They're at it again | Page 30 | Vital Football

They're at it again

Norfolk Imp said:
Who made a big mistake and have apologised for it ... matter closed in my eyes, but no doubt you'll keep dragging it up.
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There will be plenty of clubs that were deducted points, relegated closed down "through no fault of the players, manager or fans" that will not let this die!!!

If the big club apologists (including those pretending to be outraged) keep bringing up this "the fans, players manager should not be punished" then there could be a lot of court battles ahead for those that did get punished.

The rule is there in plain English. Just as other rules were there that were punished.

They can't now trot out the "not punishing the fans" argument when they had no bother doing so for other (not big) clubs when they broke rules.

As for me. Yes I will keep dragging it up, but then I am not sure if you know the concept of equality. Already we see you instinctively thinking in monetary terms in this thread and I have no knowledge of your past so I will not go down the route Knotty did.

Just as in all walks of life it should be one rule for all, not 1 for the rich and 1 for the rest.

If a group hatched a plan to steal the crown jewels, were about to do it but got caught at that stage they would all end up in jail. This was further along than just thinking about, or planning. They had all signed the deal. they had all committed to a 23 year long contract and are already (so they say) now many millions down because of clauses contained in those contracts!!! That is just to do with the ESL side of things.

We will see how much the PL and UEFA rules are worth now. If there is no punishment then their rules mean nothing and will be impossible to enforce any of the rules on any other team after that precedent is set.
 
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The fact that these greedy club owners and directors tried to force the issue while there were no fans allowed in the stadiums makes it worse. They deliberately timed things to take advantage of the Covid situation and yet completely misjudged the inevitable reaction. Heads should roll, fines be implemented, cup places forfeited and points deducted.

There is now an opportunity to get football on a more sustainable path. I am usually pretty positive, but the cynic in me says the various governing bodies will waste it. Let's see.
 
Norfolk Imp said:
Who made a big mistake and have apologised for it ... matter closed in my eyes, but no doubt you'll keep dragging it up.
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Of course we will as the matter is far from closed. As far as ManShitty's heirarchy is concerned, they've only apologised because, like all of the Dirty Dozen they were too stupid to realise quite how controversial the proposals were going to be and the strength and breadth of opposition. As I said earlier, their behaviour in the last few days is like the little kid caught up to no good and the 'apologies' from Ferrano, Henry et al frankly vomit inducing.

To try and excuse ManShitty because they were the most reluctant is like trying to excuse the most reluctant concentration camp guard. They're still guilty.

BB's post #579 on the previous page confirms complacency is dangerous.
 
I've seen nothing from any of the clubs in England that is anything more than a told off child been made to apologise. All I've seen so far is a bunch of clubs saying they didn't want to get left behind and didn't realise the strength of feeling, it just reinforces the notion they were just in it for themselves rather than excusing them.

A proper apology should be including the detail of why they thought it was going to be better for anyone other than the breakaway clubs. The fact they can't says it all, it's just protectionism and greed of the few.
 
Chesterimp said:
Of course we will as the matter is far from closed. As far as ManShitty's heirarchy is concerned, they've only apologised because, like all of the Dirty Dozen they were too stupid to realise quite how controversial the proposals were going to be and the strength and breadth of opposition. As I said earlier, their behaviour in the last few days is like the little kid caught up to no good and the 'apologies' from Ferrano, Henry et al frankly vomit inducing.

To try and excuse ManShitty because they were the most reluctant is like trying to excuse the most reluctant concentration camp guard. They're still guilty.

BB's post #579 on the previous page confirms complacency is dangerous.
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Good lord, nobody has been killed during those 72 hours, what a extreme analogy to make?
 
berksimps said:
The fact that these greedy club owners and directors tried to force the issue while there were no fans allowed in the stadiums makes it worse. They deliberately timed things to take advantage of the Covid situation and yet completely misjudged the inevitable reaction. Heads should roll, fines be implemented, cup places forfeited and points deducted.

There is now an opportunity to get football on a more sustainable path. I am usually pretty positive, but the cynic in me says the various governing bodies will waste it. Let's see.
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I must admit the timing was pretty shocking and deliberate ... City's statement came out on Sunday evening at 23.20.

As for heads rolling (I doubt any will at City if so, who?) fines implemented (yes, I agree with that) Cup places forfeited (UEFA have already said they won't) and points deducted ... well that should make things interesting next season, if they do.

How many points do you suggest though, 10, 20 ... or more?
 
Norfolk Imp said:
I must admit the timing was pretty shocking and deliberate ... City's statement came out on Sunday evening at 23.20.

As for heads rolling (I doubt any will at City if so, who?) fines implemented (yes, I agree with that) Cup places forfeited (UEFA have already said they won't) and points deducted ... well that should make things interesting next season, if they do.

How many points do you suggest though, 10, 20 ... or more?
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100. Every season.
 
Norfolk Imp said:
I must admit the timing was pretty shocking and deliberate ... City's statement came out on Sunday evening at 23.20.

As for heads rolling (I doubt any will at City if so, who?) fines implemented (yes, I agree with that) Cup places forfeited (UEFA have already said they won't) and points deducted ... well that should make things interesting next season, if they do.

How many points do you suggest though, 10, 20 ... or more?
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I suggest we wait until the end of next season and then simply deduct all of their points however many they are...
 
Gratzimp said:
Arsenal boss Artetta has said this in his press conference;

"First of all they are very caring for the interests of the football club and, secondly, they are very intelligent and professional people. So I'm sure that they have the right reasons to start something but it clearly didn’t work, or it wasn’t the right time. It wasn’t done the right way and it was time to step back."

Now to me, that sounds like he isn't really against the idea, a veiled message saying he liked the idea and it may be attempted again. Mind you he is Spanish so there you go.

Or is it just me that thinks this? Managers like Pep and Klopp, genuinely sounded fully against it.

I don't think this will go away, unless something is put in place to stop it.
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Suspect Klopp and Pep are safer in their jobs and hold much more sway than Arteta, who's a newbie. Solskjaer probably won't say that much before the weekend games either.
 
Brendan Bradley said:
It's definitely not over. Laporta at Barcelona said so today.
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I suspect that the only reason that the three who haven't withdrawn are making noises about it still being a good idea is personal ego. They cannot stand to lose face. They can all go and play with themselves and shut the toilet door behind them when they do.
 
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I think the PL would rather strengthen their hand by removing the Big 6 PL execs from their committees as a longer term punishment rather than a one off points deduction for a season or fines, which aren't going to really make much difference in the grand scheme of things.

UEFA have already filled some of their gaps on committees (admittedly due to resignations when it was all announced) and any Club suspensions from their competitions will result in claims on TV deals I suspect.
 
I wonder if some of the clubs fell for a bit of spin from the big three?

So and so is in it, if you don't sign up now you can join later, but you won't be one of the founders, so you might get relegated. It is all going ahead anyway, it is just a matter of whether you want to fill the 15th spot or whether we offer it Ajax. You would be fools not to have a position at the top table. It is going ahead and if you are not in you're out, we can do it without you. UEFA is weak, FIFA want a world club championship and this would be the natural feeder. I don't see how you can't be involved, it is a no lose situation.

Oh, by the way, do you want some of these guaranteed winning tickets for the Spanish lottery. Lottery, who am I kidding, it is no lottery, we know who is going to win before we start. Ha, ha, ha.

Do you think I look good in this blazer? It goes with my yacht.
 
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YarmImp said:
I can't stand any of the 'six'.
I refuse to use the big part they have been given as they mean so little to me. They are as insignificant to me as a bit of fluff that falls onto the carpet when I take my socks off before bed.
Would happily see them take the cods place in non league, and that's saying something.
Someone mentioned mk thieves earlier as well, I for one haven't forgotten or forgiven their treachery and I never will. They need to be removed as well. There was no pressure from the government when they staged their heist, but that's because there were very little votes to be won from 10k Wimbledon fans.

In short Liverpool, Man United, Man City, Chelsea, Tottenham, Arsenal and Milton Keynes are all scum and should never be forgiven. Sanctions both official and un official should proceed for a generation. No club in the UK football pyramid should ever take a player on loan from them, deal with them when buying or selling players, have pre season friendlies with them, play reserve team games with them, or play their youth games in the trophy. All clubs should join together and jointly pay any fines for not fulfilling any fixtures with their u23s therefore bringing that competition back to a lower league cup competition.
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Don't hold back YarmImp, tell us what you really think. :grinning:
 
Norfolk Imp said:
I must admit the timing was pretty shocking and deliberate ... City's statement came out on Sunday evening at 23.20.

As for heads rolling (I doubt any will at City if so, who?) fines implemented (yes, I agree with that) Cup places forfeited (UEFA have already said they won't) and points deducted ... well that should make things interesting next season, if they do.

How many points do you suggest though, 10, 20 ... or more?
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A club goes into admin (not the fans, players or managers fault) there is an immediate 10 point deduction, either this season if it means they are relegated or stops them winning a prize or next season if they are already relegated. That is already the penalty for that rule breach. then there are further deductions and penalties if it is more serious than just administration. Remember Leeds and Luton's penalties (not the fan, players or manager's fault?)

UEFA have not said they won't. They said today it was unlikely they could do anything regarding the 3 teams left in the CL due to the time constraints but they have not said the won't. They are no doubt consulting lawyers on this as we speak.

UEFA have already stopped one Spanish ground being used as a venue in the Euros. An easy target because they hadn't got enough government promises about it but I daresay they are looking at other venues for the other clubs.

and I suggest 20 points after they are relegated to the Championship. Being generous and not relegating them 2 divisions.

the whole "not punishing the fans" is laughable after what has happened in the past for rules breaches.

And from next season REAL FFP auditing and monitoring should be undertaken every year and punishments enforced.

Teams like Juve and AC Milan should have longer memories after what happened to them a decade ago but no............forgotten in their minds just like yours.
 
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GreenNeedle said:
A club goes into admin (not the fans, players or managers fault) there is an immediate 10 point deduction, either this season if it means they are relegated or stops them winning a prize or next season if they are already relegated. That is already the penalty for that rule breach. then there are further deductions and penalties if it is more serious than just administration. Remember Leeds and Luton's penalties (not the fan, players or manager's fault?)

UEFA have not said they won't. They said today it was unlikely they could do anything regarding the 3 teams left in the CL due to the time constraints but they have not said the won't. They are no doubt consulting lawyers on this as we speak.

UEFA have already stopped one Spanish ground being used as a venue in the Euros. An easy target because they hadn't got enough government promises about it but I daresay they are looking at other venues for the other clubs.

and I suggest 20 points after they are relegated to the Championship. Being generous and not relegating them 2 divisions.

the whole 2not punishing the fans" is laughable after what has happened in the past for rules breaches.

And from next season REAL FFP auditing and monitoring should be undertaken every year and punishments enforced.

Teams like Juve and AC Milan should have longer memories after what happened to them a decade ago but no............forgotten in their minds just like yours.
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Sure I read today that UEFA wouldn't use the '6' stadiums either.
 
cherryexile said:
I wonder if some of the clubs fell for a bit of spin from the big three?

So and so is in it, if you don't sign up now you can join later, but you won't be one of the founders, so you might get relegated. It is all going ahead anyway, it is just a matter of whether you want to fill the 15th spot or whether we offer it Ajax. You would be fools not to have a position at the top table. It is going ahead and if you are not in you're out, we can do it without you. UEFA is weak, FIFA want a world club championship and this would be the natural feeder. I don't see how you can't be involved, it is a no lose situation.

Oh, by the way, do want some of these guaranteed winning tickets for the Spanish lottery. Lottery, who am I kidding, it is no lottery, we know who is going to win before we start. Ha, ha, ha.

Do you think I look good in this blazer? It goes with my yacht.
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Perhaps controversial, but I think Man City fall into that bracket slightly. They're not at a 'super club', they're still years and years away from the likes of United, Liverpool, Barca, Madrid, Bayern, Juventus etc and I think there was probably an element of trying to stay in with the right crowd. They certainly don't need the money. Not absolving them of any blame there but there's that angle to it.

Levy must have been pissing his pants when he got the call. A chance to be in that sort of company for him was a no brainer (the money advantageous, too!).
 
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