SHEFFIELD WEDNESDAY | Page 4 | Vital Football

SHEFFIELD WEDNESDAY

Same script every single away game. We miss a sitter, go behind and show no appetite whatsoever to try to win the game. I am becoming sick to death of this shite football, game after game after game. The formula isn’t working Paul, so why not make an attempt to change it? £10m spent in the summer and so far we are a hell of a lot worse than last season. I am beyond disillusioned with this garbage.
 
We were on top 1st half. Robinson's fault for goal. Thought Mulgrew and Byrne had a good game. Met some Sheffield Wed supporters on the tram - they commented Kadeem Harris has been kept exceptionally quiet today - well done to Nathan Byrne.
 
Have Charlton got any a weaker squad than us? On paper most of our squad are league one level?

So in your opinion the squad isn't good enough, therefore Cook is doing a great job.

I disagree entirely, as the away form from the past 14 months suggests. You can be so good at home and not be good enough, then be so poor away from home, it's solely down to tactics. We've a very good squad that if allowed to express themselves will easily climb the table. A good manager can get a poor squad of players playing well if he is tactically astute, which is something Bowyer is.

I don't understand how you can defend Cook.
 
So in your opinion the squad isn't good enough, therefore Cook is doing a great job.

I disagree entirely, as the away form from the past 14 months suggests. You can be so good at home and not be good enough, then be so poor away from home, it's solely down to tactics. We've a very good squad that if allowed to express themselves will easily climb the table. A good manager can get a poor squad of players playing well if he is tactically astute, which is something Bowyer is.

I don't understand how you can defend Cook.
In the last twelve months we haven't been owt spectacular at home at all really. Tuesday we were awful and won by a stroke of luck.
 
From the commentary it sounded like we deserved a point. Just because we lost the usual suspects are going into meltdown. I would like to read comments from those loyal souls that went to see if we were as dire as some are making out.
 
Didn't go today but would appreciate an honest balanced opinion of the game from someone who did attend, please.
First half we were on top for the first twenty minutes. Williams was playing pretty well and I thought Jamal Lowe looked good. But then as they grew into the game we looked shakier and shakier towards half time.
The second half was appalling from us. We gifted them a goal and didn’t show much going forward. Massey and Byrne were shocking down the right wing and the lack of play down either wing left Garner alone up front with Windass being marked out of the game.
Feel sorry for Mulgrew and Dunkley, who for the most part were strong at the back.
The lack of movement from us was worrying. Looked like nobody wanted the ball.
When Moore and Pilkington came on the midfield disappeared and we just started hoofing it. Geldhart came on and played well but he was put on too late.
All in all there were glimpses of what we could do in the first 20 mins but just an absolute lack of plan B or any players standing out and leading the team.
Massey and Byrne shouldn’t be in the team for me, and Robinson needs help down that left wing so he can overlap effectively.
Moore should have started and we should be playing wider with speed but we just hoof it.
Really ugly football.
 
It's not just about today. It's about the same tactics game after game. The same like for like changes game after game.
No variation game after game.

I think we've got a decent squad capable of better but Cook has run his course and its time for a change.

Who with Championship experience we could entice or afford I don't know .
 
Well I've decided to come. Hope springing eternal once again! Hope I'm not bored to death, regret it and we get a thrashing. Up the tics!
I tried to warn you.

Didn’t go, didn’t have to go to know the result. We’re fucking shit and on our way down unless we make a change. The fans are staying away from the DW and this will now become a financial decision for the Royles. When the fans start staying away, there’s no going back for the manager.

Every single thing about us on and off the pitch absolutely stinks of League One. It’s fucking horrible and cannot go on any longer.
 
First half we were on top for the first twenty minutes. Williams was playing pretty well and I thought Jamal Lowe looked good. But then as they grew into the game we looked shakier and shakier towards half time.
The second half was appalling from us. We gifted them a goal and didn’t show much going forward. Massey and Byrne were shocking down the right wing and the lack of play down either wing left Garner alone up front with Windass being marked out of the game.
Feel sorry for Mulgrew and Dunkley, who for the most part were strong at the back.
The lack of movement from us was worrying. Looked like nobody wanted the ball.
When Moore and Pilkington came on the midfield disappeared and we just started hoofing it. Geldhart came on and played well but he was put on too late.
All in all there were glimpses of what we could do in the first 20 mins but just an absolute lack of plan B or any players standing out and leading the team.
Massey and Byrne shouldn’t be in the team for me, and Robinson needs help down that left wing so he can overlap effectively.
Moore should have started and we should be playing wider with speed but we just hoof it.
Really ugly football.

This happens almost every game, we tend to start well, then as soon as the opposing manager makes a tactical change of opposing players adapt we struggle. Happens way to often this.
 
Thanks for the comments from those who went. From watching us last week we clearly need to change something. We definitely have too many players who are really good for the level below but don’t seem to be able to cut it at this level. Byrne and Jacobs being the obvious ones and Massey on his start to the season which is a shame as I thought he would continue to progress this season. Then we have Lowe and Moore who are struggling to adapt in a team whose confidence is shot to pieces away from home. We need to try something different to get the players believing our form will change. Morsy is now suspended so we will have a change in the engine room next week. If our full backs are not going to bomb forward then stop playing two holding midfielders and play one as the anchor and one further forward such as Evans. He’s good at picking a pass and can shoot.

Or play Pilkington in behind Moore in the pocket to give us that creative spark. Isn’t Byrne suspended now also? Get the young Chelsea lad in instead.

And what has happened to the young Wolves lad? Wolves have not given him a new long-term contract because he’s rubbish. Get him at least on the bench
 
We could just copy and paste the whole thread from 28 of last 29 away games - just the same thing over and over.

Nothing new to discuss all been said before; style of play, tactics, performance, results etc it's just Joyce or Malky reincarnated and no sign of hope in site for improvement.

But we'll kick can down road for a while longer yet. I said in another thread no matter how bad results or performances it's clear Cook is safe as long as there are 3 teams propping us up out of the bottom 3. I suspect Huddersfield will be above us by end of month and Stoke won't be below us all season so just a case of if Reading, Barnsley and Boro keep doing us favours by being so bad.
 
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First half we were on top for the first twenty minutes. Williams was playing pretty well and I thought Jamal Lowe looked good. But then as they grew into the game we looked shakier and shakier towards half time.
The second half was appalling from us. We gifted them a goal and didn’t show much going forward. Massey and Byrne were shocking down the right wing and the lack of play down either wing left Garner alone up front with Windass being marked out of the game.
Feel sorry for Mulgrew and Dunkley, who for the most part were strong at the back.
The lack of movement from us was worrying. Looked like nobody wanted the ball.
When Moore and Pilkington came on the midfield disappeared and we just started hoofing it. Geldhart came on and played well but he was put on too late.
All in all there were glimpses of what we could do in the first 20 mins but just an absolute lack of plan B or any players standing out and leading the team.
Massey and Byrne shouldn’t be in the team for me, and Robinson needs help down that left wing so he can overlap effectively.
Moore should have started and we should be playing wider with speed but we just hoof it.
Really ugly football.

I went and have just got back.
I would agree with most of what richymac wrote.
The referee was inconsistent with what fouls were given or were not (given). His game management spoiled the flow of the game at times.

First half, Sheffield Wednesday were absolutely awful ... We actually looked like we had the upper hand. Not so much hoofball ... unless Chey Dunkley didn't have an easy pass to complete.... bring the f*cking ball forward for once !

Barry Bannan was allowed to step up his game and Wednesday grew bolder. Their sloppy passing improved. We need to find a player of his calibre from somewhere.
Joe Williams lost the ball at the edge of the area and we almost gifted them a goal. I think he has a bright future as Sam Morsy's replacement but perhaps the two players are far too similar at times.
The gifted goal was awful, Adam Reach was left on his own and the same thing happened not long after too.
Could go on, but the post would turn into an essay.

There was a phrase that used to be hung up around Wigan Athletic (they have motivational posters / boards everywhere and it might still be used).
"Fail to prepare, prepare to fail"
A seemingly lovely chap and I would dearly love Mr Cook to take the team further. The away record speaks for itself though. The manager and his staff have not taken the team forward and the development of players just doesn't appear to be there. The lack of fight and tactical nous whilst playing away is indicative of sub par management.

Unless the Royals turn the football world upside down and hire a second manager to prepare / manage a team for away matches ... Perhaps Paul Cook should be let go moving into an international break.
Tough to call though, the heart says "no, keep backing the manager".
 
I tried to warn you.

Didn’t go, didn’t have to go to know the result. We’re fucking shit and on our way down unless we make a change. The fans are staying away from the DW and this will now become a financial decision for the Royles. When the fans start staying away, there’s no going back for the manager.

Every single thing about us on and off the pitch absolutely stinks of League One. It’s fucking horrible and cannot go on any longer.
Just wondering how many non-season ticket holders (excluding opposing supporters to be clear), on average, attend games. Any idea?
 
That was obviously a very underwhelming performance today. Wednesday didn't play brilliantly, in my opinion, and they were not unbeatable by any stretch of the imagination. Yet the extent of our poor form away from home means that we usually seem to find ways of being inferior to the opposition, even if they are having an off day themselves. Ultimately though, Wednesday just seemed to play with more urgency, and at least tried to keep the ball on the floor, whereas some of our players seemed lethargic and lacking in motivation, commitment and effort at times. Not to mention the fact that our play was characterised by hopeful long balls, which very rarely led to anything that could challenge the Owls' backline.

Other than the goalmouth scramble early on in the game, I don't recall our creating anything from open play in the entire match. Wednesday didn't create a lot of opportunities themselves, and the majority of the game was played in the middle of the park. Ultimately, though, they just had that little bit more than us today, both in terms of drive and ability, and particularly in a league where there is so little to separate those at the top from those at the bottom, one extra moment of quality, or simply just wanting it more, can determine the outcome of a whole match. Even when we had the upper hand, we just couldn't seem to find a way of translating this momentum into something tangible, whereas the Owls capitalised firmly on their purple patch just after half time, through getting on the scoresheet. Once they'd scored that first goal it was just a case of closing out the game, and I think it's fair to say that we did very little in the second half to threaten their attainment of this objective. We gave them nothing to worry about in the latter stages of this game.

In my opinion, it has come to the point now where Cook should drop Massey for his own good. I really like him as a player, and I honestly think that he could be a highly valuable asset for us in the Championship in the long term. It just seems to me as though he is very much a confidence player, and at the moment he just seems to have lost that self belief, which, I believe, was such an integral cause for his relatively good form last year. It just seemed that, today, nearly every attack we did manage to create petered out when he had possession of the ball, and he almost seemed to be trying too hard to make something happen. His performances against Barnsley and Sheffield Wednesday this season have been reminiscent of the 2017-18 Massey, and we all know that he is capable of so much more than what he is currently producing. I would consequently start Pilkington in the next game, if he is match fit, and I'd give Massey the little run out of the side that I think he needs in order to improve and come back stronger.

Just on a side note, I think questions also have to be asked of Jamal Lowe, and whether he was worth the 3m that we paid for him. He has shown glimpses of promise, but nothing substantial as of yet, and I think that we are now far enough into the season where you'd expect a little bit more from him than what he showed in the match today. He does seem to go missing at times, and I'd personally just like to see him more involved in the play, as he looks threatening when he gets the opportunity to run at defenders, and utilise his considerable pace. I also thought that Robinson had a poor game, and was at least partially responsible for their goal (although I don't want to be too critical of him as he has been one of the better players so far this season). Windass, Garner and Moore were generally absent, despite the former starting brightly; but given that this was the case for all three of them, it does make you think that perhaps it is Cook and a lack of service, rather than those three players, who are the problem.

Anyway, just thought I'd end on a few positives that I think we can take from today:

1) Byrne's noticeable victory over Kadeem Harris:

I thought Byrne had a brilliant game today, and he was our 'Man of the Match', in my opinion. He did a brilliant job of mitigating the impressive Kadeem Harris's influence on the wing, made several decisive and confident challenges, and managed to snuff out the majority of the tricky Wednesday winger's attempts to put the ball in the box. My view as to the main reason why he had so much success, is because he was up against someone of a similar size to his own, and so he felt more confident in winning the physical battles that he faced throughout the match. I think Byrne becomes uncomfortable when he comes up against someone significantly taller than himself, so this is maybe something for Cook to look out for and consider in future games.

2) The blossoming Mulgrew/Dunkley partnership:

As has been mentioned on here, our two centre backs looked composed and calm in today's game, as they did against Birmingham in midweek. I think it's important to acknowledge the fact that we have conceded just 3 goals in our last 4 games, and so despite the fact that we are facing ongoing problems in terms of goalscoring, I think we may have at least found an answer to the frequently asked question of who our centre back pairing should consist of. Of course, this outlook could change completely in the coming weeks, depending on whether Dunkley and Mulgrew can sustain their current form, but for the moment I think we can look upon their performances as a positive.

3) The support:

Just thought I'd end with a brief note for the support today. It was great to see a fair amount of people turn up and get behind the side, despite the fact that we are frankly terrible away from home at the moment. It's all right for me, just coming down to the ground from about 10 minutes away, but kudos to all of you on here who made the trip down to Hillsborough yesterday. I hope you enjoyed what you saw of Sheffield and that the people here were very welcoming to you (also TS, I hope you enjoyed your meal!!).
 
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Tha
That was obviously a very underwhelming performance today. Wednesday didn't play brilliantly, in my opinion, and they were not unbeatable by any stretch of the imagination. Yet the extent of our poor form away from home means that we usually seem to find ways of being inferior to the opposition, even if they are having an off day themselves. Ultimately though, Wednesday just seemed to play with more urgency, and at least tried to keep the ball on the floor, whereas some of our players seemed lethargic and lacking in motivation, commitment and effort at times. Not to mention the fact that our play was characterised by hopeful long balls, which very rarely led to anything that could challenge the Owls' backline.

Other than the goalmouth scramble early on in the game, I don't recall our creating anything from open play in the entire match. Wednesday didn't create a lot of opportunities themselves, and the majority of the game was played in the middle of the park. Ultimately, though, they just had that little bit more than us today, both in terms of drive and ability, and particularly in a league where there is so little to separate those at the top from those at the bottom, one extra moment of quality, or simply just wanting it more, can determine the outcome of a whole match. Even when we had the upper hand, we just couldn't seem to find a way of translating this momentum into something tangible, whereas the Owls capitalised firmly on their purple patch just after half time, through getting on the scoresheet. Once they'd scored that first goal it was just a case of closing out the game, and I think it's fair to say that we did very little in the second half to threaten their attainment of this objective. We gave them nothing to worry about in the latter stages of the game.

In my opinion, it has come to the point now where Cook should drop Massey for his own good. I really like him as a player, and I honestly think that he could be a highly valuable asset for us in the Championship in the long term. It just it seems to me as though he is very much a confidence player, and at the moment he just seems to have lost that self belief, which, I believe, was such an integral cause for his relatively good form last year. It just seemed that, today, nearly every attack we did manage to create petered out when he had possession of the ball, and he almost seemed to be trying too hard to make something happen. His performances against Barnsley and Sheffield Wednesday this season have been reminiscent of the 2017-18 Massey, and we all know that he is capable of so much more than what he is currently producing. I would consequently start Pilkington in the next game, if he is match fit, and I'd give Massey the little run out of the side that I think he needs in order to improve and come back stronger.

Just on a side note, I think questions also have to be asked of Jamal Lowe and whether he was worth the 3m that we paid for him. He has shown glimpses of promise, but nothing substantial as of yet, and I think that we are now far enough into the season where you'd expect a little bit more from him than what he showed in the match today. He does seem to go missing at times, and I'd personally just like to see him more involved in the play, as he does look threatening when he gets the opportunity to run at defenders, and utilise his pace. I also thought that Robinson had a poor game, and was at least partially responsible for their goal (although I don't want to be too critical of him as he has been one of the better players so far this season). Windass, Garner and Moore were generally absent, despite the former starting brightly; but given that this was the case for all three of them, it does make you think that perhaps it is Cook and a lack of service, rather than the players, who are the problem.

Anyway, just thought I'd end on a few positives that I think we can take from today:

1) Byrne's noticeable victory over Kadeem Harris:

I thought Byrne had a brilliant game today, and he was our 'Man of the Match', in my opinion. He did a brilliant job of mitigating the impressive Kadeem Harris's influence on the wing, made several decisive and confident challenges, and managed to snuff out the majority of the Wednesday winger's attempts to put the ball in the box. My view as to the main reason why he had so much success, is because he was up against someone of a similar size to his own, and so he felt more confident in winning the physical battles that he faced throughout the match. I think Byrne becomes uncomfortable when he comes up against someone significantly taller than himself, so this maybe something for Cook to look out for and consider.

2) The blossoming Mulgrew/Dunkley partnership:

As has been mentioned on here, our two centre backs looked composed and calm in today's game, as they did against Birmingham in midweek. I think it's important to acknowledge the fact that we have conceded just 3 goals in our last 4 games, and so despite the fact that we are facing ongoing problems in terms of goalscoring, I think we may have at least found an answer to the frequently asked question of who our centre back pairing should consist of. Of course, this outlook could change completely in the coming weeks, depending on whether Dunkley and Mulgrew can sustain their current form, but for the moment I think we can look upon their performances as a positive.

3) The support:

Just thought I'd end with a brief note for the support today. It was great to see a fair amount of people turn up and get behind the side, despite the fact that we are frankly terrible away from home at the moment. It's all right for me, just coming down to the ground from about 10 minutes away, but kudos to all of you on here who made the trip down to Hillsborough yesterday. I hope you enjoyed what you saw of Sheffield and that the people here were very welcoming to you (also TS, I hope you enjoyed your meal!!).
Thanks Will for the feedback on the game, just a shame we couldn’t get a positive result with you living locally.

I remember us losing to Swindon in the FA Cup down here a few years ago, I got some right stick from my Swindon supporting mates. I even rang up 606 I was that annoyed with Roberto’s team selection. He made up for it the following year though!
 
Will - agree with a lot of your post. I do like Sheffield - the city centre bit.
Tha

Thanks Will for the feedback on the game, just a shame we couldn’t get a positive result with you living locally.

I remember us losing to Swindon in the FA Cup down here a few years ago, I got some right stick from my Swindon supporting mates. I even rang up 606 I was that annoyed with Roberto’s team selection. He made up for it the following year though!

Thanks N'Zogbia's fan club and yeah the city centre is nice; they've modernised it and invested quite a lot into it recently because so many people were just going to Meadowhall (our equivalent of the Trafford Centre) which is on the outskirts, and the shops in the city centre kind of suffered as a result. But the city centre has everything you need in terms of shops, restaurants and is really good for a night out.

Thanks Swindon; are you originally from down south, or just moved there? Either way, did you by any chance attend this game?


I remember watching it on Sky a few years ago and I think it just stuck in my mind as one of the highlight performances of the 2015-16 season, with 3 goals in 4 minutes at one point. Hope you gave those friends some stick for that! I've lived in Sheffield since I was 1 (I'm 18 now) but my Dad was working in Wrightington when I was born so that's the link, and tbh I've never really felt any connection to the Sheffield clubs; my parents took me to some games when I was a young child and I enjoyed them, but never felt any connection. I'm proud to say that I'm from Sheffield, it's a great city for me to have grown up in, but also proud to say that I'm a Latics fan, and always will be now. I'm thankful that most of my friends went elsewhere to uni though, so they couldn't see that game as we were getting battered at one point!

Anyway, I’ve diverged massively there; sorry about that. Going back to our current situation, I just wanted to ask you both, what are your thoughts on the tenability of Cook’s position as manager? Personally, I would like to see him go at this point, as I think he’s taken us as far as he possibly can now. The away record speaks for itself, and it seems as though even the home performance levels are deteriorating now. I’d just like us to make sure that we have a suitable replacement lined up first though; I think Gary Rowatt would be a decent choice, and he does have history of picking up teams that were struggling e.g. Birmingham in 2014-15. I just don’t want us to end up with someone like Unsworth, as that could potentially lead to an even worse run of results.
 
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