VAR | Vital Football

VAR

E

Eweimps

Vital 1st Team Regular
Another farcical VAR interlude in the Bournemouth vs Arsenal game. Arsenal have just scored a perfectly good goal but they had to check for the most advanced toe nail of a player not even involved in the move.
 
Unfortunately it has created more problems than it's solved so far, and managed to invent issues that didn't previously exist in the game - such as varying interpretations of what constitutes handball.

Football is unsuited to this level of detail and so, currently, is the techhonlogy.. If incidents were reviewed immediately at normal speed then Mission Control would capture all the clear and obvious errors which is what it's surely meant to be about.

Odd that cricket, with a long history of DRS, and with a far easier use of technology in the game, still uses margins of error like Umpire's Decision and soft signals for catches.

I do have a season ticket at a ground where it's in use, so my natural bias against VAR has been heightened to downright hatred.
 
Brendan Bradley said:
Unfortunately it has created more problems than it's solved so far, and managed to invent issues that didn't previously exist in the game - such as varying interpretations of what constitutes handball.

Football is unsuited to this level of detail and so, currently, is the techhonlogy.. If incidents were reviewed immediately at normal speed then Mission Control would capture all the clear and obvious errors which is what it's surely meant to be about.

Odd that cricket, with a long history of DRS, and with a far easier use of technology in the game, still uses margins of error like Umpire's Decision and soft signals for catches.

I do have a season ticket at a ground where it's in use, so my natural bias against VAR has been heightened to downright hatred.
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Agree with the interpretation of hand ball as the commentators also seemed to be unsure, suggesting that if the ball travels a short distance to an outstretched arm it shouldn’t be given (as probably should be the case). I thought that had changed now and the distance was immaterial. Not sure that I understand the rules anymore.
The offside delay was ridiculous as what they should have checked was whether the player that was level with the defender actually got a touch as the ball was played through (which he didn’t, and was obvious within 10 secs) as the scorer was ok, but they still went on to check for a possible minuscule offside with the usual set square apparatus on screen when it was immaterial. It seemed to take forever.
I think for me, if it can be used effectively for the glaring howlers, penalty shouts and obvious offsides then fair enough but at the moment it’s not been used correctly
 
Yep, half the problem are the rules themselves, especially handball. All VAR does is highlight this. This confusion doesn't exist in cricket, so the technology tends to give a definitive answer.
 
Trouble is now even if you allowed a margin for error (and little toes weren't given offside), you'd get Jurgen and Pep going ballistic because someone's little toe was offside, and offiside is offiside. The big clubs wanted this because so much cash was at stake and decisions had to be correct; they're welcome to it. Let's hope we never have to suffer it on a weekly basis.
Do wonder if they should leave offisde to the assistant refs (who have a reasonable record), and just look at close-knit decisions in the penalty box with the video?
 
Impala said:
Do wonder if they should leave offisde to the assistant refs (who have a reasonable record)..
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Let;s just look at that one issue. Assistants get nearly all those correct anyway, regardless of what we think when we're actually in the ground.

Some decisions are wrong, but not by much. Very, very few are clearly called badly.

Now, with VAR, they're told to let play continue if it's a close call. As a result, play continues, a goal is scored, everyone celebrates, and then VAR cancels the goal - even though the assistant knew it was offside and would have flagged if this had been a League One game. Those who are adversely affected are then pistoff.

It doesn't matter if the decision reached by VAR is "right", it kills the excitement. The next time there's a goal, everyone waits till kick off before they can relax.

Allied to which if, say, the goalkeeper makes a save and it goes for a corner, the attacking team still get the corner, despite having been offside, and from which they may even score.

It's bonkers and I doubt it will ever work to most people's satisfaction unless it's stripped down to basics and subject to 10 second reviews. At more than one game this season I've been waiting over three minutes for a VAR decision.
 
Football has survived for many a year without , ok so a team may get a few bad descions ago against them in a season , but then again they get the going for them as well .

IMO it spoils the game , waiting for results of VAR , holds up play , and this business of only Premiership grounds can have it in the FA cup is rediculous . Either all or none . stll it looks as though its hear to stay so my continuing deline in watching the premer league will go on lol
 
NottyImp said:
VAR is shit.
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Think you're actually being rather kind Notty. Ali Fuseini was shit; but in my view, VAR is the very worst thing to happen to football in its long history.

The head of PL referees Mike Dean is coming out my way to Malaysia next month to get advice from the Asian Football Confederation. They're one of my clients here and so in the small talk of my last meeting, they mentioned they would be recommending to Dean that refs make use of the pitchside monitors. I did try and tell them this will slow the game down even more, and that there's no point VAR getting involved with toe-line/armpit offside calls, even less so if this then needs the on-field ref to ratify the stupid dotted lines... let's see if that message got through!

I haven't seen or read anyone who said they like VAR, other than referees themselves who had had enough of media and fans getting on their back if marginal calls didn't go their way. So maybe one good thing that might come out of this VAR mess is a much greater appreciation of the difficult and skilled job referees and linesmen have; and therefore a much fairer tolerance when marginal calls don't go a team's way.

As for the real howlers and/or cheating that everyone would want addressing (think Maradona/Henry handballs), all that's required for that is one video referee watching the TV coverage to have a word with the 4th official. I believe that's what happened with the Zidane sending-off in the 2006 WC Final... seems a very good and simple system.
 
As I have said before, it is the fault of the lunatics at IFAB (FIFA by another name) who have constipated the game with countless unnecessary rules and amendments to rules that were not needed in the first place. They have systematically ruined the game as a spectacle over the last 35 years, and VAR is simply the natural product of that: a desperate attempt by the authorities to make those unworkable rules work. It should have been impossible to make things any worse, but somehow they have.

Instead of allowing these clowns to make more rules in an already failed attempt to clarify the confusion they have created, and instead of having a room full of idiots a hundred miles away from the game to make decisions on it, how about this instead:

a) flush VAR down the nearest toilet, and do it today;
b) disband IFAB and never let any of them near organised sport again;
c) set up a new body - comprising sane people - to simplify the game once more by reversing IFAB's myriad petty rules.

Don't hold your breath (unless you are Steve Evans): it won't happen.
 
79imp said:
... they would be recommending to Dean that refs make use of the pitchside monitors. I did try and tell them this will slow the game down even more...
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This very thing happened to my own Spanish team this Sunday, however it was an away game so I was watching on TV and at least knew what was going on.

We were attacking and the ball flashed across goal. Our player missed it and I thought no more of it until VAR decided to check for a possible penalty as a defender had also tried to get to the ball.

As soon as the ref decided to look at the monitor I knew the decision would be reversed and we would be given a penalty, as I've never seen one occasion where a ref hasn't done that having gone pitchside. Sure enough, he changed his mind and pointed to the spot. I didn't think it was a pen myself even though I'm biased and saw several replays from different angles. We missed the pen anyway. But it took three minutes.
 
Brendan Bradley said:
This very thing happened to my own Spanish team this Sunday, however it was an away game so I was watching on TV and at least knew what was going on.

We were attacking and the ball flashed across goal. Our player missed it and I thought no more of it until VAR decided to check for a possible penalty as a defender had also tried to get to the ball.

As soon as the ref decided to look at the monitor I knew the decision would be reversed and we would be given a penalty, as I've never seen one occasion where a ref hasn't done that having gone pitchside. Sure enough, he changed his mind and pointed to the spot. I didn't think it was a pen myself even though I'm biased and saw several replays from different angles. We missed the pen anyway. But it took three minutes.
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So, a pointless initial review, followed by a wrong reversal and a three-minute delay. VAR will kill football.
 
Or....we could just accept that interpretation of rules by any individual is completely subjective and not get so f#%king angry about it. It's easy for me to say though, I'm a Buddhist :innocent:
 
Scotimp said:
As I have said before, it is the fault of the lunatics at IFAB (FIFA by another name) who have constipated the game with countless unnecessary rules and amendments to rules that were not needed in the first place. They have systematically ruined the game as a spectacle over the last 35 years, and VAR is simply the natural product of that: a desperate attempt by the authorities to make those unworkable rules work. It should have been impossible to make things any worse, but somehow they have.

Instead of allowing these clowns to make more rules in an already failed attempt to clarify the confusion they have created, and instead of having a room full of idiots a hundred miles away from the game to make decisions on it, how about this instead:

a) flush VAR down the nearest toilet, and do it today;
b) disband IFAB and never let any of them near organised sport again;
c) set up a new body - comprising sane people - to simplify the game once more by reversing IFAB's myriad petty rules.

Don't hold your breath (unless you are Steve Evans): it won't happen.
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Ruined the game as a spectacle for the last 35 years? Which rules are you referring to that have done this? Handball has been overly fiddled with for sure, and VAR goes without saying. But the back pass rule is one change that I think most people would say has actually improved the game. Maybe you don't, but that's your call.

I don't think you're wrong in saying there have been some needless rules and amendments to rules made, but as I alluded to in my previous post, a lot of the blame for the VAR and the rules mess the PL is in, is down to sensationalist media - and in turn fans - who crucify referees for mistakes, or overblow their reactions with stuff like "...systematically ruined the game as a spectacle for the 35 years". If that really was the case, why are you still watching?
 
79imp said:
But the back pass rule is one change that I think most people would say has actually improved the game. Maybe you don't, but that's your call.
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Yeah, I remember when the backpass rule was introduced ,I was thinking this is going to be disastrous. But I was wrongl,it improved the game massively. I like the introduction of the refs can of spray paint as well, which seemed daft when introduced. I guess it's just natural to go into traditionalist mode when talking about rule changes.
 
NottyImp said:
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...e-plans-sensible-var-armpit-remote-refereeing
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This was all perfectly foreseeable. Cricket, Tennis, Basketball and American Football have amply shown that professional sportspeople will attempt to manipulate any 3rd party system designed to eliminate any "clear howler" of a decision into one of ridiculous interpretations of a sports rules / laws to the nth degree to either get a decision to go their way or use it as a last ditch attempt to find some flaw in the decision to overrule it on a technicality. Football has now fallen into the exact same trap and is now tying itself in knots as it tries to come to a definitive decision over decisions that are almost entirely subjective. It's less obvious in sports with clear stop / start mechanics but now the big selling point we were all sold it on: "To get more decisions correct" is being shown for the sham it was always going to be. In all of this the sportspeople, the media and the ex-professionals are all equally guilty, the only people who are denied the experience of the game they want to see are the only people who actually pay money to watch the game, the fans...
 
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