Hart - next in line for a kicking | Vital Football

Hart - next in line for a kicking

Skoorb

Skoorb

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Nice to see England legend Gordon Banks wading in to join the line of ex-professionals out to undermine Joe Hart. :013: As an ex-Stoke keeper himself it is no surprise he is touting his old club's current goal keeper, but even so......

Following on from Jens Lehman and Fabian Barthez, Gordon is the latest to set about the campaign to single out a City player for criticism. Tired of slagging off the standard punchbag, Raheem Sterling, the next target that has been identified for the steady drip drip drip of negative comments. I don't see a similar stream of criticism following England Captain and serial under performer on the international stage, Wayne Rooney or any of the garbage defending (yes Kyle Walk On Water Walker I'm talking about you, among others) witnessed during the national team's dismal Euro 2016......

Hart did not cover himself in glory but I am getting a bit cheesed off with the feel of this insidious, creeping, confidence sapping type of narrative.

England legend Banks would drop Hart and start Butland

http://www.mancity.com/fixtures/first-team/all?season=2016-17
 
Banks as England's best ever keeper by a huge margin is entitled to his view and Hart does deserve stick, but he is still a better option than Butland. As for Shrek has he ever performed in a major tournament when it really counts, cant think of any. The next England boss needs to drop him and build a new team with some spirit and grit.
 
Former Stoke keeper makes plea for current Stoke keeper to start for his country, well I never.

Is Neuer coming in for any stick for his balls up last night?
 
Bluedub - 8/7/2016 07:39

Former Stoke keeper makes plea for current Stoke keeper to start for his country, well I never.

Is Neuer coming in for any stick for his balls up last night?
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Hart was at fault for two of the goals England conceded at the tournament and Gordon was making a fair point. In any case he made his name as the Leicester City keeper.
 
johnkelv - 8/7/2016 11:58

Bluedub - 8/7/2016 07:39

Former Stoke keeper makes plea for current Stoke keeper to start for his country, well I never.

Is Neuer coming in for any stick for his balls up last night?
Click to expand...
Hart was at fault for two of the goals England conceded at the tournament and Gordon was making a fair point. In any case he made his name as the Leicester City keeper.
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So on the basis of two errors he should be dropped?

Does the same apply to De Gea?
 
Bluedub - 8/7/2016 12:01

johnkelv - 8/7/2016 11:58

Bluedub - 8/7/2016 07:39

Former Stoke keeper makes plea for current Stoke keeper to start for his country, well I never.

Is Neuer coming in for any stick for his balls up last night?
Click to expand...
Hart was at fault for two of the goals England conceded at the tournament and Gordon was making a fair point. In any case he made his name as the Leicester City keeper.
Click to expand...

So on the basis of two errors he should be dropped?

Does the same apply to De Gea?
Click to expand...

I'm with you on this, but I suppose the difference is that De Gea made a few really good saves as well as his blunders, whereas Joe didn't really have anything else to do in his games :048:
 
I think De Gea is a better all round keeper than JH, but Joe is still by far the best English keeper and I am not saying England should drop him for Butland, but that Banks has a point. However they should drop Shrek, even his new manager says he is a #9 or #10, but he is not good enough anymore to be first pick for England in either playmaker or striker role. Joe has three faults, the odd long range shot, the odd near post weakness and poor slow distribution when he has the ball in his hands, but of course all keepers make mistakes and you are only ever remembered for your mistakes. Pep will have to make a call on Joe, but I think he will keep him as his #1.
 
He is not perfect I know - his slow distribution sometimes drives me crazy and I would just love to be able to find some stats on how frequently we lose possession after he kicks long (it often seems to end up straight to an opponent) but he has saved us many points over the seasons.

Up to point I can understand an ex-Stoke player siding with his old team's current keeper (although how long he would stay at Stoke is a separate question and I wonder whether Gordon would be backing him if he secured a move to say, Liverpool, tomorrow?). I think perhaps what grates is that whilst the performance of the whole squad has been roundly commented upon it seems that only some have been singled out for specific criticism. Rodney's performances were woeful and his response as CAPTAIN during the debacle against Iceland was lacking any kind of leadership quality. And yet I have not heard calls for him to be dropped for example.
 
I don't think De Gea's any better than Hart, I think he can make the most simple saves look spectacular which makes him look better than he is. He also usually has some sycophantic rag in commentary lauding his every move and failing to call him out on things other keepers get criticised for. He has some glaring weaknesses too, he is awful on his near post, his positioning in this regard is seriously suspect, he leaves huge gaps there and we saw yet another example of him being exposed there in the Euros with Perisic rifling one at his near post. I think what stands De Gea in good stead in terms of perception is that he struggled initially but made big improvements to a point now where he's a very good keeper, around the same standard as our Joe but no better.

Skoorb, them stats are available on Whoscored, this is a point I've made before but have a look at his passing percentage success at international level and then at club level and explain why his kicking/distribution becomes so much better when he has an England shirt on. Sorry to go back to De Gea but look at his passing stats, they are no better than Hart's and bear in mind he usually has Fellaini to find with his long kicks, Hart seems to be instructed to try pick out Sagna

or Kolarov.

Citizhun, I agree De Gea made a couple of genuine great saves in the comp ( he made some pretty camera ones too ) but my point is that player's places in teams shouldn't hinge on one tournament, it's absurd. Hart kept 7 clean sheets in 9 appearances in the qualifiers, a bit of perspective is required here methinks.

Oh and Gordon should stick to the grafitti.
 
He deserves to be our number 1 and agree that his distribution (for us) appears to be based on team orders. i fully expect his distribution to improve when Pep gets players open and closer to him. I think we're on the same page about De Gea
 
I would fully agree that other England players deserve a kicking over the Euro fiasco other than our two players, 'Arry and Shrek both come to mind. However United played some of the poorest football I have seen from them in decades last season and they nearly stole P4 from us thanks to their keeper in large part. I would rate both De Gea and the Chelsea chappie an upgrade on JH with Hugo Lloris catching up fast as fourth best in the Prem. The Arsenal chappie is also still dam good, but getting on a tad now. I still think Pep will work on Joe and improve him and he will retain his City #1 spot between the sticks. As for his England status I think he is safe for now from competition.
 
Loyalty is a great thing , as long as it is not misplaced.

In the last 2/3 seasons , Joe has repeatedly made the same mistakes, near post , not clearing the lines, punching instead of catching. Pellers dropped him.

The change at the top will hopefully be the kick he needs to change his ways, if not , who knws
 
Every keeper has their flaws that are repeatedly exposed, that's why they're described as flaws.

Hart was amongst our most consistent performers this season.

De Gea, Lloris, Courtois all make just as many errors as Joe does.

Put simply, there's currently two keepers on the world stage that are ahead of the rest, Neuer and Buffon. There's a group just below them of top quality keepers that don't produce the same levels of consistency as them two and Hart, De Gea, Courtois etc are in that group.
 
I bet if you asked fans under the age of 30 who Gordon Banks is most wouldn't have a clue, just another bandwagon passenger.
 
I'll give you of a good keeper, one who made a HUGE error , but learnt from his mistake , and was only kept from more England caps by two of the greatest.

Joe Corrigan

Big enough in more than stature to admit his failing and get it right.

At that time, wit Shilts and Clemence , England had three of the four best keepers in the world .

Any takers for number four ?
 
:048: Will have to put my thinking cap on for that one.

Anyone else think that had Hart let in that shot from Eder last evening he would have been eviscerated by Shearer & co?

Shearer claimed that Lloris had "no chance" of saving Eder's shot from 25 yards.......I can't think Joe Hart would have been let off so lightly. It was well struck but you could bet your bottom dollar or Euro that they would have criticised his starting position or a step he took to the left etc etc :013:
 
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