiling agenda though
 
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