Brexit rolls on... | Page 37 | Vital Football

Brexit rolls on...

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I'm alright Jack, been saving and working all my life. Am I sitting on a financial nest egg to right I am. 75 yrs of age still going strong. Normally 3 or 4 worldwide holidays per annum, new car bought and paid for in March only done 535 miles since buying it.
You wonder why I voted tory look at above points I made. I am what I am today because I worked for it and No bleeding leftee is telling me that I am in the wrong because of it. If you want something in life get off your arse and work for it. End of rant, sorry for rant? not at all.
 
The Poacher said:
I'm alright Jack, been saving and working all my life. Am I sitting on a financial nest egg to right I am. 75 yrs of age still going strong. Normally 3 or 4 worldwide holidays per annum, new car bought and paid for in March only done 535 miles since buying it.
You wonder why I voted tory look at above points I made. I am what I am today because I worked for it and No bleeding leftee is telling me that I am in the wrong because of it. If you want something in life get off your arse and work for it. End of rant, sorry for rant? not at all.
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That's alot of good luck you seem to have had there, good on you :)
 
JC21 said:
Nothing ridiculous about that, duck. The only ridiculous thing is when people claim to be socialists and then support the EU (not implying anyone on here fits that bill by the way)
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Tories simply have never been about equality and ridiculous to suggest it, particularly after a recent austerity decade. No rational voter believes that.

The EU has brought more equality from day one and still do. Tho no-one suggests its perfect. Can you really imagine EU all as independants this last 50 years of relative stability, no wars, no major poverty?

Socialism isn't what its about either, simply empathy and common sense. The 2 fundamental differences in comparison to Tories
 
The Poacher said:
I'm alright Jack, been saving and working all my life. Am I sitting on a financial nest egg to right I am. 75 yrs of age still going strong. Normally 3 or 4 worldwide holidays per annum, new car bought and paid for in March only done 535 miles since buying it.
You wonder why I voted tory look at above points I made. I am what I am today because I worked for it and No bleeding leftee is telling me that I am in the wrong because of it. If you want something in life get off your arse and work for it. End of rant, sorry for rant? not at all.
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The issue the "lefties" are most bothered about is that a 20 year old now could work just as hard as you have for their entire life, make all the same good decisions you did... And end up with about 25-50% (at best) of what you have when they reach 75.

The refusal of people like yourself to acknowledge this, or care, is what causes generational conflict from their side. It is the assumption by certain people of your generation (you clearly included) that you are somehow special, that you have worked harder than other generations and consequently deserve more, that it is all your own work.

As if he generations before yours who didn't get to enjoy your kind of retirement didn't work as hard. I doubt you would have the gumption to say that, but you would about the younger generations.

Do you not think that people of your generations should work towards and show an interest in ensuring that a young person who makes all the same decisions as you and works as hard as you did will get the same benefits at the end?

If your immediate thought is "no" then congratulations; you've just discovered what "ok boomer" is all about
 
I think that it's not just what you earn, but how you spend it. Recently retired, I've never earned anything like the money that, say, a teacher would be on.
Forty odd years ago, when I got married we saved for a few years for a deposit on a house and made do with bits of furniture that was second hand. Whenever we had anything it was because we grafted for it. Seven days a week and the wife working in a care home whilst I looked after our son in the evening.
Anyone who suggests that the boomer generation have somehow had it easy is obviously delusional.
 
The Poacher said:
I'm alright Jack, been saving and working all my life. Am I sitting on a financial nest egg to right I am. 75 yrs of age still going strong. Normally 3 or 4 worldwide holidays per annum, new car bought and paid for in March only done 535 miles since buying it.
You wonder why I voted tory look at above points I made. I am what I am today because I worked for it and No bleeding leftee is telling me that I am in the wrong because of it. If you want something in life get off your arse and work for it. End of rant, sorry for rant? not at all.
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Ee by gum! This is disappointing. I always pictured you as a bit of a man of the country something of a Daniel Hagman in the Sharpe series; hunting on the masters land in the dead of night or performing heroically as a marksman in the Iberian peninsula. Here you are now, proud to be cooking an egg on the stove before the wife gets home. Sigh...
 
Pope John XXIII said:
The issue the "lefties" are most bothered about is that a 20 year old now could work just as hard as you have for their entire life, make all the same good decisions you did... And end up with about 25-50% (at best) of what you have when they reach 75.

The refusal of people like yourself to acknowledge this, or care, is what causes generational conflict from their side.
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Where do you get the "fact" that anyone who is 20 now will only end up with 25% of what my generation has got. That's ridiculous . After working for 40 years I've got a mortgage free house. Any couple earning an average £25k each (or far less) could afford a house like mine, and have just as much as me in 40 years time. Should I be moaning that the people who retired 10 or 15 years before me are better off ? Pensions have reduced because people live longer. Interest rates have fallen too. Since the crash we have had 10 years in which wages have struggled, but people now (pre-covid) are far better off than we were when I got married 40 years ago.

I started off in a house with second hand furniture, no tv phone etc. My kids are beyond their 20s now, but have far more than we did at the same age.
 
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Lienking said:
Where do you get the "fact" that anyone who is 20 now will only end up with 20% of what my generation has got. That's ridiculous . After working for 40 years I've got a mortgage free house. Any couple earning an average £25k each (or far less) could afford a house like mine, and have just as much as me in 40 years time. Should I be moaning that the people who retired 10 or 15 years before me are better off ? Pensions have reduced because people live longer. Interest rates have fallen too. Since the crash we have had 10 years in which wages have struggled, but people now (pre-covid) are far better off than we were when I got married 40 years ago.

I started off in a house with second hand furniture, no tv phone etc. My kids are beyond their 20s now, but have far more than we did at the same age.
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You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about
 
You are saying that the modern generation will end up 75-50 % worse off . "will only have 25-50%. I was born in the 50s, and wages have nearly doubled since then.

Those born in the 1930s had an annual income of just under £11,000 at age 30, rising to £13,000 for those born in the 1940s, £16,000 for those born in the 1950s, almost £21,500 for those born in the 1960s and rising sharply to £28,831 for those born in the 1970s.
For those born in the early 1980s, however, it falls to £27,884 at age 30. “Digging into the data more deeply, this trend is broadly the result of lower pay for those in employment dragging down average incomes,” said Mr Cribb.
Those born in the 1980s are also 20 per cent, or £11,000 less wealthy than those born in the 1970s. This derives from lower home ownership with only 40 per cent of the 1980s’ children owning one, compared with 55 per cent of those born in the 1970s, and 60 per cent of those born in the 1960s.

Because of automatic pension enrolment, 80 per cent of those born in the 1980s are, however, already saving into pensions in their early 30s compared with only 50 per cent of the 1970s’ children.
“The other silver lining for wealth of the younger generation is that much of the wealth accumulated by those born in the 1950s and 1960s could be passed down to younger generations,” said Mr Cribb.
 
flipleflem said:
I think that it's not just what you earn, but how you spend it. Recently retired, I've never earned anything like the money that, say, a teacher would be on.
Forty odd years ago, when I got married we saved for a few years for a deposit on a house and made do with bits of furniture that was second hand. Whenever we had anything it was because we grafted for it. Seven days a week and the wife working in a care home whilst I looked after our son in the evening.
Anyone who suggests that the boomer generation have somehow had it easy is obviously delusional.
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You have. You simply have. You never had to pay £700 a month in rent either, or £130 a month just got gas and electric. You worked in places with hundreds of other people, bountiful employment. You may have worked similar hours, but it wasn't common for you to have to do the job of 2 or 3 people because of cutbacks.

Nobody touched your pension, and while the generation that fought the war retired to pension that forced them to choose between eating and heating, you retired to a triple lock that costs every other generation billions.

I admit, the education you guys got was absolute dogshit if you didn't pass the 11+. You absolutely have my sympathy there

The prospects for the young people I teach are very worrying. The cost of living now is incomparable now.

Two people have waxed lyrical about using second hand furniture. Do you think that doesn't happen now? We bought out first new sofa in our early 30s on an offer; I look around the room I'm in now and I see a big Oak dining table bought from a charity (the Betels); no idea how many owners, its extremely old; I see a TV stand that is from the same charity. In fact, most of the furniture is second hand from the same charity.

We have new beds, that's it. Everything else is second hand or more.
 
Lienking said:
You are saying that the modern generation will end up 75-50 % worse off . "will only have 25-50%. I was born in the 50s, and wages have nearly doubled since then.

Those born in the 1930s had an annual income of just under £11,000 at age 30, rising to £13,000 for those born in the 1940s, £16,000 for those born in the 1950s, almost £21,500 for those born in the 1960s and rising sharply to £28,831 for those born in the 1970s.
For those born in the early 1980s, however, it falls to £27,884 at age 30. “Digging into the data more deeply, this trend is broadly the result of lower pay for those in employment dragging down average incomes,” said Mr Cribb.
Those born in the 1980s are also 20 per cent, or £11,000 less wealthy than those born in the 1970s. This derives from lower home ownership with only 40 per cent of the 1980s’ children owning one, compared with 55 per cent of those born in the 1970s, and 60 per cent of those born in the 1960s.

Because of automatic pension enrolment, 80 per cent of those born in the 1980s are, however, already saving into pensions in their early 30s compared with only 50 per cent of the 1970s’ children.
“The other silver lining for wealth of the younger generation is that much of the wealth accumulated by those born in the 1950s and 1960s could be passed down to younger generations,” said Mr Cribb.
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I may have overestimated the percentage, but your post helpfully backs up what I was saying.

Of course, there are two aspects to wealth; income and outgoings. The cost of living has risen exponentially just in my lifetime, while income has risen more modestly before falling. Worth pointing out that income in Nottingham is particularly low.

Take one small example; when I went to uni my room cost £35 a week, all bills included. This was early 00's. I was talking to a former student a few months ago who has gone to Oxford; their rent is around £800 a month; significantly more than my mortgage.

Almost everything; gas, electric, council rates, water and insurance are all (I believe) significantly higher relatively compared with when you were my age.

Then there are the other utilities that are essentials now that didn't exist then. Yes, you can forgo Netflix and sky, but broadband is an essential now, as is a mobile phone. You would struggle to even apply for a job without these. Those two between them will be £30-50 p/m minimum.

How much were your teaching union fees? Mine are nearly £30 a month.

How much did you pay for university? I know you put yourself through some courses, well done; but how much? Was it 10% of your above average wages for 30 years?
 
Pope John XXIII said:
You have. You simply have. You never had to pay £700 a month in rent either, or £130 a month just got gas and electric. You worked in places with hundreds of other people, bountiful employment. You may have worked similar hours, but it wasn't common for you to have to do the job of 2 or 3 people because of cutbacks.

Nobody touched your pension, and while the generation that fought the war retired to pension that forced them to choose between eating and heating, you retired to a triple lock that costs every other generation billions.

I admit, the education you guys got was absolute dogshit if you didn't pass the 11+. You absolutely have my sympathy there

The prospects for the young people I teach are very worrying. The cost of living now is incomparable now.

Two people have waxed lyrical about using second hand furniture. Do you think that doesn't happen now? We bought out first new sofa in our early 30s on an offer; I look around the room I'm in now and I see a big Oak dining table bought from a charity (the Betels); no idea how many owners, its extremely old; I see a TV stand that is from the same charity. In fact, most of the furniture is second hand from the same charity.

We have new beds, that's it. Everything else is second hand or more.
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You really do live in cloud cuckooland. I qualified as a teacher in 1976. When I left my PGCE course they were making teachers redundant. There were virtually no teaching jobs, and virtually no one on my course got a job in teaching. Unemployment rates in the 1980s reached 12% . Jobs were not "bountiful". Of course the pay rates are adjusted for the cost of living. My dad earned less than £1000 a year , nowhere near the quoted figures in the tens of thousands.
 
Lienking said:
When it comes to numbers I spent 40 years working as a qualified accountant . You are saying that 20 year old will have a reduction of 75% in their wealth. It's pretty clear who is talking rubbish.
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My parents bought their first house in 1971 for £7500 on an annual income of approx £10k.

In 1981 they sold that house for £25k and bought the house they are in now for £36k. They were on approx £20k.

That house is now worth over £300k.

The house I am in now cost over £120k. I am lucky that it cost that little and that I am part of a £60k household but look back through those figures and spot the trend.

House prices are bonkers and people in their 20s don’t have a prayer. And that’s before having to think about pensions, private healthcare etc because these things are no longer guaranteed.

Everyone thinks their generation had it toughest and everyone can point to something to support their argument but I know I would rather be in my parents position rather than that of my wife’s kids who are in their 20s.
 
Lienking said:
You really do live in cloud cuckooland. I qualified as a teacher in 1976. When I left my PGCE course they were making teachers redundant. There were virtually no teaching jobs, and virtually no one on my course got a job in teaching. Unemployment rates in the 1980s reached 12% . Jobs were not "bountiful". Of course the pay rates are adjusted for the cost of living. My dad earned less than £1000 a year , nowhere near the quoted figures in the tens of thousands.
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I wasn't talking about the 1980s specifically; why are you? I wasn't talking about teaching specifically; why are you so obsessed with it?

You have ignored every point I actually made and strolled down your own cul de sac
 
Pope John XXIII said:
I may have overestimated the percentage, but your post helpfully backs up what I was saying.

Of course, there are two aspects to wealth; income and outgoings. The cost of living has risen exponentially just in my lifetime, while income has risen more modestly before falling. Worth pointing out that income in Nottingham is particularly low.

Take one small example; when I went to uni my room cost £35 a week, all bills included. This was early 00's. I was talking to a former student a few months ago who has gone to Oxford; their rent is around £800 a month; significantly more than my mortgage.

Almost everything; gas, electric, council rates, water and insurance are all (I believe) significantly higher relatively compared with when you were my age.

Then there are the other utilities that are essentials now that didn't exist then. Yes, you can forgo Netflix and sky, but broadband is an essential now, as is a mobile phone. You would struggle to even apply for a job without these. Those two between them will be £30-50 p/m minimum.

How much were your teaching union fees? Mine are nearly £30 a month.

How much did you pay for university? I know you put yourself through some courses, well done; but how much? Was it 10% of your above average wages for 30 years?
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As I've already said the pay rates at 30 are clearly already adjusted for cost of living/RPI or something similar. There has been a slight decline in pay over the last 10 years, but still clearly double what it used to be.
 
Lienking said:
As I've already said the pay rates at 30 are clearly already adjusted for cost of living/RPI or something similar. There has been a slight decline in pay over the last 10 years, but still clearly double what it used to be.
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And yet house prices are how many times higher? Or are you just going to ignore that bit as it doesn’t suit your argument...?
 
Pope John XXIII said:
I wasn't talking about the 1980s specifically; why are you? I wasn't talking about teaching specifically; why are you so obsessed with it?

You have ignored every point I actually made and strolled down your own cul de sac
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I haven't ignored anything you said. You stated that throughout our lives jobs have been "bountiful" - your word not mine. I left teachers training college in June 1976 and spent 6 months unemployed as there were no teaching jobs, and very few others. The unemployment rate in the 80s reached 12% which is probably higher than it will be post covid. You have read a few books and think we were all guaranteed jobs for life. After 4 years at Uni/ teachers training college, I got a job as a clerk. I then spent 4 years of my own time, and at my own expense doing an accountancy course, having to work my way up from the bottom. Most of my 40 plus years working was in industry. On 4 occasions I have been made redundant because the companies relocated work to Asia,Scotland etc. Hardly the guaranteed jobs for life that you seem to think we all had.
 
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