EU strategy to destroy the Chequers ‘agreement’...

[Tarian]

You think wrong. I am not missing the point.

Having different internal and external standards will increase the amount of bureaucracy in the UK and the the EU. Your example will also result in increased manufacturing costs to support different standards.

One of the prices of being free to diverge from the EU (or ‘independence’ - as you call it) is that there will be additional bureaucracy.

Sorry, but you are missing the point...
.... and misunderstanding manufacturers.

If the UK Govt allows different product standards for goods sold in the UK, where is the "extra bureaucracy" ?
UK Regs only have to add a line about permitting stuff "in conformity with EU standards"

Why is there an impact on EU bureaucracy if the UK permitted some extra stuff - for domestic consumption - to a different Standard ?
UK exporters to the EU still have to comply with existing EU Regs - so no change.

Why would a manufacturer experience "increased costs" - unless the UK introduced a new, UK only Regulation ?
(My assumption was based on new Regs being more permissive, not restrictive.)

And supposing there was one product (maybe an unsafe Chinese variant that somehow slipped through existing UK and EU Regs), public opinion might think any "cost" was worth it.

The greater the divergence, the higher the price.

This seems close to WK's argument ... the logical conclusion being that there should be just one model of everything.

Manufacturers already make variants - for different price points - or for different consumer preferences - or for different jurisdictions.
They choose.

Look at the next lawn mower you buy.
The Handbook may well have sections for different jurisdictions.
My Honda engine appears to require different safety stickers for each of the USA, Canada, EU and "Others".
Maybe there is one part more or less. I don't know.

But Honda will make whatever variants it chooses (while being compliant).

 

[Tarian]

“Cabinet office minister Michael Gove endorsed the 50,000 industry estimate in parliament in February and told MPs last month that the government was in discussions about creating a new customs agent academy while working with industry “to ensure that they have the capacity required”. Don’t you believe the brexiteer in chief either ? I hardly think Gove would have endorsed this ‘project fear’ number in parliament if he didn’t think it had a basis in fact.

Again - a Brexit-critical report, quoting selectively - not an original and complete source.
IIRC, Gove acknowledged that more Customs Agents could be trained - while not saying anything about "50,000".

According to a report quoting BIFA (British International Freight Assoc.)
>>
BIFA, which accounts for most relevant training courses in the UK, added that with the lack of information, it was impossible to predict the future requirements.

“The reference to a need to train another 50,000 customs agents, has become the ‘accepted truth’, but how that figure has been calculated is a mystery.
<<
Perhaps BIFA should ask the RHA about its assumptions.

 

[Tarian]

As the FT pointed out a couple of years ago, economies tend to be aligned with one set of standards or another. In reality there are really only two sets of standards that are used; EU standards or US standards.

The FT - an EU fan.

"there are two sets of standards" . Really ?

Sovereign countries are free to set their own Standards.
But they are constrained by practical considerations - and that the WTO discourages "Standards" designed as a Non-Tariff Barrier.
(e.g. very detailed specifications matching a domestic producer.)

The vast majority of "Standards" emerge from international Trade Bodies - of which there are over a hundred.
The UK can now resume its seat on those where the EU speaks for all its members. So the UK has "influence" again.

What has been apparent from the start was that we were seeking to move from one to the other..

"Apparent" ? To whom ?
Anti-Brexit commentators ?

In that case we would make it much more difficult, as you’ve pointed out, for firms to compete in the EU Market with only little prospect of replacing lost trade in the US.

I haven't "pointed out" any such thing (and I don't believe any other Leaver on here has)

Every trade deal done by the US has been heavily skewed in favour of US business.

Evidence ? (....or another opinion from the Guardian)

With Russian money in the Tory party and Trump’s Russian connections, the whole edifice deserves a proper investigation.

Evidence ?
You do know that all donations to Political Parties over £500 have to be reported - and that it is illegal to accept donations from foreign sources ?
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/latest-uk-political-party-donations-and-loans

"Trump’s Russian connections" have been shown to be bogus.
Any "connection" is about as valid as the fact that when you visited that holiday resort in Cyprus, Russians were at the table next to you and football was discussed !

 

[Tarian]

Insulin is not the only critical drug but if what Waldo quoted about certification is correct, it may well be that EU citizens will experience severe delays in receiving some prescriptions of UK origin while that bureaucratic process is being dragged through 27 states.

He said nothing about such certification being required by the UK and, if it was, it would be much quicker as it only needs one government's approval so the insulin delay would be relatively short and solved by sensible stockpiling.

"Medicine shortages"
EU fans never explain which UK Minister or Official would block incoming Insulin - and "why" ?

 

[shotshy]

The FT - an EU fan.

"there are two sets of standards" . Really ?

Sovereign countries are free to set their own Standards.
But they are constrained by practical considerations - and that the WTO discourages "Standards" designed as a Non-Tariff Barrier.
(e.g. very detailed specifications matching a domestic producer.)

The vast majority of "Standards" emerge from international Trade Bodies - of which there are over a hundred.
The UK can now resume its seat on those where the EU speaks for all its members. So the UK has "influence" again.


"Apparent" ? To whom ?
Anti-Brexit commentators ?

I haven't "pointed out" any such thing (and I don't believe any other Leaver on here has)


Evidence ? (....or another opinion from the Guardian)


Evidence ?
You do know that all donations to Political Parties over £500 have to be reported - and that it is illegal to accept donations from foreign sources ?
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/latest-uk-political-party-donations-and-loans

"Trump’s Russian connections" have been shown to be bogus.
Any "connection" is about as valid as the fact that when you visited that holiday resort in Cyprus, Russians were at the table next to you and football was discussed !

Wow, that’s a long reply to something most just chuckled at

 

[markinkent]

Surely a "weak pound" means that an EU migrant with a bit of cash could buy more to start with ?

Please refrain from abusing an individual - and other Brexiteers.
What is "nasty" about Farage ? or "Farage style" ?
(And please, original sources. Not Guardian-style mis-reporting)

Some migrants will make a success of their new opportunities and rise through tax bands and end up paying more. Some will end up owning businesses, generating jobs etc.

The weak pound comment was aimed at migrants who send money home.

Farage has deliberately used inciteful language in his various campaigns. Its why he is so decisive.
To some he's a "great British bloke" to others "he's a nasty, right wing, chancer" in MY opinion if that makes it better.

 

[Tarian]

Replying to my own post. Is that sad ?

Immigration - the supposed "net benefit" ?

So while the visible tax take outweighs cash benefits, what are the other costs ?
House prices (much) higher then they should be - affecting the poorest.
The cost of more classrooms, clinics, trains, roads, utilities etc.

"What are the other costs ?"

How about increased costs of Covid-19 - from high density populations having a higher infection rate ?

 

[shotshy]

Some migrants will make a success of their new opportunities and rise through tax bands and end up paying more. Some will end up owning businesses, generating jobs etc.

The weak pound comment was aimed at migrants who send money home.

Farage has deliberately used inciteful language in his various campaigns. Its why he is so decisive.
To some he's a "great British bloke" to others "he's a nasty, right wing, chancer" in MY opinion if that makes it better.

Don’t get sucked in to debating with him mark.
Basically, there are two differing types of eu migrants.
Those who came to settle and those who came just to work.
A tad over 3 million have settled and most are grateful to them for their contribution.
The more transient come and go as it suits.
By controlling immigration, the country can decide its own needs.
The point of the whole thing was about who controls it.
My opinion is that I’d like that to be our own government.
Others differ and are happy for an outside force to decide.
What needs baring in mind is that this nation never signed up to the Eu. and it’s policies.

 

[Tarian]

Some migrants will make a success of their new opportunities and rise through tax bands and end up paying more. Some will end up owning businesses, generating jobs etc..

"Some" may.
My road is full of well off Indians with personalised number plates.

Meanwhile most of those 1 million field and shop workers on minimum wage are still living somewhere, sending kids to school, visiting the GP, using transport.
[Before the SJWs start - I always assume that the majority are hard-working, law-abiding decent people. Got it ?]

The weak pound comment was aimed at migrants who send money home..

I guessed that
Now I can ask....
How is sending money "home" a "net benefit" to the UK economy ?

Farage has deliberately used inciteful language in his various campaigns. Its why he is so decisive.
To some he's a "great British bloke" to others "he's a nasty, right wing, chancer" in MY opinion if that makes it better.

Again - an assertion.
Please give an example of language from Farage that is "inciteful" .

Oh. I know... You meant "insightful".

And yes, definitely "decisive" - compared to T May & Co.

I still think "nasty" requires a reason.
And a) define "right wing" and b) "so what ?"

 

[Wayne.Kerr]

The Government announced today that it will be hiring 50,000 additional customs officers - stick that in your pipe and smoke it. The light touch will simply be because numbers of officers will not be up to speed by January 2021.

 

[Wayne.Kerr]

Please give an example of language from Farage that is "inciteful"

Fucking UKIP posters

 

[Wayne.Kerr]

So what? So what my arse! Farridge is a nasty right wing bastard - maybe a bit of a lefty to you.

 

[valenciagill]

So what? So what my arse! Farridge is a nasty right wing bastard - maybe a bit of a lefty to you.

Our Nigel has been the most influential figure in UK politics for the last 20 years

 

[shotshy]

Fucking UKIP posters

I notice that you have not addressed your extension prediction.
What went wrong there?

 

[shotshy]

The Government announced today that it will be hiring 50,000 additional customs officers - stick that in your pipe and smoke it. The light touch will simply be because numbers of officers will not be up to speed by January 2021.

More WK made up crap.
#embarrassing

 

[valenciagill]

I notice that you have not addressed your extension prediction.
What went wrong there?

He will either respond and/or make a fresh prediction , he rarely disappoints

 

[markinkent]

Our Nigel has been the most influential figure in UK politics for the last 20 years

That he has. No one can argue with that..............well I say no one ;-)

 

[Tarian]

Fucking UKIP posters

Which UKIP poster - or posters?
Please post it/them on here so we can all see it/them.

 

[Tarian]

So what? So what my arse! Farridge is a nasty right wing bastard - maybe a bit of a lefty to you.

Again.
Define "right wing" .... and more relevant to your lazy abuse, why "nasty bastard" ?

 

[markinkent]

"Some" may.
My road is full of well off Indians with personalised number plates.

Meanwhile most of those 1 million field and shop workers on minimum wage are still living somewhere, sending kids to school, visiting the GP, using transport.
[Before the SJWs start - I always assume that the majority are hard-working, law-abiding decent people. Got it ?]
"

They are called key workers now - you need to give them a clap.

I wouldn't knock a field or shop worker. They kept working while many of us stayed at home. Kept the shelves stocked with food.

Good to hear about the well off Indians - kind of proves the point I am making.

I am also glad the kids are going to school. some of the them may become the next generation of doctors, engineers and entrepreneurs that this country needs.

Its called investing in our countries future.