Clemence is clueless | Vital Football

Clemence is clueless

T

Tony the gill

Vital Newbie
l am getting so frustrated the way the club is being run
we appear to be going backwards not like the free flowing football we were promised by Brad Gallison.
Clemence is out of his depth and constantly changes the team selection and doesn't achieve anything .
I know we have been unfortunate with injuries but that doesn't excuse some of Clemences team selections .
I will be amazed if we make the play offs and if we fall short l think it will be time for Clemence to go.
 
Clemence as far as I am aware has never coached below Championship level. Questions need to be asked then firstly whether he understands football at this level & secondly are L2 footballers technically able to implement his tactics?

As has been shown elsewhere, most recently at Millwall, there is a huge difference between being a training ground assistant & the head honcho.

Having seen him live at the Fans Forum he comes across as studious & rather introverted. Head coaches & managers tend to have big personalities.

For me the jury is out but personally I have a greater issue with the performance of the recruitment team who I think have more to answer for.

Out of his depth? Not sure. But in terms of results thus far no significant upgrade on Neil Harris.
 
Tony the gill said:
l am getting so frustrated the way the club is being run
we appear to be going backwards not like the free flowing football we were promised by Brad Gallison.
Click to expand...
IMO in everything but the team performances, the CLUB is being run in an excellent manner as opposed to the previous autocratic under investment.

If I was in BG's shoes, I would stick with the manager as long as they are still coming up with ideas, are still motivated and have a clear plan as to how things can improve.

He must know that at the moment the team has no fluency or consistency and must be having regular meetings with SC. I can always detect a kind of haunted look when nothing they do seems to be working and their time is up.
 
Clemence is on a learning curve, and he deserves a little understanding for that. He is making errors - for instance, rotating our squad when the fringe players are clearly not up to it. That's the sign of a coach who's used to having better players to work with!

BUT - the shape is much better, you can see a way of playing starting to emerge and we are definitely creating more. The big test comes in the summer, when he can offload the players who either aren't up to it or don't want to be there. There's still too much dead wood. After that, no excuses.
 
Last edited:
I’m starting to lose faith that we are going forwards (in any sense) on the pitch at the moment. First half yesterday was dire (again) slow, tedious, insipid stuff. So frustrated seeing us play around back to create space for a forward ball only for the defender in space to have sod all in front of them to pass to. We seem to play with a front 3/4 who play high and wide and a back six of 5+Coleman and there is nothing in between. Last night in the first half there was consistently enough space between the back six and the front 4 to build a row of terrace houses across the pitch, and watching them being built would be more exciting.

I have some sympathy for Clem I don’t think that’s what he wants, he was very vocal in the first half last night, but we lack the quality, fitness, pace and intelligence in midfield or up front to deliver anything better. Serious recruitment issues for the summer whatever division we are in.

If Charlton was the benchmark for Clemball, (there was movement, passion, neat, positive passing and a midfield) the last few home performances are significantly below par.

Give me some passion, give me some effort, give me some excitement.
 
Once again it is worth pointing out that just over a year ago we were virtually dead and buried as a football club. I was not renewing my season ticket, such was my loss of faith in the club.
Neil Harris was rescued by the Galinsons who upgraded the squad in time to survive. Brad then (to many fans surprise) upgraded the that manager to have his own man in and continue building the sustainable improvement to the club he had put £millions into. Clemence came in with a great coaching pedigree and Stockdale clearly a confident and likeable assistant.
The issue for fans is that the transition from Harris style (with Harris players) to Clemence style has not been A) Quickly implemented or B/ as thrilling to watch as fans demanded.
We have an issue with goal scoring that is getting better, but slowly, especially with our 2 attacking hopes for the 2nd half of the season both injured.
So to see us despite all that in the play off mix is, for me, encouraging.
To say Clemence is useless is just plain daft. When he does eventually move on, it will be to a team higher up the league than us.
Of course it would be gutting to not make the play offs this year but this club is miles better off than it was 13 months ago.
 
Tony the gill said:
l am getting so frustrated the way the club is being run
we appear to be going backwards not like the free flowing football we were promised by Brad Gallison.
Clemence is out of his depth and constantly changes the team selection and doesn't achieve anything .
I know we have been unfortunate with injuries but that doesn't excuse some of Clemences team selections .
I will be amazed if we make the play offs and if we fall short l think it will be time for Clemence to go.
Click to expand...

Who said that?
 
Vambogills said:
Once again it is worth pointing out that just over a year ago we were virtually dead and buried as a football club. I was not renewing my season ticket, such was my loss of faith in the club.
Neil Harris was rescued by the Galinsons who upgraded the squad in time to survive. Brad then (to many fans surprise) upgraded the that manager to have his own man in and continue building the sustainable improvement to the club he had put £millions into. Clemence came in with a great coaching pedigree and Stockdale clearly a confident and likeable assistant.
The issue for fans is that the transition from Harris style (with Harris players) to Clemence style has not been A) Quickly implemented or B/ as thrilling to watch as fans demanded.
We have an issue with goal scoring that is getting better, but slowly, especially with our 2 attacking hopes for the 2nd half of the season both injured.
So to see us despite all that in the play off mix is, for me, encouraging.
To say Clemence is useless is just plain daft. When he does eventually move on, it will be to a team higher up the league than us.
Of course it would be gutting to not make the play offs this year but this club is miles better off than it was 13 months ago.
Click to expand...

Hear hear

Somebody tell me again how it's the instant gratification-addled yoof who really support City who were calling for Harris's head.
 
NWBluesFan said:
This thread is so full of embarrassing takes, I can only assume it's a deliberate wind up.

Clemence has coached 17 league games and been at the club for less than 4 months.

Anyone calling for him to be sacked at this stage is the problem. Dunning-Kruger in British football in full effect.
Click to expand...
Thanks for a bit of sanity. Coaching takes more than a few days.Time some people gave the guy a break.
 
Last edited:
markinkent said:
Agreed that talk of sacking is crazy but worth remembering what Galinson said regarding his expectations of a clemence team "brave, courageous, takes risks, are front-footed, expansive, entertains and wins at the same time",

How many of those words do we currently tick off ?

Clemence has had one window, he will no doubt get a second but the current team are way behind the description of Galinsons expectations. At some point he will have to own that.
Click to expand...
I genuinely don’t think he’ll get a second window Mark unless things change.
The target was the playoffs at least.
IF we don’t finish top seven, he’ll be shown the door.
Personally I think we will and he’ll be given a grace period.
But, the results and performances must improve.
 
I personally don’t totally buy the argument that Clemence shouldn’t be judged or held to account because he’s “only had one window” or “they’re not his players”. A manager or coach with any gumption about them goes into a club and improves what’s already there. Harris came to us in L1 and improved us from where we were at the time he took over, they weren’t his players. Karl Robinson, who people laughed off coming here, has gone to Salford and I believe they’re unbeaten in his 8 games in charge, they’re not his players. There’s plenty of other instances too.

Personally I feel like if we finished 8th or 9th then he will get given more time and another window to improve things, however should we end the season really poorly and finish 13th/14th, then it’s naive to assume that the owners won’t be seriously considering their options for next season.
 
GillsFan22 said:
I personally don’t totally buy the argument that Clemence shouldn’t be judged or held to account because he’s “only had one window” or “they’re not his players”. A manager or coach with any gumption about them goes into a club and improves what’s already there. Harris came to us in L1 and improved us from where we were at the time he took over, they weren’t his players. Karl Robinson, who people laughed off coming here, has gone to Salford and I believe they’re unbeaten in his 8 games in charge, they’re not his players. There’s plenty of other instances too.

Personally I feel like if we finished 8th or 9th then he will get given more time and another window to improve things, however should we end the season really poorly and finish 13th/14th, then it’s naive to assume that the owners won’t be seriously considering their options for next season.
Click to expand...

You can polish a slow moving lazy turd as much as you like but at the end of the day it's still a turd.
 
Issues go back beyond when Clemence took over .If anyone is seriously suggesting that our lack of goals could be addressed by another change of management I think they are wrong.Recruitment in the summer was full of names but empty of goals .Given the vast majority of the budget was clearly spent that means wage wise we spent the wage money that would have gone to May had he signed.The only funds Clemence has has was from departures coming off the wage bill .We took a risk with Andrews I still believe that can pay dividends but we will have to be patient on that one . Hurtado was also a risk but is clearly a talent.Clemence could have come unstuck with any mobile clever player injury wise.We never spent any real funds in January the players are simply not available.Brad Galinson choose a long term route when he appointed SC . Coaching is a destination not a short term fix .
Harris's team was built on experience and more expensive experience.No movement no goals grinding out results might have been possible had May arrived but without Hawkins even that may well have failed and left us in a worse position.IE May on a big fat payday but with no service.
Rome wasn't built in a day .
 
He's had one window to change the squad, and he did. Everyone seemed to agree it was our forward line that was the issue, so what did the club do? Shifted out as much of the old unit as had takers, and brought in 3 new boys to try and change it.

If you honestly believe there's not been a change in style then to be honest you're blinded by either irrationality or booze, it's clear to see we're trying to play a different way, not always successfully. Trying to implement a total change in style mid-season is almost never going to bear fruit immediately, not with games every 3 or 4 days to contend with. There have been promising performances though - Colchester away was an excellent performance in the main, and had we not hit both posts during the game that would've been a comfortable win. Notts County was a different kind of game but we played to our strengths a bit more in that one and everything came together for us.

Transfer wise it's absolutely no-one connected with GFC's fault that perhaps the most exciting player we've seen in 5 years got assaulted by a couple of Swindon players because he was literally too good for them. That was a signing made by the much-maligned recruitment team that we were ALL positive about, but woe betide anyone actually getting any credit for that. That he's now injured, and just after the transfer window slammed shut to boot is frankly just rank bad luck.

Andrews is a younger, more mobile version of Hawkins who will be a huge asset for us when he gets up to speed - and we knew that he's one for the long-term when he signed. Do we honestly think Clemence WANTS to start games with the pairing we had last night? Strategically it was a decent call to stay in the game for as long as we could, then try to have a go in the final stages when we could get what limited use we could out of Hawkins. I'm sure he's not thrilled at the fact that of the three strikers signed in the window, two aren't currently available and Walker hasn't set anything on fire yet, but to suggest he isn't trying to change things around is just nonsense.

We're outside the play-offs on goal difference, and while it hasn't been great fun watching us in the main, we've as much of a chance as anyone of getting into them at this stage. I wonder if Clem will get any credit if we do.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.