World thread

Sorry to raise this, but I just find it hard to get on with my life while ignoring this sort of stuff.

Netanyahu crowing about genocide, Trump crowing about random illegal strikes against anyone he doesn't like, any of these sort of people being in charge of countries with nuclear weapons.
 
I’ve come to the conclusion it’s all just a massive ego drive, headed for mutual self destruction.

Now the middle east is just too complex and intricate culturally, politically, and economically. I doubt there are answers to this at all

US/China/Russia could actually be solved in 20 minutes. There is nothing stopping a win/win situation for all involved if egos and grandstanding are put aside
Everyone can benefit. There doesn’t need to be a dominant force in this world.
 
pebble said:
Sorry to raise this, but I just find it hard to get on with my life while ignoring this sort of stuff.

Netanyahu crowing about genocide, Trump crowing about random illegal strikes against anyone he doesn't like, any of these sort of people being in charge of countries with nuclear weapons.
Click to expand...

Dont think anyone here is happy but no one appears to want to do anything.

Think the Israelis are not doing themselves any favours. Gonna be hard for them to mention holocaust without also talking about what they have done and are doing in gaza.

Another perfectly good country ruined by an out of control politician.
 
www.bbc.co.uk

Women's final abandoned over fans' Palestine support was about 'safety risks'

A women's cup final was abandoned over "a perceived risk to safety" when fans refused to remove political banners, the club which hosted the game says.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

Remarkable.

A women's final is abandoned because the club hosting it decides it doesn't like fans having pro-Palestinian banners.
_________________________________________________________________________
Clapton player Tammy Hymas told BBC Sport: "An official from Maidstone came on the pitch and said the game had to stop, as they no longer consented to the stadium being used while political material was present.

"The game was stopped. As I understand, there was a suggestion the match could continue behind closed doors, with no fans.

"As a team we refused that offer, we said we wanted to show solidarity, so we went into the stands and joined the fans."

Hymas added the action had the support of Jewish members of the club's fanbase who were present at the game.
_________________________________________________________________________________

The team felt strongly enough to join the fans in the stands.

Maybe we need to take a lesson from them. History won't thank us for looking the other way while genocide is carried out, even if we feel powerless.
 
pebble said:
www.bbc.co.uk

Women's final abandoned over fans' Palestine support was about 'safety risks'

A women's cup final was abandoned over "a perceived risk to safety" when fans refused to remove political banners, the club which hosted the game says.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

Remarkable.

A women's final is abandoned because the club hosting it decides it doesn't like fans having pro-Palestinian banners.
_________________________________________________________________________
Clapton player Tammy Hymas told BBC Sport: "An official from Maidstone came on the pitch and said the game had to stop, as they no longer consented to the stadium being used while political material was present.

"The game was stopped. As I understand, there was a suggestion the match could continue behind closed doors, with no fans.

"As a team we refused that offer, we said we wanted to show solidarity, so we went into the stands and joined the fans."

Hymas added the action had the support of Jewish members of the club's fanbase who were present at the game.
_________________________________________________________________________________

The team felt strongly enough to join the fans in the stands.

Maybe we need to take a lesson from them. History won't thank us for looking the other way while genocide is carried out, even if we feel powerless.
Click to expand...
The only determiner between which side is committing genocide is which side is actually powerful enough to carry it out.

In this case, the Israeli government is powerful enough to carry out genocide while Hamas is not. Flip the power balance and there can scarcely be any doubt that Hamas would commit genocide against the Israeli people - they are pretty open about that.

There are no good guys in this conflict. The leaders of both sides would like to wipe out every man, woman and child of the other. And the leaders of both sides would slit yours and your family's throats without hesitation if the opportunity arose and it suited their purposes.

No good guys
 
Pope John XXIII said:
There are no good guys in this conflict. The leaders of both sides would like to wipe out every man, woman and child of the other. And the leaders of both sides would slit yours and your family's throats without hesitation if the opportunity arose and it suited their purposes.

No good guys
Click to expand...

He's right

Both sides as bad as each other IMO

In amongst them all many innocent and good people who don't want any part in any of the violence I'm sure
 
Pope John XXIII said:
The only determiner between which side is committing genocide is which side is actually powerful enough to carry it out.

In this case, the Israeli government is powerful enough to carry out genocide while Hamas is not. Flip the power balance and there can scarcely be any doubt that Hamas would commit genocide against the Israeli people - they are pretty open about that.

There are no good guys in this conflict. The leaders of both sides would like to wipe out every man, woman and child of the other. And the leaders of both sides would slit yours and your family's throats without hesitation if the opportunity arose and it suited their purposes.

No good guys
Click to expand...
Agreed, but the power imbalance is a fact and rather gross.

I've started reading 'The question of Palestine' by Edward Said, which may make me better informed, but right now the obvious spectacle is Israel trying to destroy Gaza and force all Palestinians out of Israel. To hear Netanyahu describe Hamas as mass murderers and child killers is to wonder whether he ever looks in the mirror.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
The only determiner between which side is committing genocide is which side is actually powerful enough to carry it out.

In this case, the Israeli government is powerful enough to carry out genocide while Hamas is not. Flip the power balance and there can scarcely be any doubt that Hamas would commit genocide against the Israeli people - they are pretty open about that.

There are no good guys in this conflict. The leaders of both sides would like to wipe out every man, woman and child of the other. And the leaders of both sides would slit yours and your family's throats without hesitation if the opportunity arose and it suited their purposes.

No good guys
Click to expand...

Perhaps the solution is to throw the leaders of both sides somewhere where they can't cause normal people problems?
 
radfordinlondon said:
Perhaps the solution is to throw the leaders of both sides somewhere where they can't cause normal people problems?
Click to expand...
Getting rid of leaders won't help unless there is appetite to replace them with better leaders.
At this point the problem is coming from the general populations of each side, and their bloodthirsty desire for slaughter and death that is taught to children and reinforced by propaganda.
 
In the 60’s, summer time was celebrated in France with the arrival of the riot season. The cobbled streets always provided ammo to throw at the police. Has it arrived early?
 
Sorry but I just don't get how anybody can regard Hamas and the state of Israel as equals when it comes to the desire to kill people.
 
jbacsta said:
Sorry but I just don't get how anybody can regard Hamas and the state of Israel as equals when it comes to the desire to kill people.
Click to expand...
Hamas would not exist if it were not for Israel.

Driving people out their homes in the 1970s and 80s and into Lebanese refugee camps, and then systematically murdering them, like at Tel Al Zaatar, Sabra and Shatila did not quite get the response Israel expected.

You also forget that less than 100 years ago the likes of Irgun, Hagganah and the Stern Gang, murdering British Soldiers who were attempting to keep order in the newly formed State; or was that ok too?
 
mao tse tung said:
Hamas would not exist if it were not for Israel.

Driving people out their homes in the 1970s and 80s and into Lebanese refugee camps, and then systematically murdering them, like at Tel Al Zaatar, Sabra and Shatila did not quite get the response Israel expected.

You also forget that less than 100 years ago the likes of Irgun, Hagganah and the Stern Gang, murdering British Soldiers who were attempting to keep order in the newly formed State; or was that ok too?
Click to expand...
I didn't say any of it was OK I don't think. Palestine as you say was created. Obviously not every one in the region was happy about that.
 
jbacsta said:
Sorry but I just don't get how anybody can regard Hamas and the state of Israel as equals when it comes to the desire to kill people.
Click to expand...
How can you not?

Hamas have it embedded within their ideology that Israel has no right to exist. Do you seriously doubt that Hamas would not look to exterminate every man, woman and child in Israel, much as the Israeli government is indirectly doing right now? They literally showed they would on October 7th.

These people would have you blindfolded and lined up against a wall in a heartbeat, alongside all of your family. You are unbelievers and they would kill you. And plenty of non combatants would cheer. These people (Hamas and their supporters) are not your friends.

Israel are currently doing exactly what Hamas would like to do, if only they had the power to do it. We can and should condemn Israel for turning murderous fantasy into reality, but we can't be so stupid as to absolve Hamas simply because they don't currently have the power and wherewithal to be the ones committing the genocide.

And what I said about lining you up blindfolded against a wall, cheered on by supporters? Exactly the same with the Israeli government. Because you are an unbeliever to their fundamentalists too, so your life is worthless as far as they are concerned.

This isn't a story of the middle east. It is a story of human beings unfortunately
 
jbacsta said:
I didn't say any of it was OK I don't think. Palestine as you say was created. Obviously not every one in the region was happy about that.
Click to expand...
The newly formed state of Israel.

Up until 1948, the whole area was classed as Palestine, which came under a British mandate; the State Of Isreal was then formed and the Israelis thanked the British in time honoured manner by murdering them
 
It’s partly the fault of our navy, the Austrian painter and his gang of idiots wanted to move the Jews to Madagascar before they decided fully on the holocaust but couldn’t do it because of Britannia ruling the waves

Not saying that’s a good or bad thing but you do wonder what would have happened had that been implemented
 
mao tse tung said:
The newly formed state of Israel.

Up until 1948, the whole area was classed as Palestine, which came under a British mandate; the State Of Isreal was then formed and the Israelis thanked the British in time honoured manner by murdering them
Click to expand...
Palestine and Israel’s history is long and complicated. Well before the British got involved. This latest decade of fighting is due to Iran, funding, training then directing brigades. It is Iran that is directing “from the river to the sea” policy. Two or three state solutions are redundant via an Iran veto. No chance for peace.

They have control in Yemen, Gaza, and till recently Lebanon. They have factions in Jordan and Egypt. They are attempting to take control in various African states with uprising and civil war.

No peace is possible with Iran and its annihilation of Israel policy. The people of those states are pawns for propaganda. Israel are fighting for it existence. The mentality of bomber Harris is understandable, not agreeing with but understandable. Hammas generals safe in tunnels under hospitals behind the human shields of starving women and children directing Irans messages.

The rockets, hundreds a day, were coming from Gaza, Lebanon and latterly Yemen. Oct 7th was the tipping point but it was coming before that. This war has many twists and turns to go yet as it has over the past three thousand years.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.