Aston Villa v Tottenham Match Thread - Sunday 16th Feb, 2pm

[Wurzel]

Terry played in a deep lieing back four for us, and our wingers and full backs didn’t dare take chances in getting caught out upfield. The likes of Adomah and Snoddy would always be goal side of their player.

There’s pros and cons to both. When Terry was on the pitch I felt we created a lot of space between our defence and midfield, which good play makers in this league would love - so we need to be more compact. Secondly, it stifled our players getting forward sometimes and we need Targett to be an outlet not a Neil Taylor Mk2.

We debated what Terry is doing on here a while ago, but it’s the polar opposite of what he would do and yesterday if he was manager you’d have seen two teams playing defensively first trying to keep the other team out.

I don’t think Terry can have any real influence in the defence overall, he is I’m sure helping players individually but it’s hard to see that impact on a Saturday for 90 mins.

You Don't think Very has any influence at all? Then why are we paying him as a coach then? What is his purpose at the club if not to get the defence organised and drilled. When we make as many defensive errors as we do, and the setup of the defence is so poor, I would say that has everything to do with Terry. He obviously isn't doing his job very well is he?

 

[Wurzel]

He's assistant manager not defensive coach.

Our defending doesn't reflect well on anyone at the club but it's hard to single out Terry for this.

Seriously your going with that. He is a former international defender brought into the club for his experience as a defender. He isn't there to sort out the travel arrangements is he? Even if it wasn't directly in his job description, as a former international defender, captain, and multiple trophy winner, you would surely make it your job to sort out the defence.

 

[ASPINALL]

John Terry didn’t buy them though did he, he has improved Hause, Mings and Konsa but 2 of them just aren’t good enough at this level.

I do think we should be far more of a threat from set pieces but are these players intelligent enough to follow complex instructions?

Hause strolls around like he’s walking to get paper in his slippers.

He can smash someone if his brain clicks but far too passive and cannot see danger or read the game.

 

[Thomas Holte]

That's a ban surely for the kilometres thing on top of non attendance today.

Fuck Off

 

[Pangloss]

Seriously your going with that. He is a former international defender brought into the club for his experience as a defender. He isn't there to sort out the travel arrangements is he? Even if it wasn't directly in his job description, as a former international defender, captain, and multiple trophy winner, you would surely make it your job to sort out the defence.

My point is that it's a collective effort whereby you cannot just single out John Terry.

We could get Marco Baresi and Paulo Maldini in and it wouldn't make much of a difference.

Smith calls the shots on tactics and he sets up in a way that makes us vulnerable at the back. Terry didn't have a say in signings and it's clear that the likes of Engels and Targett were not good signings for the fees they commanded.

 

[ldgavfc]

It was a great spectacle yesterday and a good team performance, just individual lack of quality is to blame for the result. Not for the first time this season.

This team would dominate the championship next season, but if we do stay up, I hope there will be another turnover of players. Engels needs to go and another 20m quality centre back needs to be signed to partner Mings. Elmo can go, Guilbert can drop to second choice and we can sign a 20m quality right back too. Same on the other side with Taylor going and Targett getting some actual competition.

Hourihane and Drinkwater can go. Jota can go. Sign two more top quality midfielders and at least one top quality winger. We need to improve the playing staff to compete at this level and see these kinds of results over the line.

 

[crimsondonkey]

Like most I enjoyed the first 30 minutes of the game and thought it was the most committed and coherent display I'd seen from the team this season. Then it kind of fell apart and Spurs exposed the lack of quality and naïve tactics we don't seem to learn from.

Once we had clawed back to 2-2 then most managers would have gone compact and shaped not to concede, but there we are again with the defence playing a suicidal high line which means one mistake and we're done.

Playing that open every week means you're going toe to toe with teams with far more quality on the pitch, on the bench and managers with much greater top flight experience. What you can expect is to concede and get beat more often than not. Don't get me started on the set up away from home...

Positives -
1. A decent spell for 30 mins and a bit of fight to get back to 2-2
2. Samatta looks really decent
3. Reina really is top class and was unlucky with the pen

 

[sirdennis]

Hats of to the contestants of the half time competition.

3 out of 3 was very good.

The standard has got much better lately.

 

[ironside]

Fuck Off

No arguing with that. Pithy and to the point. Precisely how I felt walking out of V.P. yesterday.

 

[BodyButter]

Like most I enjoyed the first 30 minutes of the game and thought it was the most committed and coherent display I'd seen from the team this season. Then it kind of fell apart and Spurs exposed the lack of quality and naïve tactics we don't seem to learn from.

Once we had clawed back to 2-2 then most managers would have gone compact and shaped not to concede, but there we are again with the defence playing a suicidal high line which means one mistake and we're done.

Playing that open every week means you're going toe to toe with teams with far more quality on the pitch, on the bench and managers with much greater top flight experience. What you can expect is to concede and get beat more often than not. Don't get me started on the set up away from home...

Positives -
1. A decent spell for 30 mins and a bit of fight to get back to 2-2
2. Samatta looks really decent
3. Reina really is top class and was unlucky with the pen

It's the short blanket thing, isn't it. Either you leave yourself short at the back or up front. Our blanket seems to be over our heads.

 

[garygaryshaw]

Seriously your going with that. He is a former international defender brought into the club for his experience as a defender. He isn't there to sort out the travel arrangements is he? Even if it wasn't directly in his job description, as a former international defender, captain, and multiple trophy winner, you would surely make it your job to sort out the defence.

I dont think you could blame him for Engels air kick or the suicidal high line defending we tried. They were getting in behind us time after time and we did nothing to tighten up. If we are going to play 3 at the back, it probably needs to be in a 352 to make us more difficult to break through.

 

[Divine_islet]

I'm not downplaying positives but I don't want to blur that line between minimum expectations and seeing it as a positive .
E.g. Battling and working hard ! That's a basic expectation isn't it !!
Spurs were there for the taking , we were at home, we got the lead via an own goal , BUT we fucked it up today . Again !!
I see no positives from today.

What about our attacking play, was it not among the best we have seen this season if not the best?

 

[wittonite]

OK, it gives context to your comments. Personally I think you were being optimistic, personally I thought it would be a struggle.

At the start of the season I predicted 17th, and we are bang on target.
I see no reason to change it.

 

[Wurzel]

Sounds fair, and our opinions are coloured by how good we feel the squad and management are.

 

[JP Healy]

I dont think you could blame him for Engels air kick or the suicidal high line defending we tried. They were getting in behind us time after time and we did nothing to tighten up. If we are going to play 3 at the back, it probably needs to be in a 352 to make us more difficult to break through.

Tactical masterclass? Playing Luis and Drinkwater together not bright.We are so open to counter attacks,it is blindingly obvious why we are the weakest defence in the league.

 

[Wicked Messenger]

Abysmal failure of the first order if we go down. We lose Jack, probably one or two others including Douglas which would be a real loss not to mention 100m pounds. Worst case, the owners pack up as well.
He’s got the remaining fixtures to get the necessary points. I’d rather go down fighting like Saturday but the pressure is intensifying every game now.
One thing I am certain of, Dean has to go if we don’t stay up, cup final or not.

 

[CDX_EIRE]

Bullshit. I'm upset with where we are after 26 games.
Too many days like today, mistakes, plucky losers, VAR, etc.
Enough of the excuses, we are poor .

That's exactly what I said Sillhill, took me too long to get to the point I'll give you that but that's the issue. We're not good enough and after 26 games I am under no illusions.

There is a lot of piss moaning and complaining about yesterday but it has nothing to do with that specific game. It is the continual failings of this team to see out games for points.

We played well yesterday, we were incisive but not clinical and it reminded me of the shambles that was Arsenal away. So yeah 20 odd games since then and little has really changed.

I am annoyed but I am not annoyed with the performance yesterday I am annoyed at an unnecessary lapse in concentration that allowed them to win the game in the dying moments.

The thing about yesterdays game is either team could have been out of sight, it could easily have been 5-5.

 

[Bonker]

That's exactly what I said Sillhill, took me too long to get to the point I'll give you that but that's the issue. We're not good enough and after 26 games I am under no illusions.

There is a lot of piss moaning and complaining about yesterday but it has nothing to do with that specific game. It is the continual failings of this team to see out games for points.

We played well yesterday, we were incisive but not clinical and it reminded me of the shambles that was Arsenal away. So yeah 20 odd games since then and little has really changed.

I am annoyed but I am not annoyed with the performance yesterday I am annoyed at an unnecessary lapse in concentration that allowed them to win the game in the dying moments.

The thing about yesterdays game is either team could have been out of sight, it could easily have been 5-5.

For me at least, that is indeed the point - nothing has changed yet this should only require tweaking for us to increase our points haul significantly but for reasons passing understanding we're simply not doing it ffs.

None of this is a problem if we're halfway up the table and we could be if we even attempted to manage the games but we don't so we are where we are, despite a pretty good goals haul for ourselves.

It's almost criminally negligent, like points and league position do not matter as long as we're playing the "right way" and scoring goals.

 

[CDX_EIRE]

It's almost criminally negligent, like points and league position do not matter as long as we're playing the "right way" and scoring goals.

You're totally right, in the same way Bruce only knows how to dig in and defend, Smith only seems to know how to attack and play 'bravely'.

Is there a fine line between bravery and naivety? You'd certainly think so with how we play. We throw players forward without regard to what happens when we lose it. Clearly Dean is telling even his holding players to push on because Nakamba gets beyond the ball at times too. The only thing that doesn't happen that wouldn't surprise me is one of the centre backs bolting beyond the striker.

I am very torn and its a heart over head thing. I can't tell if sticking with him is the right thing to do but I do agree with what Fear has said. If a big name becomes available we should be moving mountains for them.

 

[Bonker]

You're totally right, in the same way Bruce only knows how to dig in and defend, Smith only seems to know how to attack and play 'bravely'.

Is there a fine line between bravery and naivety? You'd certainly think so with how we play. We throw players forward without regard to what happens when we lose it. Clearly Dean is telling even his holding players to push on because Nakamba gets beyond the ball at times too. The only thing that doesn't happen that wouldn't surprise me is one of the centre backs bolting beyond the striker.

I am very torn and its a heart over head thing. I can't tell if sticking with him is the right thing to do but I do agree with what Fear has said. If a big name becomes available we should be moving mountains for them.

It's incredibly gung-ho mate and people, I.E. Merse & co, were saying this after just a few games at the start of the season.

I can only think that the gung-ho balance can work for you in a lower league as you're balancing the fact that you're likely to see more goals scored for you vs the ability of the other side to hit you on the break and score.

The major difference in the PL vs the Championship of course is that PL players are at least twice as likely to score on the break as a typical Championship side are as their forwards are, literally, in a different league of ability and therein lies the problem IMO.

It can't/shouldn't be that simple but it doesn't half look like it is.

I'm all for the attacking approach but you've gotta have the players to do it, and the time to make it work - most managers would make you "solid" first then tweak the temperature up until it was obvious you were getting leaky at the back, not be leaky at the back and just say "fook it" and carry on like there's no problem for a whole season - it's nonsense.

Our defence is not up to snuff - granted - but look at how often they're under the cosh because of how the rest of the team are made to play with the ball ffs.

I think with Samatta instead of Wesley and a swinging dick winger instead of Ghazi from August then our season could look very different indeed and this could look more like Keegan's Newcastle rather than the fourteen year old's fantasy "tactics" that it looks like so far.

It's hard for me to call for his head but you've gotta cut your cloth to the players you actually have on the pitch in this game, regardless of what you'd ideally like to do, and I don't think he's doing it.