The Politics Thread | Page 448 | Vital Football

The Politics Thread

BodyButter said:
I guess Bozo's plan to send the UK back to the 1970s is on track then.

If his dishonesty and brinkmanship over the NI Protocol can coax the IRA out of retirement and back to blowing up pubs in Britain, he will have completed Brexit.
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Except it was a labour government then.
 
I know it's tough to take, but by increasing rates they take money out of peoples pockets, which stops them spending. In simple economic terms, they reduce demand so that the equilibrium price drops.

The fact spending isn't dropping already suggests many people do have money, which is what drives inflation.

It's a crude tool, but it can be effective. They have avoided it until now, because it will also slow the economy down.
 
The source of the inflation is a war though, not a hot economy. So rate rises will have a limited effect, at least, that's the thought process I have right now.
 
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Pangloss said:
The source of the inflation is a war though, not a hot economy. So rate rises will have a limited effect, at least, that's the thought process I have right now.
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It's demand exceeding supply, however it comes about. To start with, t was because we all had money saved from lockdowns and supply chains not being able to get back online. These supply chain issues still exist, and have been made worse by the war.

Brexit didn't help, adding thousands to every container of goods coming in.

If we had all stopped spending on anything except essentials, this move would not be required. We all know that's an impossibility.
 
also lack of interest rises will likely weaken the pound relatively which increases inflationary pressures.
reckon further rises aren't that much further down the road

(Erdogan seems to be running his own experiment on lack of rate rises to tackle inflation - he's got their inflation running at 60%+ atm)
 
HeathfieldRoad1874 said:
It's demand exceeding supply, however it comes about. To start with, t was because we all had money saved from lockdowns and supply chains not being able to get back online. These supply chain issues still exist, and have been made worse by the war.

Brexit didn't help, adding thousands to every container of goods coming in.

If we had all stopped spending on anything except essentials, this move would not be required. We all know that's an impossibility.
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I don't totally agree with this to be honest. It's cost-push inflation we're seeing which has precipitated a built-in (i.e. workers asking for wage rises in response) where as I feel your post is diagnosing a sort of demand-pull inflation.

With cost-push inflation rate rises can be harmful although that said the solutions are not really straight forward, more supply side stuff etc.

I've long said rates have been left too low over the decade but quite queasy about very sharp rises that we're seeing today and likely on the horizon.
 
Demand outstrips supply, because all supply chains are diminished. There was a shirt surge of excess demand, when we came out of lockdown, but I doubt that it's high now, compared to 2019.

We can't fix the supply side, so the only option left is t try and fix the demand side.
 
HeathfieldRoad1874 said:
We can't fix the supply side, so the only option left is t try and fix the demand side.
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Speaking of which, the price of car hire has soared off into the stratosphere because of huge supply difficulties.
There was a story in the Irish section of "The Times" yesterday about a young woman returning with her family from Australia to spend three weeks at home. The cost of renting a car was coming out at over €6k! So her dad bought a second-hand Hyundai i40 for €9,000 which they can use whilst here. He was planning to buy a car later in the year but just brought the purchase forward and will sell his current vehicle when they return to Oz.
 
BBJ said:
Speaking of which, the price of car hire has soared off into the stratosphere because of huge supply difficulties.
There was a story in the Irish section of "The Times" yesterday about a young woman returning with her family from Australia to spend three weeks at home. The cost of renting a car was coming out at over €6k! So her dad bought a second-hand Hyundai i40 for €9,000 which they can use whilst here. He was planning to buy a car later in the year but just brought the purchase forward and will sell his current vehicle when they return to Oz.
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Because of the processor shortage, car producers have cut back. They just can't get the chips. A lot of people do what you suggest when they visit Australia for extended periods. It makes a lot of sense.
 
Claret & Blue Blood said:
The whole immigration/asylum issue is worrying to me. The reasons given for leaving their home countries and seeking asylum somewhere else is due to being in danger or subject to persecution. The Oxford English dictionary provides the definition as "the protection granted by a state to someone who has left their home country as a political refugee."
So why do significant numbers having found sanctuary and safety in EU countries such as Spain, France, Italy, Greece etc. then put themselves at risk in crossing the continent and even greater risk in crossing the Channel in dinghies to get to the UK. Surely, their human rights issues are addressed when they arrive on European soil? But perhaps the EU countries mentioned are not as 'benevolent' as the UK and that might be an issue that the ECHR should look into? After all Human Rights should have a consistent meaning for all people in all countries? Make living in other EU states as good as the UK and the problem will diminish and people will not be exploited by traffickers and their lives put at risk.
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You'd still have those that were entitled to say the UK would be the best fit based on language/culture and other family ties - but yes, ensuring 'a standard' was reached across the board would also significantly improve things wouldn't it.
 
wittonite said:
You are splitting hairs there Mike, 90%-100%, in the grand scheme of things there's no difference really.
I get that people are unhappy with their lot where they are born but if you are saying that anyone can come and claim asylum without restrictions that's an aweful lot of people that we would have to accommodate. According to the government's own figures the numbers coming are going up and the returns are down year on year. France has more than twice the land mass of England with roughly the same population, yet we are supposed to do their immigration job for them, sorting out illegal immigration.
The current treaties and international accords were written for a time long gone, and need modernising.
European countries cannot be expected to take in all the people that want to come, without social strife ensuing. Government link below if you have a spare day to trawl through them .
www.gov.uk
https://www.gov.uk › statistics › h...
How many people are detained or returned? - GOV.UK
About the statistics — 12,967 people entered detention in year ending March 2021, 44% fewer than the
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No mate, not at all saying without restriction and not at all arguing it should be open borders - I'm arguing we should do our jobs properly here in quickly assessing and helping those entitled to stay, whilst more quickly returning those not entitled to stay, instead of just letting MP's use a lazy press to push an agenda, instead of actually fixing things.

As I said elsewhere, subject to our own human rights issues with Rwanda, I have no issue having a deal with them to give non entitled in the UK a second chance to find safety - I just heavily object to them being shipped off before we have even assessed them.

And painting it as a deterrent is just a lie.
 
wittonite said:
That being the case kef, why do French politicians and government figures keep telling us that the Channel situation is purely down to our overly generous benefits system.
I believe in France at the end of one year you are on your own, must find your own accomodation and a job. Will see if I can find a link.
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Because MP's are MP's the world over.
 
Jesus Christ, does this prick realise most people can't see a GP at the moment and even ignoring that, fuck me what an example to make you stand out, especially as Boris is the first PM in history to get a criminal record.

The Conservative candidate in the Wakefield by-election has said voters should still trust the Tory party after the jailing of disgraced former MP Imran Ahmad Khan.
Khan stood down as MP after being convicted of sexually assaulting a 15-year-old boy and jailed for 18 months.
Nadeem Ahmed told the Telegraph Khan was "one bad apple".
"We still trust GPs after Harold Shipman killed hundreds of people," he said.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-61832195
 
wittonite said:
That being the case kef, why do French politicians and government figures keep telling us that the Channel situation is purely down to our overly generous benefits system.
I believe in France at the end of one year you are on your own, must find your own accomodation and a job. Will see if I can find a link.
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If the government genuinely wanted to solve the problem they would set up an assessment centre in Calais. Once cleared they could come here.

Also going on the system as it is, if they allowed them to work from when they got here they would be contributing to the economy. Other countries allow the refugees to work straightaway.

Rwanda is immoral, unethical and even if they are cleared for asylum they aren't flown back here. Its a one way ticket.

The end of the day the Tories shut down all the safe routes for refugees leaving them with no option to get here than by sea
 
kefkat said:
If the government genuinely wanted to solve the problem they would set up an assessment centre in Calais. Once cleared they could come here.

Also going on the system as it is, if they allowed them to work from when they got here they would be contributing to the economy. Other countries allow the refugees to work straightaway.

Rwanda is immoral, unethical and even if they are cleared for asylum they aren't flown back here. Its a one way ticket.

The end of the day the Tories shut down all the safe routes for refugees leaving them with no option to get here than by sea
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The safe routes aren't closed.
There is The Family Reunion Scheme.
The Resettlement Scheme
The Humanitarian Visas Scheme.
Setting up assessment centres in Calais would only draw an endless throng of illegal immigrants into France to try their luck.
What was Labours safe routes into the country ?
I checked French benefits yesterday. Asylum seekers granted asylum are given accomodation once their claim is proved. The Prefecture will send them anywhere in France. They get one offer only, they get five days to accept, and if they don't they are deemed to have made themselves homeless.
If they leave the accomodation for five days they are removed and get no alternative.
At the end of one year they must be in a job, and move out of asylum accomodation and pay their way in French society.
Thereafter they must qualify for any further assistance in the same way a French citizen would have to qualify.
It's a massive problem that will only get worse with time, and there are no easy solutions as government's of westernized countries around the world are finding out.
You will never ,"solve" this problem.
 
wittonite said:
The safe routes aren't closed.
There is The Family Reunion Scheme.
The Resettlement Scheme
The Humanitarian Visas Scheme.
Setting up assessment centres in Calais would only draw an endless throng of illegal immigrants into France to try their luck.
What was Labours safe routes into the country ?
I checked French benefits yesterday. Asylum seekers granted asylum are given accomodation once their claim is proved. The Prefecture will send them anywhere in France. They get one offer only, they get five days to accept, and if they don't they are deemed to have made themselves homeless.
If they leave the accomodation for five days they are removed and get no alternative.
At the end of one year they must be in a job, and move out of asylum accomodation and pay their way in French society.
Thereafter they must qualify for any further assistance in the same way a French citizen would have to qualify.
It's a massive problem that will only get worse with time, and there are no easy solutions as government's of westernized countries around the world are finding out.
You will never ,"solve" this problem.
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The problem with the schemes your talking about is the refugees are fleeing their situation and they don't know about them nor are told about them.

Nor do they have the time to sort it when you are fleeing, even if you did happen to know about it.

You can only claim asylum in this country and the sea is now the only way to get here to claim it
 
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