Post Brexit (n/g)

[PuB]

You are talking bollocks Pub. Ask young people in Spain who can't get a job whether they think the European Union is a good idea. The pound is not doing badly against the Euro & if you think the Schengen agreement which allows free movement throughout Europe, including migrants is a good idea, you must be mad. We (my wife & I) regularly travelled to France, but had to show our passports every time as we weren't in Schengen, but illegal immigrants in France with no passports, are allowed to sit there until they are helped off to UK, despite our idiotic government paying fortunes to have them stopped.
The Labour party has said it will abide by European rules on migration if it gets back into power, despite Europeans having second thoughts on migration.
Just sit back Pub, take a look at your deep bias & think clearly. The Labour party will leave us in the shit, as it has done so many times in the past. Remember the last lot leaving a note saying there was no money in the till?
Having said all that, I think the last Tory government have been a total disaster too! Up the Gills & fuck politics!!

Name me one single thing that works better now than it did 14 years ago. Just one.

Also we no longer have the right to return immigrants to the EU, something a competent government would have negotiated for in some kind of exit deal.

 

[Whisky Gill]

You are talking bollocks Pub. Ask young people in Spain who can't get a job whether they think the European Union is a good idea. The pound is not doing badly against the Euro & if you think the Schengen agreement which allows free movement throughout Europe, including migrants is a good idea, you must be mad. We (my wife & I) regularly travelled to France, but had to show our passports every time as we weren't in Schengen, but illegal immigrants in France with no passports, are allowed to sit there until they are helped off to UK, despite our idiotic government paying fortunes to have them stopped.
The Labour party has said it will abide by European rules on migration if it gets back into power, despite Europeans having second thoughts on migration.
Just sit back Pub, take a look at your deep bias & think clearly. The Labour party will leave us in the shit, as it has done so many times in the past. Remember the last lot leaving a note saying there was no money in the till?
Having said all that, I think the last Tory government have been a total disaster too! Up the Gills & fuck politics!!

Apparently the no money in the till note has been a continuous tradition for many years. Unfortunately the Tories decided to politicise it last time out.

 

[Gills77]

and you have to admit they did quite a good job for fifty-odd years until certain factions decided to fuck it all up again for whatever reasons or for whoever was funding them.

Utter nonsense. You really don't get it, do you?

Be honest, do you understand why it happened?

Or do you think Brexit happend because of Russia..... bla bla.... Facebook...... bla bla..... lies...... bla bla...... mislead?

 

[Gills77]

Name me one single thing that works better now than it did 14 years ago. Just one.

Also we no longer have the right to return immigrants to the EU, something a competent government would have negotiated for in some kind of exit deal.

Nearly every single problem today has 3 root causes:

1) Ukraine (this caused the inflation due to energy prices)
2) Covid (are you aware how much the Government borrowed?)
3) Population increase of low-tax paying persons

The last point is the one you're unwittingly alluding to, without realising it.

 

[PuB]

Nearly every single problem today has 3 root causes:

1) Ukraine (this caused the inflation due to energy prices)
2) Covid (are you aware how much the Government borrowed?)
3) Population increase of low-tax paying persons

The last point is the one you're unwittingly alluding to, without realising it.

You’ve just rolled out the excuses given by the government. The increase of gas/electric was literally public knowledge before Putin decided to be a dick and invade Ukraine.

Covid was expensive, many of those contracts were handed out to people who were unfit/unable to deliver upon them. Where’s that money now?

Population has increased, especially because we no longer have the right to return people to the EU, and it may surprise you, but immigration has increased since the Brexit vote.

(Staying on topic)

 

[Gills77]

You’ve just rolled out the excuses given by the government. The increase of gas/electric was literally public knowledge before Putin decided to be a dick and invade Ukraine.

Covid was expensive, many of those contracts were handed out to people who were unfit/unable to deliver upon them. Where’s that money now?

Population has increased, especially because we no longer have the right to return people to the EU, and it may surprise you, but immigration has increased since the Brexit vote.

(Staying on topic)

Most of your points I agree with:

The only thing I disagree with is the gas/electric. Before Ukraine there was no 10% inflation. I think supermarkets had been using Brexit as an excuse to increase prices and got found out.

Regarding Covid I completely agree with you. Why would you think I want some right-wing ****pot stealing tax money? Economically I'm not right-wing. In fact most Tory voters aren't. It's only the ones running the part, CBI etc. Most Brits are economically centre/centre-left.

Regarding the last point, again, I agree. The Tories haven't bothered controlling it because the ones running the party make money from immigration.

 

[GillsBluenose]

I'd forgotten that utility bills never went up when we were in the EU. Me and my memory .

Of course, the EU would also have stopped Putin being a dick if Brexit hadn't happened, and would have sent Covid straight back to China. If only, if only.

And 14 years on from the "no money left" quote by the Labour Minister, we don't really still have the highest ever domestic tax burden, do we?

 

[jogills]

I think the grassroot Tory members (Truss voters etc) want to control them but most of the senior party politicians (PM, FM etc) are the type who make money from immigration (lower wages and higher rent).

But they haven't, any of them. They have all failed woefully. I think those tories that favour migration and those that don't have all colluded to keep the boats coming because they think they can make it work electorally. Reform are currently exposing how dim and dishonest that is but events are catching up with them all over.

 

[nibbles]

I'd forgotten that utility bills never went up when we were in the EU. Me and my memory .

Hey, why’s it so dark and sandy all of a sudden?

 

[ARFUR CONNELL]

Name me one single thing that works better now than it did 14 years ago. Just one.

Also we no longer have the right to return immigrants to the EU, something a competent government would have negotiated for in some kind of exit deal.

We don't have to do as were told, by some unelected prat in a different country, working for their own interests & pay billions in order to be told what to spend it on. I remember seeing signs in the Highlands of Scotland thanking the EU for paying for road improvements. Our own fucking money kindly given (partially) back.
Please PuB, take a step back from your left-wing views & look at what we can achieve by ourselves. We have the ability to do that & we don't need Merkel type people getting the French to pull the strings for them.
Back to today's game, then possibly a pint! Hope you have a good day PuB.

 

[Vambogills]

Utter nonsense. You really don't get it, do you?

Be honest, do you understand why it happened?

Or do you think Brexit happend because of Russia..... bla bla.... Facebook...... bla bla..... lies...... bla bla...... mislead?

Ok. I'll bite.
Odd to declare 'You really don't get it do you?' and then follow it up with a comment that does not get it.
Of course Putin's Russia saw it would benefit from a weaker Europe. Their aggressive bot operation that saturated social media with pro Leave propaganda was a part of the hushed up Russia report that almost everyone had personally witnessed. You cannot deny that surely?
Cameron launched the ill planned and poorly prepared referendum but Putin, the immigrant blaming right wing press and hedge fund managers absolutely knew what result was best for them and used their power and influence accordingly and managed to just scrape the result over the line.

 

[Therealwaldo]

We don't have to do as were told, by some unelected prat in a different country, working for their own interests & pay billions in order to be told what to spend it on. I remember seeing signs in the Highlands of Scotland thanking the EU for paying for road improvements. Our own fucking money kindly given (partially) back.
Please PuB, take a step back from your left-wing views & look at what we can achieve by ourselves. We have the ability to do that & we don't need Merkel type people getting the French to pull the strings for them.
Back to today's game, then possibly a pint! Hope you have a good day PuB.

Let me give you one example of where you’re wrong. For a number of years local councils have been coming together to share services. For instance, not all councils have a Finance Department. One council might have one and maybe two other councils will use it for their financial services. Any idea why they do that ? It’s to save money. It’s called the economies of scale. The EU was one of the biggest and most ambitious schemes using that principle. Part of the money we paid over was for things like the subscription to be part of the European Medicines Agency. Now out of the EU we have had to set up our own equivalent body. Multiply that dozens of times across all the agencies and add up the cost of doing so and you get why your simple maths is a complete oversimplification.

 

[ARFUR CONNELL]

Let me give you one example of where you’re wrong. For a number of years local councils have been coming together to share services. For instance, not all councils have a Finance Department. One council might have one and maybe two other councils will use it for their financial services. Any idea why they do that ? It’s to save money. It’s called the economies of scale. The EU was one of the biggest and most ambitious schemes using that principle. Part of the money we paid over was for things like the subscription to be part of the European Medicines Agency. Now out of the EU we have had to set up our own equivalent body. Multiply that dozens of times across all the agencies and add up the cost of doing so and you get why your simple maths is a complete oversimplification.

OK, so we are re-joining the Horizon scheme, where we have to pay 2.2 billion pounds, BUT, we can apply for money back for our scientific staff. Frankly I would rather we did our own thing, especially as the Europeans want us back!!

 

[LancsGordoRoad]

Time flies, Brexit vote was nearly eight years ago ! We finished 9th in L1 and scored 71 goals

 

[markinkent]

Time flies, Brexit vote was nearly eight years ago ! We finished 9th in L1 and scored 71 goals

How many goals !!!

Today was an interesting day through history according to my Facebook memories. A fun day by the River in Fulham in 1996 and another fun day near the River in Burton. Both celebrating promotion.

Today......we can celebrate moving in the right direction and that'll do for now.

 

[Therealwaldo]

OK, so we are re-joining the Horizon scheme, where we have to pay 2.2 billion pounds, BUT, we can apply for money back for our scientific staff. Frankly I would rather we did our own thing, especially as the Europeans want us back!!

And why are we rejoining ? Because of course your highly simplistic take is only a small part of the story. We need to be part of a major cross national scientific collaboration. Being outside meant scientists were leaving the UK because they were missing out on that collaboration. We can’t achieve anything like as much as an individual nation. Staying outside was unsustainable. Other areas will follow. We might not rejoin but piece by piece we will rebuild the building blocks that will create the conditions to rejoin at some point in the future.

 

[Gills77]

Ok. I'll bite.
Odd to declare 'You really don't get it do you?' and then follow it up with a comment that does not get it.
Of course Putin's Russia saw it would benefit from a weaker Europe. Their aggressive bot operation that saturated social media with pro Leave propaganda was a part of the hushed up Russia report that almost everyone had personally witnessed. You cannot deny that surely?
Cameron launched the ill planned and poorly prepared referendum but Putin, the immigrant blaming right wing press and hedge fund managers absolutely knew what result was best for them and used their power and influence accordingly and managed to just scrape the result over the line.

According to you Leave won because of Russian bots on Facebook.

Remainers keep saying most Leave voters were old.

You reckon 70-80 year olds used Facebook that much in 2016?

 

[Gills77]

And why are we rejoining ? Because of course your highly simplistic take is only a small part of the story. We need to be part of a major cross national scientific collaboration. Being outside meant scientists were leaving the UK because they were missing out on that collaboration. We can’t achieve anything like as much as an individual nation. Staying outside was unsustainable. Other areas will follow. We might not rejoin but piece by piece we will rebuild the building blocks that will create the conditions to rejoin at some point in the future.

Why can't scientists outside of the EU collaborate with EU scientists?

Are you suggesting EU scientists do not collaborate with US and Chinese scientists?

 

[Gills77]

Common sense says we need good relations with our nearest neighbours. Whether that be for economic reasons or more recently for reasons of security.

Economic migration / refugees are facts of 21st century Europe we need need to work together as a European continent to share the load and work for solutions.

An emergent Russian threat means we need to work together for security reasons.

We honestly need the Farage's and the like to grow old and die and allow the next generation to come through and repair the relationship with Europe.

In reality not much has changed. It takes longer to enter an EU country, you get a stamp in your passport and have to pay import duty on things sent from abroad.

We'll still come last in Eurovision and suffer heartbreak in the Euro's. The rich got richer and the poor got poorer and somehow the likes of Farage still get a stage to spout their bile on.

1) Completely agree. But Europe never wanted the UK in the EEC. In fact they only admitted the UK to take their fishing waters. Look in to the history of the Treaty of Rome.

2) No, we shouldn't share the load. They need to stay where they are. Most are not coming from war zones.

3) Agreed. Tell Germany

4) I reckon if I ask you to say what Farage has said, you would struggle?

5) Like the other 172 countries in the world

6a) It's not about rich vs not-rich. It's about rich people who make money through other people's misery. Uncontrolled immigration reduces wages and increases rent. You're so left-wing you won't accept mass low-skilled immigration is part of the problem, you just want to blame all rich people.

6b) What has Farage said, exactly?

 

[PuB]

Why can't scientists outside of the EU collaborate with EU scientists?

Are you suggesting EU scientists do not collaborate with US and Chinese scientists?

Imagine for a moment if you will, you’re a library and you share your collection of books with 28 others, each able to look at all books at anyones request. Then imagine one day thinking it’s a silly idea and you’d rather be independent so cut ties, suddenly you have access to 1/28th of the books you could previously access freely.

And no longer receive the same funding either.