"I'm hopeful it's the former but it's a question any opponent will now be giving our centre-halves plenty of opportunities to answer." - HAVE A READ! | Vital Football

"I'm hopeful it's the former but it's a question any opponent will now be giving our centre-halves plenty of opportunities to answer." - HAVE A READ!

Jules

Jules

Website Owner
Staff member
We really do need to ensure we can do the simple defending correctly. There's no point in having wonderful ball-playing centre-backs if they are unable to head away a simple corner, surely?
 
Rob the Imp said:
We really do need to ensure we can do the simple defending correctly. There's no point in having wonderful ball-playing centre-backs if they are unable to head away a simple corner, surely?
Click to expand...

It's a good point well-made. We may not concede from fucking about at the back but we will then concede because not conceding from fucking about at the back means we can't defend basic set-pieces.

It's almost as if fucking about at the back is always a really bad idea.
 
NottyImp said:
It's a good point well-made. We may not concede from fucking about at the back but we will then concede because not conceding from fucking about at the back means we can't defend basic set-pieces.

It's almost as if fucking about at the back is always a really bad idea.
Click to expand...
Exactly. I presume the intended benefit of playing out from the back is to retain possession (rather than lump it upfield where either side could then claim the ball), but that is only worth it if we do actually retain possession. If not, we're just giving the ball away close to goal, with inevitable dangers. Do it well and you're fine. Much like most of football I suppose!
 
I'm with KA: play football in the final third.

The one thing I want from defenders is, er, the ability to defend.
 
NottyImp said:
I'm with KA: play football in the final third.

The one thing I want from defenders is, er, the ability to defend.
Click to expand...
NottyImp said:
I'm with KA: play football in the final third.

The one thing I want from defenders is, er, the ability to defend.
Click to expand...
In fairness both goals ( and it is only 2 without a league game being played ) were similar ie headers , so we cant be accused of messing about . I wonder if the goalkeeper should have got them, if so we can hope that it will be cured when he gets to play with the defence , although 2 goalkeepers were involved , so it could be work in progess Its early days yet and I am confident that MA will work on it .
Dont panic Mr Mainwaring !
 
Mr Chad said:
In fairness both goals ( and it is only 2 without a league game being played ) were similar ie headers , so we cant be accused of messing about . I wonder if the goalkeeper should have got them, if so we can hope that it will be cured when he gets to play with the defence , although 2 goalkeepers were involved , so it could be work in progess Its early days yet and I am confident that MA will work on it .
Dont panic Mr Mainwaring !
Click to expand...

My point is that defenders who are comfortable on the ball - at L1 level - may not be terribly competent at actually defending.

So fucking about at the back costs you goals either way. You either have competent defenders who don't have great ball-skills or ball-players who aren't competent defenders.

We shall see. I am yet to be convinced by MA's defensive strategy.
 
Mr Chad said:
In fairness both goals ( and it is only 2 without a league game being played ) were similar ie headers , so we cant be accused of messing about . I wonder if the goalkeeper should have got them, if so we can hope that it will be cured when he gets to play with the defence , although 2 goalkeepers were involved , so it could be work in progess Its early days yet and I am confident that MA will work on it .
Dont panic Mr Mainwaring !
Click to expand...

Alex Palmer was the GK for both headed goals
 
The problem with just clearing your lines is it gets harder to get the ball back, the further up the leagues you go.

Playing out from the back is a good thing, if done successfully.

So far this season we have been pretty successful at it.

The method means you have more possession and the opposition have to work harder to get the ball. It may not be a coincidence both our recent opponents tired as the game went on. Scunthorpe hardly had a kick second half.

The issue to me is this.

Assuming our centre backs are in the same price bracket as Bolger, Bostwick etc
Have we had to acquire players that can't deal with regulation crosses, as the trade off for them being able to play out from the back.

My assumption is a qualified no.

I think their is an amount of organisation and understanding that needs to be sorted out.
Any self respecting defender should be be able to deal with the crosses we have allowed to be converted into goals.

There will however be some trade off between defensive ability and ball playing skill, I would have thought.

For instance if Walsh is say 30% better at retaining possession than Bolger, it's not unreasonable to think we would have 10% less defending to do.

So if Walsh is 5% less effective a defender than Bolger overall Walsh would improve the team.
 
Last edited:
As well as conceding two similar unmarked headed goals on the edge of the six yard area, didn’t Crewe miss a couple of headers in the first half in a similar situation. ?
 
NottyImp said:
Both goals from undefended headers 6 yards out. You don't blame a 'keeper for those.
Click to expand...
Surely the keeper should be going for a cross that close to his line? Something Palmer and the defence will hopefully sort out with more practice as a unit.
 
NottyImp said:
Both goals from undefended headers 6 yards out. You don't blame a 'keeper for those.
Click to expand...
I'm not so sure. Shilton used to say anything up to the penalty spot was his.

The modern tendency seems to be to stay on the line and let the defenders deal with anything else. I can't say I agree with that, but I'm a bit old-fashioned with these things.
 
Scotimp said:
I'm not so sure. Shilton used to say anything up to the penalty spot was his.

The modern tendency seems to be to stay on the line and let the defenders deal with anything else. I can't say I agree with that, but I'm a bit old-fashioned with these things.
Click to expand...

I can't recall a recent Lincoln 'keeper who would have gone for either ball, tbh. As you say, it's very much the modern fashion not to, so I'm not sure Palmer can be blamed for that.

Would Farman or Vickers have come out for those balls? I doubt it very much.
 
maybe that is an issue with farman and vickers (but hopefully not with palmer once things are sorted - he has only played 2 games, with 2 different back fours after all). i am sure we will see L1 keepers coming and catching crosses on the six yard line this season. Marriott was another example of a line keeper, but it worked because that was balanced by having 3 centre backs in front of him, and one of those was futcher... who would head everything away.
 
Either way, with no shout from the 'keeper, I'd want our CBs to be getting a challenge in, at least. Free headers are much easier to score than those under pressure, after all.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.