Points Needed for Safety

[king_dezeeuw06]

I slightly disagree. Saturday there appeared to be a far more conscious effort to progress the ball forward and get players in a more forward position. The three defenders and a goalkeeper in the box at every goal kick seemed to predominantly disappear too. That tactic ensured it was passed across the back as that’s what they’d practiced and been instructed to do.

I think you are Runcorn are both right.

Normally we do go backwards and sideways because there are no forward options.

But on Saturday there was an obvious concerted effort to create those options and be more direct (not in a long ball sense).

It was less 'patient' and more 'make it happen' and it was much better.

As i said in other threads we often don't do the fundamentals on and off the ball needed to play this style of football but on Saturday we did them and it made it all click.

Players form will always go up and down but the level of movement, pressing, urgency, tempo etc from the Peterborough game are more down to working hard and getting organised on the training ground so we need to start to see that every game. If we do then performances and results will follow.

 

[moonay]

Basically, we're starting to get better at what we've been trying to do all season. They needed time, that's all.

As for this season, though I obviously want us to do well for the remainder of the season, but I'd prefer for us to miss out in the play-offs (although being fewer than 8 points off them would be nice).

The first "Talal" season (following admin) when we won the league proved to be a step too far, too quickly. We'd recruited too many players who weren't quite up to the mark ... and of course, we'd lost all our best academy players.

We all know that the end of this season means we have a fairly big turnover in personnel, and buying (and blooding in) players at League 1 level will likely be a more straightforward task than it would be if were were trying to staff a Championship squad.

Let's push for the promotion next season.

 

[runcornfan1978]

I slightly disagree. Saturday there appeared to be a far more conscious effort to progress the ball forward and get players in a more forward position. The three defenders and a goalkeeper in the box at every goal kick seemed to predominantly disappear too. That tactic ensured it was passed across the back as that’s what they’d practiced and been instructed to do.

All being well we will start to see what you posted in your last sentence & practice will make perfect. But I still think we'll have to agree to disagree with regards the backwards & sideways passing.

 

[runcornfan1978]

Let's push for the promotion next season.

I don't think we'll be ready for promotion next season (unless it all goes tits up & we end up in league 2 . I think we need to steadily build next season then look at the season after perhaps.

 

[moonay]

I don't think we'll be ready for promotion next season (unless it all goes tits up & we end up in league 2 . I think we need to steadily build next season then look at the season after perhaps.

I didn't say (and I'm not presuming that) we'll be ready next season ... just that we'll be better prepared for it.

Given what we've done this season, with what we had/got, then the play offs are a definite (minimum aim) for next season, simply as a continuation of our development.

 

[runcornfan1978]

Apologies if I came across as argumentative as that wasn't the case. You stated "let's push for the promotion next season." I agree with your comment that we will be better prepared for it.

However, I personally don't think we'll be ready for promotion next season - just yet! But I have a feeling we'll definitely be in the top half, just outside the play-offs, or actually in the play-offs. And again, I agree with you on that one as a continuation of our development.

 

[moonay]

That's OK Runcorn, I didn't think you were being argumentative ... and even if you were, that'd be fine ... it's s discussion forum.

My comments were (partly in response to KDZ's comments re the possibility of reaching a play off spot this season) really just saying that this probably wouldn't be a good thing. Next season, we'll be better prepared for it, but even then, (as you say) we may still be not quite ready.

3 seasons without a promotion or relegation ... what the hell is this club coming to?!

 

[runcornfan1978]

3 seasons without a promotion or relegation ... what the hell is this club coming to?!

Bloody rubbish Wigan!! But it'll be a bit like the old days at Springfield Park pre Whelan (minus Larry Lloyd promotion).

 

[gazlatic]

We have Played 30 games and got 37 pts

How many Points do we need to Avoid Relegation.?

As a rule in a 24 team league 50 points is the point where you tend to be safe.

4 more wins will effectively get us there.

Plus, remember our position. 11 teams are below us, for any one of those to overtake us by the end of the season they need to take points off others below us, pushing us further to safety without even considering our results.

 

[Frank Bullitt]

As a rule in a 24 team league 50 points is the point where you tend to be safe.

4 more wins will effectively get us there.

Plus, remember our position. 11 teams are below us, for any one of those to overtake us by the end of the season they need to take points off others below us, pushing us further to safety without even considering our results.

Looked at the league table today to see where we would be if we beat Exeter providing other results go our way.

The aim should be to finish in or at least close to the top six not finishing just above bottom four, think positive!

 

[pie eater]

Points total to finish 5th bottom, going back 10 years is 46, 40, 47, 50, 51, 50, 47, 50, 48. I ignored 19/20 as the season was curtailed.

Interestingly, when 50 or above was needed, there were at least two sides in the bottom 4 that were one win from staying up, so there is a trend with the more sides cut adrift, the less points are required. It looks like three are already cut adrift, so the omens look towards survival with less than 50 points.

That said, as the points haul thus far equates to 9th spot, relegation is out of the question and Wigan should be beyond 50 points by Good Friday at the absolute latest.

 

[king_dezeeuw06]

Looked at the league table today to see where we would be if we beat Exeter providing other results go our way.

The aim should be to finish in or at least close to the top six not finishing just above bottom four, think positive!

If we had no ownership and disruption to our preparation or recruitment we should've been aiming for the automatics.

But we obviously did so we had to lower expectations but I still think top 6 was achievable with the squad if we didn't have the points deduction.

So my personal view has been we should be aiming to finish within 8 points of the last play off place.

If we only manage to scrape survival we'll have had a very poor season with the players we have.

 

[Cueball]

As a rule in a 24 team league 50 points is the point where you tend to be safe.

4 more wins will effectively get us there.

Plus, remember our position. 11 teams are below us, for any one of those to overtake us by the end of the season they need to take points off others below us, pushing us further to safety without even considering our results.

Our goal difference is also worth an extra point over those clubs around and below us.

 

[runcornfan1978]

If we had no ownership and disruption to our preparation or recruitment we should've been aiming for the automatics.

But we obviously did so we had to lower expectations but I still think top 6 was achievable with the squad if we didn't have the points deduction.

So my personal view has been we should be aiming to finish within 8 points of the last play off place.

If we only manage to scrape survival we'll have had a very poor season with the players we have.

Sorry KDZ, but the goal this season was to STAY in this league given the turmoil the club has gone through. Staying up will be mission accomplished, even if it means finishing one place above the drop zone. Finishing in mid table or just outside the top 10 will be dreamland.

It is going to take about 2 - 3 seasons to get this club back on its feet. So I feel that yourself & a few others are going to be disappointed with the next season or 2.

 

[king_dezeeuw06]

Sorry KDZ, but the goal this season was to STAY in this league given the turmoil the club has gone through. Staying up will be mission accomplished, even if it means finishing one place above the drop zone. Finishing in mid table or just outside the top 10 will be dreamland.

It is going to take about 2 - 3 seasons to get this club back on its feet. So I feel that yourself & a few others are going to be disappointed with the next season or 2.

Even with the disruption we recruited very well and were left with a lot of players who are very good at this level. This is a strong L1 squad with a good number of players who'd walk into most sides in the league and one of the bigger wage budget than most - even after the departures.

We've seen what we are capable of this season against the top sides on occasion, our issue has been not doing ourself justice against the weaker sides. Even when we've played the top sides we've not seen miles more talented players than ours.

League 1 generally not strong, especially outside the top 6 to 8 and what happened in the summer doesn't make the players any less when they are lining up on the field. What's happened was always going to likely stop us getting in the play offs but it shouldn't have made us finish anywhere near the bottom unless we've significantly under performed.

 

[Jonnysking]

Even with the disruption we recruited very well and were left with a lot of players who are very good at this level. This is a strong L1 squad with a good number of players who'd walk into most sides in the league and one of the bigger wage budget than most - even after the departures.

We've seen what we are capable of this season against the top sides on occasion, our issue has been not doing ourself justice against the weaker sides. Even when we've played the top sides we've not seen miles more talented players than ours.

League 1 generally not strong, especially outside the top 6 to 8 and what happened in the summer doesn't make the players any less when they are lining up on the field. What's happened was always going to likely stop us getting in the play offs but it shouldn't have made us finish anywhere near the bottom unless we've significantly under performed.

I agree with your analysis of the players.
It is just a pity the Manager isn't as good at managing and coaching players as he is at spotting them.
That first half today was again shite. He just isn't learning, and the tactics are boring the tits off the fans.
He is clueless, and as soon as is possible he needs replacing.
What we saw again today does not resemble football as I know it, Its tedious, boring shite.

 

[ZAKKY]

Just listened to Maloney and I sense he is getting frustrated with the fans, he says he wont change this type of football we play, oh dear



Rotherham fans arn't happy either oh dear

"Partly agree but we are a much worse team under Richardson"

 

[Frank Bullitt]

Sorry KDZ, but the goal this season was to STAY in this league given the turmoil the club has gone through. Staying up will be mission accomplished,

Hang on, who actually said this? Was it the club, the manager or something made up by the happy clappers as an excuse for the incompetence we have had to endure this season?

We are not in turmoil anymore we have a decent squad that could have done us and themselves proud but the mismanagement of the club has put paid to that.

 

[BrickLatic]

I agree with your analysis of the players.
It is just a pity the Manager isn't as good at managing and coaching players as he is at spotting them.
That first half today was again shite. He just isn't learning, and the tactics are boring the tits off the fans.
He is clueless, and as soon as is possible he needs replacing.
What we saw again today does not resemble football as I know it, Its tedious, boring shite.

its not even as good as that.

 

[king_dezeeuw06]

I agree with your analysis of the players.
It is just a pity the Manager isn't as good at managing and coaching players as he is at spotting them.
That first half today was again shite. He just isn't learning, and the tactics are boring the tits off the fans.
He is clueless, and as soon as is possible he needs replacing.
What we saw again today does not resemble football as I know it, Its tedious, boring shite.

I don't think he's going anywhere this season no matter what.

But for every Peterborough, Bolton, Oxford that were a joy to watch it feels like there's a lot more games where we just don't do ourselves justice. Also how many games have we played two decent half's?

The lack of intensity and urgency we so often see is something I really don't like. No matter who's on the pitch or what tactics those 2 things should be there every time.