What's gone wrong with Harry... | Page 4 | Vital Football

What's gone wrong with Harry...

ScottDaYid said:
Of course we can win without him but I guarantee we have more chance of winning with him in the team.

Certain games we could maybe leave him out but against Liverpool we can't afford to, lets say we did drop him and we get battered? 99% of fans would go mad. A risk we really can't afford to make.
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I'd take the risk, Harry 'Fernando Torres' Kane has offered nothing much for club or country for 6 months or so , the penalties and set piece goals that ' won ' him the Golden Boot at the WC may pull the wool over some eyes, but I'll guarantee you this, if he doesn't somehow snap out of this malaise the press will be gunning for him soon.
 
Big Chiv said:
Could play Son instead ?
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Played the full 90 Vs Chile, not sure if he did in their previous match but considering he just played a ridiculous amount of games in a short space of time for the Asian games following World Cup and pre season he's got more need of a rest than anyone on paper.
 
To be fair to Southgate and Poch, they need to be trusted with Kane at this stage. Between a Sat international and a lunchtime club match the following Sat, Kane has probably had the best prep with a 30 mins sub appearance last night. Southgate also mentioned that he'd had 3 days of mostly rest in the England camp. Idiots like Gary Neville don't mention these things when sensationalising the story for their own career gain.
 
muttley said:
To be fair to Southgate and Poch, they need to be trusted with Kane at this stage. Between a Sat international and a lunchtime club match the following Sat, Kane has probably had the best prep with a 30 mins sub appearance last night. Southgate also mentioned that he'd had 3 days of mostly rest in the England camp. Idiots like Gary Neville don't mention these things when sensationalising the story for their own career gain.
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Surprised that anyone that hasn't played the game at that level would so readily dismiss the views of someone that actually knows what he's talking about.
Incidentally he's not the only ex footballer to have voiced the same concern.
 
Topspur1 said:
Surprised that anyone that hasn't played the game at that level would so readily dismiss the views of someone that actually knows what he's talking about.
Incidentally he's not the only ex footballer to have voiced the same concern.
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Topspur - the problem is Neville is playing the "ex pro" card but then totally contradicting himself.

Here's what he said last Friday.....

"I think with Harry and other players who play week in week out, Saturday-Wednesday and all summer, what you would say is they continue to soldier on and maybe do dip in sharpness, but their level is still high enough to play. There's no doubt that they need that month or two break. However, they will naturally pick up injuries which will give them that break and allow their whole body to recover. So it is very difficult for a manager to give them a break because they look tired. Harry is playing at a high level, perhaps not at his peak, but there's no way you can rest your captain for a competitive fixture."

Here's what he said after Switzerland game.....

“He’s struggling. Forget the physical side, he needs a mental break as well. I don’t think he should have been here for the two weeks. I think there is a welfare thing for me in terms of looking after players."

It's not OK just to say in the moment what will sound best on TV. To gain credibility, you need consistency.

I've said this before, but Kane's fatigue challenges will only get solved at his club, not the international setup. I don't condone 2 international friendlies around the 4 competitive games after the summer though. Spain and Croatia home and away would have been just fine for Southgate to keep on top of his squad.
 
muttley said:
Topspur - the problem is Neville is playing the "ex pro" card but then totally contradicting himself.

Here's what he said last Friday.....

"I think with Harry and other players who play week in week out, Saturday-Wednesday and all summer, what you would say is they continue to soldier on and maybe do dip in sharpness, but their level is still high enough to play. There's no doubt that they need that month or two break. However, they will naturally pick up injuries which will give them that break and allow their whole body to recover. So it is very difficult for a manager to give them a break because they look tired. Harry is playing at a high level, perhaps not at his peak, but there's no way you can rest your captain for a competitive fixture."

Here's what he said after Switzerland game.....

“He’s struggling. Forget the physical side, he needs a mental break as well. I don’t think he should have been here for the two weeks. I think there is a welfare thing for me in terms of looking after players."

It's not OK just to say in the moment what will sound best on TV. To gain credibility, you need consistency.

I've said this before, but Kane's fatigue challenges will only get solved at his club, not the international setup. I don't condone 2 international friendlies around the 4 competitive games after the summer though. Spain and Croatia home and away would have been just fine for Southgate to keep on top of his squad.
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I understand where you are coming from, Craig Belamy was making the point about Kane showing signs of tiredness before the international break. Didn't like him much as a player but he does talk a lot of sense, he even made the point that not playing because of injury is not the same as having a break.
He also said if he doesn't get a break he would be odds on to pick up an injury.
 
Topspur1 said:
I understand where you are coming from, Craig Belamy was making the point about Kane showing signs of tiredness before the international break. Didn't like him much as a player but he does talk a lot of sense, he even made the point that not playing because of injury is not the same as having a break.
He also said if he doesn't get a break he would be odds on to pick up an injury.
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Yeah, shades of grey with Kane's predicament. I can also imagine that the mental side was so much easier for Neville when the league winners medals were coming thick and fast. Shame Neville didn't talk a little bit more about how he overcame it and managed another 7-10 years at the highest level. I'd be more interested in that.

Let's face it, nobody would be surprised to see Kane bury Liverpool at the weekend with a great performance and registering on the scoresheet.
 
muttley said:
Yeah, shades of grey with Kane's predicament. I can also imagine that the mental side was so much easier for Neville when the league winners medals were coming thick and fast. Shame Neville didn't talk a little bit more about how he overcame it and managed another 7-10 years at the highest level. I'd be more interested in that.

Let's face it, nobody would be surprised to see Kane bury Liverpool at the weekend with a great performance and registering on the scoresheet.
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Danny Murphy said that just because Kane isn't 100% doesn't mean he's not a match winner.
Going back to Belamy, he was saying that Kane tiredness was why he was dropping into midfield more, his thinking is by coming short he's doing less running than working the channels. It takes a lot more energy sprinting wide to try and pull defence apart than dropping deep to receive the ball.
 
Topspur1 said:
Danny Murphy said that just because Kane isn't 100% doesn't mean he's not a match winner.
Going back to Belamy, he was saying that Kane tiredness was why he was dropping into midfield more, his thinking is by coming short he's doing less running than working the channels. It takes a lot more energy sprinting wide to try and pull defence apart than dropping deep to receive the ball.
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I agree with Bellamy that Kane is working less in the channels, but have also noticed he's only played with Sterling, Moura and Rashford since June. That in itself changes the way he approaches his number 9 position and is different from the Kane/Eriksen/Dele setup. Probably some tactical shifts happening as well.
 
What's also interesting is that some were saying that Reo Griffiths could have been a genuine backup to Kane and should have been integrated into the 1st team.

Read this.......better the devil OR grass is greener?

At 18-years-old, he will no doubt be hoping to soon breakthrough into the Lyon first-team. For a while this summer, it looked like he might have to.

Lyon were struggling to keep hold of Nabil Fekir and were looking short in the striking department. Griffiths, might have been bumped up earlier.

However, that is now not the case. Lyon snapped up Moussa Dembele from Celtic on the final day of the transfer window in a £19.7 million deal. They also signed young talent Lenny Pintor from Stade Brestois.

Griffiths is therefore likely to spend this season with Lyon II, who play in the French fourth-tier.

The early signs, however, are not good. Lyon II have played five times this season. But Griffiths has not been in a matchday squad yet. The club have used several other front-men, including the very talented Yann Kitala, but Griffiths has not yet played.

Hopefully, his decision to leave Tottenham is justified, as it would be great to see a young talent from England make it in a foreign league.

But early signs are a reminder it is going to be tough for Griffiths to make his mark.
 
muttley said:
What's also interesting is that some were saying that Reo Griffiths could have been a genuine backup to Kane and should have been integrated into the 1st team.

Read this.......better the devil OR grass is greener?

At 18-years-old, he will no doubt be hoping to soon breakthrough into the Lyon first-team. For a while this summer, it looked like he might have to.

Lyon were struggling to keep hold of Nabil Fekir and were looking short in the striking department. Griffiths, might have been bumped up earlier.

However, that is now not the case. Lyon snapped up Moussa Dembele from Celtic on the final day of the transfer window in a £19.7 million deal. They also signed young talent Lenny Pintor from Stade Brestois.

Griffiths is therefore likely to spend this season with Lyon II, who play in the French fourth-tier.

The early signs, however, are not good. Lyon II have played five times this season. But Griffiths has not been in a matchday squad yet. The club have used several other front-men, including the very talented Yann Kitala, but Griffiths has not yet played.

Hopefully, his decision to leave Tottenham is justified, as it would be great to see a young talent from England make it in a foreign league.

But early signs are a reminder it is going to be tough for Griffiths to make his mark.
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Why did he go to lyon. Its obvious he wont start. He should have been smarter about his move.
 
muttley said:
What's also interesting is that some were saying that Reo Griffiths could have been a genuine backup to Kane and should have been integrated into the 1st team.

Read this.......better the devil OR grass is greener?

At 18-years-old, he will no doubt be hoping to soon breakthrough into the Lyon first-team. For a while this summer, it looked like he might have to.

Lyon were struggling to keep hold of Nabil Fekir and were looking short in the striking department. Griffiths, might have been bumped up earlier.

However, that is now not the case. Lyon snapped up Moussa Dembele from Celtic on the final day of the transfer window in a £19.7 million deal. They also signed young talent Lenny Pintor from Stade Brestois.

Griffiths is therefore likely to spend this season with Lyon II, who play in the French fourth-tier.

The early signs, however, are not good. Lyon II have played five times this season. But Griffiths has not been in a matchday squad yet. The club have used several other front-men, including the very talented Yann Kitala, but Griffiths has not yet played.

Hopefully, his decision to leave Tottenham is justified, as it would be great to see a young talent from England make it in a foreign league.

But early signs are a reminder it is going to be tough for Griffiths to make his mark.
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Think you Totally miss the point. Moving to a France and not speaking the language is hardly comparable with five and ten min cameos with your home town team where you are long settled. The fact he is struggling there is so NOT a supprise. If he'd gone there and torn it up neither would that have convinced me he'd have made it here. Granted it would be galling. I'd just much rather especially with our squad issues have a young home grown talent to throw on that old man Llorente.
 
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