D*rby to be relegated? | Page 76 | Vital Football

D*rby to be relegated?

Sanchez flores said:
I think because they have entered administration they have a stringent 2 year transfer embargo, so think it will be really hard for Derby to bounce back so quickly. More points at the start of next season is still a possibility too dependant on what deal they agree with creditors. Could legitimately start next year on -15.
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i was wondering about that, whether going into admin might mean that debts could actualy be paid off by the new owner and at least give them fpp freedom... What about parachute payments?
 
Will.NFFC said:
Sorry if I’m missing something, but I really don’t see why anybody would choose to buy to Derby in their current state?

They are basically now assured of relegation to the third tier, where there is less money. They don’t own the ground and I don’t believe that was part of any deal. Not sure what the training ground ownership situation is? They have very few assets in terms of squad and clearly not many off the pitch. They’re what is it, £40/£50m in debt?

Their latest set of accounts are apparently looking poor as well.

If you’re an owner with the money to take that debt on, build the playing staff back up and do it in league one, why on earth would you not look to buy a healthier club that’s more sustainable financially in a better league?

Yes they have a decent history and fan base and possibly better revenue streams… but is that really a enough given the issues?
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I agree, it seems crazy...
Hmm, you know what, the Pies are only 2 leagues below them and have a half decent stadium. How much do you think they could cost to buy? Theres a few angles to play on our clubs history after all, I could see a story there, trying to chase us down kinda thing
 
paz1967 said:
i was wondering about that, whether going into admin might mean that debts could actualy be paid off by the new owner and at least give them fpp freedom... What about parachute payments?
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No paz it just means they will exit under a strict embargo that will be in place for 2 years as they slowly rebuild. They really have to get the deal done before January because if they lose all the current first team players the hole just keeps getting bigger.

Can see us nabbing Buchanan if it is not sorted. They currently cannot trigger his year extension as it is on more than the 4.5k they are allowed to pay.
 
Basha73 said:
They probably won’t ‘punish’ the new owners with a points penalty but not being able to spend because of FFP will be punishment enough as they will have an entertaining time trying to bring players in.

As for a wage cap, the leagues scrapped the £2.5m wage cap in February as it was too much of a ‘one size fits all’.

https://www.skysports.com/amp/footb...withdrawn-following-arbitration-panel-verdict

The SCMP regulations that were reinstated limit wages to 60% of turnover which Derby could have fun with.
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Yes, but turnover will drop significantly.

Income from TV and broadcasting will all but disappear, solidarity/royalty payments (or whatever they are called) from the EFL will fall to 25% of that in the Championship, sponsorship will take a hit; you could be looking at a 9m/10m reduction in income.

That will bring their income down to around 20m and 60% of that is a 12m wage limit.

That may be high for the division but it still means they have to offload players
 
Sanchez flores said:
No paz it just means they will exit under a strict embargo that will be in place for 2 years as they slowly rebuild. They really have to get the deal done before January because if they lose all the current first team players the hole just keeps getting bigger.

Can see us nabbing Buchanan if it is not sorted. They currently cannot trigger his year extension as it is on more than the 4.5k they are allowed to pay.
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Are you sure about the two year embargo?

I cannot find any reference to it in the rules.

You do realise that the 4,5k figure is not set in stone; the limits on what they can pay a new signing is determined by the severity of the embargo; Derby fell foul on a number of issues, hence the severe punishment; Reading only breached the one rule - they had a limit of 9k imposed with their embargo.

If Derby end up with the two year embargo you allude to, it will be on different terms to the current one - they will have cleared all of the issues relating to outstanding accounts (they will be a new Company), and money owed to HMRC - they will probably start with a 9 or 10k wage limit.

They should be able to trigger the extension on Buchanan's contract as it is an existing deal; what the will not be able to do is offer him a new contract on the terms he will want if the bit about the embargo is correct - that means they will have to sell him.
 
mao tse tung said:
Yes, but turnover will drop significantly.

Income from TV and broadcasting will all but disappear, solidarity/royalty payments (or whatever they are called) from the EFL will fall to 25% of that in the Championship, sponsorship will take a hit; you could be looking at a 9m/10m reduction in income.

That will bring their income down to around 20m and 60% of that is a 12m wage limit.

That may be high for the division but it still means they have to offload players
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Oh definitely and although they have a small squad, some of them will be on decent wages which will hinder them further.

You only have to look at Sunderland’s struggles to see what can happen.
 
radfordinlondon said:
Would imagine they cant afford to exercise it. Even if they do he may fuck off anyway being forced to play in L1
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They will be able to, he's a more saleable asset and better to keep than those running down contracts & older players.

He'll also be put under pressure to help Derby out by doing so, as that will generate a better transfer fee.
 
mao tse tung said:
Are you sure about the two year embargo?

I cannot find any reference to it in the rules.

You do realise that the 4,5k figure is not set in stone; the limits on what they can pay a new signing is determined by the severity of the embargo; Derby fell foul on a number of issues, hence the severe punishment; Reading only breached the one rule - they had a limit of 9k imposed with their embargo.

If Derby end up with the two year embargo you allude to, it will be on different terms to the current one - they will have cleared all of the issues relating to outstanding accounts (they will be a new Company), and money owed to HMRC - they will probably start with a 9 or 10k wage limit.

They should be able to trigger the extension on Buchanan's contract as it is an existing deal; what the will not be able to do is offer him a new contract on the terms he will want if the bit about the embargo is correct - that means they will have to sell him.
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Exactly - it's a pre-existing contract signed before this situation arose and there is also the fact that he is a more saleable asset, with a contract - they will be able to extend the contract, if it hasn't already been done OR was 'in transit'.

It is no real hardship for Lee, continues to play, on a good wage - but, he will be helping Derby, where he's been since a kid and who gave him his opportunity - it's no all about money, there's some emotional pressure involved!
 
Basha73 said:
Oh definitely and although they have a small squad, some of them will be on decent wages which will hinder them further.

You only have to look at Sunderland’s struggles to see what can happen.
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Derby have a fantastic academy & production like, like ourselves - but they still need experience. What will hurt more is if Jagielka, Baldock, Morrison, Kazim all decided to go - they may well be in their twilight footballing years, but they could be crucial in L1!
 
Our Kids Dad said:
Derby have a fantastic academy & production like, like ourselves - but they still need experience. What will hurt more is if Jagielka, Baldock, Morrison, Kazim all decided to go - they may well be in their twilight footballing years, but they could be crucial in L1!
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A lot will depend on how many of them will be happy to ply their trade in league one and possibly take a pay cut too.

If they are very, very lucky they will bounce back at the first attempt and with a decent, young and hungry squad. More likely though they will be stuck down there for a good three or four years.
 
Our Kids Dad said:
They will be able to, he's a more saleable asset and better to keep than those running down contracts & older players.

He'll also be put under pressure to help Derby out by doing so, as that will generate a better transfer fee.
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The maximum they can gain is a year. Will his value rise in L1? Depends on how the player has been managed but not getting paid, putting his progression on hold for someone who took the piss, none of that is likely to motivate him to stay.

Enforce the extension and they might get an artur situation.
 
radfordinlondon said:
The maximum they can gain is a year. Will his value rise in L1? Depends on how the player has been managed but not getting paid, putting his progression on hold for someone who took the piss, none of that is likely to motivate him to stay.

Enforce the extension and they might get an artur situation.
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He will be sold in January in all likelihood, and if not without question this summer
 
Think we need to make a reall push for the play offs this season, could you imagine their joy if we went up as they went down.
 
Apollyon said:
I think Buchanon will sign in January, for probably half what we offered.

Might as well offer a tenner for that yosspot Lawrence as well, just to annoy them
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1) Would Buchanan come to play second fiddle to Lowe?

2) We don't need that coward Lawrence anywhere near our club.
 
ZedRed said:
1) Would Buchanan come to play second fiddle to Lowe?

2) We don't need that coward Lawrence anywhere near our club.
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Buchanan looks to be good enough to battle with Lowe for the starting spot. Having them both would be good for competition.
 
Apollyon said:
Lowe is temporary and we need competition there.

I would sign Lawrence. His deal ends in the summer and although a ****, he can play in 3/4 positions. He's arguably better than Lolley
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On ability it would be a no brainer to sign him, but when taking his perceived character into account I don't know whether we would want him in our dressing room
 
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