Aston Villa v Wolves Match Thread - Sat 6 March @ 5.30pm - Sky

[wittonite]

I didn't spot it either mate just picked up on the comment. Sometimes there is no point in our wingers as they are very hit and miss, quite feeble and easy to shut out of a game, No harm now and again playing a 4312 with some solid midfielders and not wingers. we have 2 fullbacks who cross the ball in fact target has put in more crosses from open play then either winger

Shows how much we miss Cashy with his huge energy getting right to the opposition box before crossing, as opposed to Elmo, who is hitting his crosses from deep, and they are more easily defended.

 

[Villan57]

I know its blindingly obvious, but in a lot of our recent games Ollie is out wide left cutting in, or crossing for others.
He scores his goals in and around the six yard box.
Cant blame the Jack factor on the lack of supply either because the last half a dozen games Jack played he was very heavily marked and fairly ineffectual.
Even in those game when Jack was playing he was hitting Ollie with wide left balls played from the middle of our half of the pitch, that find Ollie isolated and having to hold up.
Badly need someone wide to free Ollie up to get into those positions between the opposition central defenders where he is most dangerous, when arriving late into the box he is difficult to mark.
Others have made the point we havent, in our recent games got sufficient bodies in the box, and to a certain extent its a numbers game in there, if you have got the numbers the knockdowns, goalkeeper errors, defensive errors have statistically a bigger chance of finding one of our players.
As it is we usually have two at most, fruequently a defender.
Dont fancy us at Newcastle if we cant come up with a different approach on Friday.

Watkins naturally runs that left channel, that's why he reminds me of Marcus Rashford, who always played CF for United but ended up running the left channel.
That's why I don't see him as a CF. I watched the second half again not long ago and even before Davis came on Ollie was running the left channel mainly because he's getting nowhere against 3 CB's, which is what I said would happen before a ball was kicked

 

[Villan57]

Shows how much we miss Cashy with his huge energy getting right to the opposition box before crossing, as opposed to Elmo, who is hitting his crosses from deep, and they are more easily defended.

I've not really noticed Cash as an attacking force, defensively he's been great can't recall him crossing that many good balls

just checked 48 crosses 2 assists of which one was a crossfield hack against Liverpool

 

[wittonite]

Watkins naturally runs that left channel, that's why he reminds me of Marcus Rashford, who always played CF for United but ended up running the left channel.
That's why I don't see him as a CF. I watched the second half again not long ago and even before Davis came on Ollie was running the left channel mainly because he's getting nowhere against 3 CB's, which is what I said would happen before a ball was kicked

Yes you did, and yes he does, but regardless his goals come from close in.
Agree he is always looking to cut in and curl the rightfooter to the far post, and he does it well, but the actual goals come from when he is arriving in the six yard box, or thereabouts.

 

[sirdennis]

It's interesting about Ollie. Andy Gray in his brilliant interview about his time at Villa (I put it in Memory Lane) says in his view Ollie spends to much time outside the box and should concentrate his efforts more in and around it. His work rate in phenomenal and maybe that takes him to areas he doesn't need to be.

It doesn't take away that he has been a top player for us this season. He hasn't had much help lately for sure.

 

[Wicked Messenger]

Yes you did, and yes he does, but regardless his goals come from close in.
Agree he is always looking to cut in and curl the rightfooter to the far post, and he does it well, but the actual goals come from when he is arriving in the six yard box, or thereabouts.

We basically need two of him. One to cross and cut in from wide and another to be in the right place at the right time in the middle but he can’t be both. The service has stopped and so have the goals. I mean his first attempt that hit the crossbar wasn’t even what you would call a chance.

 

[Villan57]

Yes you did, and yes he does, but regardless his goals come from close in.
Agree he is always looking to cut in and curl the rightfooter to the far post, and he does it well, but the actual goals come from when he is arriving in the six yard box, or thereabouts.

Funny how people rave about Tammy but I watched all his goals for us on a video a few weeks ago and the penalty spot was the furthest he score from most were well in the six-yard box. Ollie is a better allrounder than Tammy , which could eventually work against him. ie being versatile leads to being left out for a specialist

 

[Langoe66]

We can all see the positive things but if we focus on those and ignore the negatives we won't progress. I also understand in this world we live in general we are being trained to think of positives. I'm not talking just football, my mind has spent its life accepting the good as a norm and making sure it gets even better. Continuous improvement.

I get we beat Liverpool 7-2 in the greatest league game never seen at Villa Park but we've more recently lost to the bottom of the league Sheffield Utd

Football to me is the same ie I'm happy we are now a PL club again. I'm happy we are higher up the league but I also feel we could be higher and that will never change until we win the league. I think that makes me pretty darn positive and not content with midtable mediocrity.

I was happy with a point yesterday in the end, that lasted all of 30 seconds and then my head went into how can we improve mode .

Don’t disagree with any of that 57 but my original comment related to sarcastic post aimed at those who are shall we say, less critical. I’m more optimistic than most, granted, and I‘m sure it winds you and others up no end but it’s just the way I am. Saying that, I don’t think you can accuse me and most of those on the forum who tend to less critical of ‘ignoring’ the negatives. I suppose it’s just that some prefer to focus more on the here and now, what went wrong rather than right and how we can improve further whereas some prefer to reflect more readily on what they perceive to be the positives and progress currently being made.....nothing wrong with either, everyone analyzes where we’re at in their own way...and then of course there are some that just seem to criticise all the time!

 

[wittonite]

We basically need two of him. One to cross and cut in from wide and another to be in the right place at the right time in the middle but he can’t be both. The service has stopped and so have the goals. I mean his first attempt that hit the crossbar wasn’t even what you would call a chance.

No it wasnt a chance, but that is where he frequently finds himself, and as you say crossing for himself to get on the end of, if it were possible.
Something to think on for the close season.

 

[Pangloss]

It's interesting about Ollie. Andy Gray in his brilliant interview about his time at Villa (I put it in Memory Lane) says in his view Ollie spends to much time outside the box and should concentrate his efforts more in and around it. His work rate in phenomenal and maybe that takes him to areas he doesn't need to be.

It doesn't take away that he has been a top player for us this season. He hasn't had much help lately for sure.

You have to think that if he had much better service from out wide and central areas he'll spend more time in the box. Currently there's no one to put a good ball in from out wide or a good through ball from behind.

 

[wittonite]

It's interesting about Ollie. Andy Gray in his brilliant interview about his time at Villa (I put it in Memory Lane) says in his view Ollie spends to much time outside the box and should concentrate his efforts more in and around it. His work rate in phenomenal and maybe that takes him to areas he doesn't need to be.

It doesn't take away that he has been a top player for us this season. He hasn't had much help lately for sure.

He will prove to be a very cheap buy at £28m if we can just get the rest of the team set up correct around him.
As you say huge work rate, if only we could get him the service Jimmy Greaves used to get, he would score twenty a season without breaking sweat.

 

[McParlandTheGreat]

Shows how much we miss Cashy with his huge energy getting right to the opposition box before crossing, as opposed to Elmo, who is hitting his crosses from deep, and they are more easily defended.

Dead right. The problem yesterday was that we weren't carrying the ball to near the the opposition box or getting crosses in from near the byline. Credit to Ollie that he got in that shot which hit the bar.

With Jack and Cash back we're a different proposition. More menace on both sides of the pitch.

 

[Pangloss]

I really think this 'Watkins is not a striker' is an absolute load of bollocks as well. He has scored at a good rate this season in a team that isn't giving him enough service. He has hit the wood work 7 times as well so with more luck would be on 17 league goals this season. The lad is definitely a striker. We do not need to spend big money on a striker in the summer. We need to spend money focusing on improving the supply into the box.

 

[Villan57]

Don’t disagree with any of that 57 but my original comment related to sarcastic post aimed at those who are shall we say, less critical. I’m more optimistic than most, granted, and I‘m sure it winds you and others up no end but it’s just the way I am. Saying that, I don’t think you can accuse me and most of those on the forum who tend to less critical of ‘ignoring’ the negatives. I suppose it’s just that some prefer to focus more on the here and now, what went wrong rather than right and how we can improve further whereas some prefer to reflect more readily on what they perceive to be the positives and progress currently being made.....nothing wrong with either, everyone analyzes where we’re at in their own way...and then of course there are some that just seem to criticise all the time!

Reminds me of when I had a job on production at CAT transmissions one part of it was fitting a 4in "O" into the gear change 700 times a week I missed 4 one week and was called in to see the manager to explain why. I just said that was a pretty good strike rate! That didn't wash, he said how can we make sure you don't miss anymore, fucked if I know said I. On my way out he said by the way the last bloke used to miss 10 a shift, well done

 

[sirdennis]

I really think this 'Watkins is not a striker' is an absolute load of bollocks as well. He has scored at a good rate this season in a team that isn't giving him enough service. He has hit the wood work 7 times as well so with more luck would be on 17 league goals this season. The lad is definitely a striker. We do not need to spend big money on a striker in the summer. We need to spend money focusing on improving the supply into the box.

Cant forget the dodgy offsides either.

 

[wittonite]

I've not really noticed Cash as an attacking force, defensively he's been great can't recall him crossing that many good balls

just checked 48 crosses 2 assists of which one was a crossfield hack against Liverpool

You could argue that if we had Ollie in the six yard box, on the end of those crosses, or more presence in the box in general that figure of 2 would be greater,
but we are back to the " if shit was pudding" scenario.

 

[wittonite]

Reminds me of when I had a job on production at CAT transmissions one part of it was fitting a 4in "O" into the gear change 700 times a week I missed 4 one week and was called in to see the manager to explain why. I just said that was a pretty good strike rate! That didn't wash, he said how can we make sure you don't miss anymore, fucked if I know said I. On my way out he said by the way the last bloke used to miss 10 a shift, well done

Think I might have bought that car.

 

[Divine_islet]

I don’t think he has looked comfortable on the ball last few games. In fact I think he has been generally crap. Not holding onto the ball when we need, first touch poor and getting bullied and spending alot of the time bouncing off a defender and falling over.

Completely agree. He is not a CF at all. Does not have the height nor body type nor adequate ability to be that. What makes it worse is that he is almost always surrounded by 2 defenders and either loses possession of the ball due to a bad touch or gets pushed off the ball. Still a million times better than Wasteley.

 

[Divine_islet]

I must do better obviously...I'm clearly far too supportive.... but to say all I do ( and presumably others who dare to be a bit more positive)) is 'look at the table' is factually incorrect.

Is that not what you and the others like you keep harping on about everytime a criticism is made of the team or Dean?

 

[danvilla2]

For me, Watkins is a different striker than the one he is being forced to be due to the regression of our play.

I’d describe Ollie as more of a forward than a striker. He needs players in the other more forward positions playing closer to him and a central player running off him at times.

He’s become a bit of a combination of a target man, in the channel runner, in behind the defence, number 10 and every other combination of forward you can describe due to how isolated we leave him.

I think Ollie has great attributes, I’m a big fan particularly of his other qualities. Ironically, his biggest development are some his technical skills, he’s could work on his dribbling a bit as well as his touch sometimes.

I’d like to see a Tammy or Toney brought in to give us options, and allow Ollie to play at times in a different forward role, but that would mean Smith changing the tactics a little and we all know that isn’t going to happen.

Relying on Ollie as our only striker is all well and good until his form drops off, or he gets injured.