Another one bites the dust! (pt III) | Page 3 | Vital Football

Another one bites the dust! (pt III)

ZAKKY said:
Gerhart Struber new Barnsley manager an Austrian on 2 year deal
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Just had a look at his stats he's not managed many senior games over his career but his record for what he has done is good. Apparently plays high pressing with a midfield diamond and 2 up front so expect it to be quite attacking.

Bit of a gamble so could be a Joyce or a Wagner. We can't afford them to start to improve we are already struggling to find 3 worse than us.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
Just had a look at his stats he's not managed many senior games over his career but his record for what he has done is good. Apparently plays high pressing with a midfield diamond and 2 up front so expect it to be quite attacking.

Bit of a gamble so could be a Joyce or a Wagner. We can't afford them to start to improve we are already struggling to find 3 worse than us.
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Isn't the kind of setup and approach that Nathan Jones utilises? It doesn't work if you haven't got the players for it like any system.
 
The problem at Spurs was that Pochetino has been saying for the last couple of years that what they'd done was great but that they mustn't stand still.
It seems Levy has thought that they're doing really well so no need to chuck more money at the squad (on top of the cost of the stadium & renting Wembley) hence why they went 18 months without signing anyone
Pochetino's fears have been realised as that squad has now reached its peak, players want to move on to pastures new, team morale has dropped & results have fallen away which were masked by a couple of freakish performances in the Champions League that got them to the final
Pochetino's morale has also plummeted (much like Bruce's did after Whelan's fire sale in that January transfer window) which is then mirrored in the squad & it becomes a vicious circile
His comments about just being a Head Coach were obviously indicative of the fact he feels his views & wishes on the direction in which to take the club & squad were being ignored & his relationship with Levy deteriorated to the extent he was itching to get rid of him

The irony is that Levy may now have to give Mourinho some of the funds that Pochetino was asking for & not being given. But again, we've seen with Whelan when the likes of Bullard, Roberts & co went to see him for a pay rise at the end of the first prem season they were told where to go & shipped out & then Whelan went out & gave the likes of Heskey more money than Bullard & co were asking for
 
Mighty Bongsmon said:
The problem at Spurs was that Pochetino has been saying for the last couple of years that what they'd done was great but that they mustn't stand still.
It seems Levy has thought that they're doing really well so no need to chuck more money at the squad (on top of the cost of the stadium & renting Wembley) hence why they went 18 months without signing anyone
Pochetino's fears have been realised as that squad has now reached its peak, players want to move on to pastures new, team morale has dropped & results have fallen away which were masked by a couple of freakish performances in the Champions League that got them to the final
Pochetino's morale has also plummeted (much like Bruce's did after Whelan's fire sale in that January transfer window) which is then mirrored in the squad & it becomes a vicious circile
His comments about just being a Head Coach were obviously indicative of the fact he feels his views & wishes on the direction in which to take the club & squad were being ignored & his relationship with Levy deteriorated to the extent he was itching to get rid of him

The irony is that Levy may now have to give Mourinho some of the funds that Pochetino was asking for & not being given. But again, we've seen with Whelan when the likes of Bullard, Roberts & co went to see him for a pay rise at the end of the first prem season they were told where to go & shipped out & then Whelan went out & gave the likes of Heskey more money than Bullard & co were asking for
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I was thinking the same - sometimes it's false economy to not give your existing players a pay rise as replacing them ends up much more expensive in the long run. Spurs are very sensibly run financially but i think they've gone too far in some ways over the last few years and exactly like Bongsman said it's what happened to us.
 
The_Pon said:
Unai Emery sacked from Arsenal...

Can't see them taking Paul off our hands though...
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Wonder if they saw the chance to get Pochetino in and thought they had to go for it.

If i was Pochetino i'd consider just having a couple of months break recharge my batteries for a few months and see what comes up after that. The United, Bayern, Madrid or Barca jobs could come up soon and i imagine all of them would fancy him.
 
I cant see Poch going to Arsenal, he's previously said he'd never coach a rival team (i.e. wouldnt coach Barca because he was at Espanyol) and lets be honest, he can do better. But if Arsenal do make an approach for him ... fair do's to the ambition. If you dont ask you dont get and all that.

Freddie Ljungbergs got the job for now, but only time will tell if he'll be a Lampard or a Solskjaer. One possible name mentioned which I think would be an excellent choice for them is Carlo Ancelotti, currently in charge of a team (Napoli) where the players are in some sort of civil war with the chairman. He's got a good record in the Prem and i'd say unfinished business, and that coupled with the chance to escape the madness at Napoli means he might well be up for it.
 
Scharnerarma said:
I cant see Poch going to Arsenal, he's previously said he'd never coach a rival team (i.e. wouldnt coach Barca because he was at Espanyol) and lets be honest, he can do better. But if Arsenal do make an approach for him ... fair do's to the ambition. If you dont ask you dont get and all that.

Freddie Ljungbergs got the job for now, but only time will tell if he'll be a Lampard or a Solskjaer. One possible name mentioned which I think would be an excellent choice for them is Carlo Ancelotti, currently in charge of a team (Napoli) where the players are in some sort of civil war with the chairman. He's got a good record in the Prem and i'd say unfinished business, and that coupled with the chance to escape the madness at Napoli means he might well be up for it.
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I think Ancelotti would be a good hire for anyone. If i was Spurs i'd have looked at Ancelotti before i looked at Murinho!

Apparently the 4 man shortlist is him, Allegri, Santo from Wolves and Arteta. Arteta for his first job sounds a risky one, as you say i think everyone saw Lampard do well and thinks 'maybe if we give a former player a chance' but i suspect Franks year at Derby made the world of difference and i wouldn't fancy many players to do well in their first job as a top 8 Prem manager.
 
If I was Arsenal I wouldn't be in a great rush to appoint someone quickly. They're in a strong position in that their season is already pretty much a write off from a league perspective, so no need to keep continuity for maintaining a title challenge, but they have zero chance of relegation, so they can take their time.

I always liked Ljungberg as a player... Of course that's no guarantee that he'll be a good manager, but he does know the club and the fans and what their expectations are, so that's a plus right from the off. He could turn out to be excellent. Wouldn't be surprised to see them give him until Christmas to see how things go unless a proven top manager is available and willing to go there right away.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
I think Ancelotti would be a good hire for anyone. If i was Spurs i'd have looked at Ancelotti before i looked at Murinho!

Apparently the 4 man shortlist is him, Allegri, Santo from Wolves and Arteta. Arteta for his first job sounds a risky one, as you say i think everyone saw Lampard do well and thinks 'maybe if we give a former player a chance' but i suspect Franks year at Derby made the world of difference and i wouldn't fancy many players to do well in their first job as a top 8 Prem manager.
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Same here actually. If Ancelotti doesn't go to Arsenal, I could see him end up at Man Utd if Solskjaer ends up getting the boot.

Think you're right about Arteta and the whole clubs giving former players a go at managing, and its sort of nice to see in a way. I think Arteta is lined up to be Peps replacement at Man City, and if thats the case, id stick around another year or two if I were him rather than risking it at Arsenal. In terms of former players joining the club but with actual experience (not just u23s or assistant etc), Patrick Viera seems to be doing alright for himself and could be worth a chance? No prem exp as a manager, but hes been schooled at Man City, coached in the MLS and the French Ligue, and he knows the Prem from his time here. Plus, invincible like Freddie so should command the respect. Still a gamble appointment, but less so than others.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
I genuinely hope not because that would mean he has turned things round, started to produce decent results and lifted us up the table.
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Do you honestly, hand on heart, think that's likely though?

After 2 1/2 years, if he was going to find a winning formula, he'd have found it by now.

I'll jump for joy the day I see his name in this thread.
 
The_Pon said:
Do you honestly, hand on heart, think that's likely though?

After 2 1/2 years, if he was going to find a winning formula, he'd have found it by now.

I'll jump for joy the day I see his name in this thread.
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The question is do I honestly not want to see his name on here or do I honestly believe he can turn it round.

The former "Yes" the latter "Probably not".

If we don't see his name on this thread there can only be one reason, that we are out of trouble and moving up the table. If we see his name appear on here then we will have still been playing the same old poor football we have seen of late.

Therefore I don't want to see his name in this thread.

Can he turn it round, honestly, I don't know, but I have my doubts. Would I like to see him turn it round, Yes I would. I like him as a person and would be very happy for him to continue if he can start to get the performances and results that we are all looking for, who wouldn't.

Edit: I wouldn't be jumping for joy either as we would be throwing our cap in the ring and hoping another manager coming in can improve our failing season. Its a risk, not a certainty.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
The question is do I honestly not want to see his name on here or do I honestly believe he can turn it round.

The former "Yes" the latter "Probably not".

If we don't see his name on this thread there can only be one reason, that we are out of trouble and moving up the table. If we see his name appear on here then we will have still been playing the same old poor football we have seen of late.

Therefore I don't want to see his name in this thread.

Can he turn it round, honestly, I don't know, but I have my doubts. Would I like to see him turn it round, Yes I would. I like him as a person and would be very happy for him to continue if he can start to get the performances and results that we are all looking for, who wouldn't.

Edit: I wouldn't be jumping for joy either as we would be throwing our cap in the ring and hoping another manager coming in can improve our failing season. Its a risk, not a certainty.
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I agree with the vast majority of that, but for the last paragraph. I understand that a new manager represents a risk, but it's a calculated risk: I honestly don't think anyone could do any worse than Cook is doing, so the risk is low as we have very little that we stand to lose. As I've said in other threads (with detailed explanation), I don't see any positives in the way we playing at the moment. Literally none.

As such, I don't see how a new manager could come in and do worse. Worst case scenario is that we hire a new manager and things stay just as they are now so there's no benefit, but that's worst case. I think any experienced manager would improve at least some facets of our game, and even that's a step in the right direction when you're not doing anything right currently.

Priority number one for me is get the confidence, belief and fighting spirit back into the players. As fans we can help with that by sticking with them.

I've been very vocal about my wanting Cook binned, but just to be clear (on the off chance anyone at the club does read this forum), I don't blame the players and they have my full, 100% support. I still have confidence and belief in the players that they are better than they've been able to show under this car crash of a manager and that they too deserve better so they can show us what they can really do when the shackles are off.
 
The_Pon said:
I agree with the vast majority of that, but for the last paragraph. I understand that a new manager represents a risk, but it's a calculated risk: I honestly don't think anyone could do any worse than Cook is doing, so the risk is low as we have very little that we stand to lose. As I've said in other threads (with detailed explanation), I don't see any positives in the way we playing at the moment. Literally none.

As such, I don't see how a new manager could come in and do worse. Worst case scenario is that we hire a new manager and things stay just as they are now so there's no benefit, but that's worst case. I think any experienced manager would improve at least some facets of our game, and even that's a step in the right direction when you're not doing anything right currently.

Priority number one for me is get the confidence, belief and fighting spirit back into the players. As fans we can help with that by sticking with them.

I've been very vocal about my wanting Cook binned, but just to be clear (on the off chance anyone at the club does read this forum), I don't blame the players and they have my full, 100% support. I still have confidence and belief in the players that they are better than they've been able to show under this car crash of a manager and that they too deserve better so they can show us what they can really do when the shackles are off.
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In total agreement with what you are saying, however, I still don't see it as a reason to jump for joy. Maybe it would be a relief, but would also be an admission of failure from the club, so for me, not a reason to be leaping about.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
In total agreement with what you are saying, however, I still don't see it as a reason to jump for joy. Maybe it would be a relief, but would also be an admission of failure from the club, so for me, not a reason to be leaping about.
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That's true in the sense it's an admission of failure, but we have to be pragmatic. Yes, the club made a huge mistake in keeping Cook on so long, but in the absence of a time machine under the West Stand, there's nothing we can do to change what's already passed. So we own up to our mistake, do something about it, learn from it and move forward (hopefully to better things). If we did that, it'd be worth celebrating in my book.

No-one gets it right every time, and there's no shame in admitting that. With every end comes a new beginning, so the cliché goes, and a new beginning is something I'd very much welcome right now.
 
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