Race Issues/Riots/Protests/BLM | Page 103 | Vital Football

Race Issues/Riots/Protests/BLM

Pangloss said:
Seems like players are stuck in a bit of a loop with it and looking for 'permission' to stop doing it.
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It’s great Les Ferdinand came out and said it how it is, a white sporting director couldn’t because there is a risk he could be vilified for being racist even if he said exactly what Les said.

So well done Les, and QPR too as they are probably one of the most diverse clubs in the country as it says in the article, so fair play to them.
 
No-one even knows what the knee is about anymore, and apart from hoping the US police don’t shoot people willy nilly has anyone in the UK who is focussed on problems in UK society been able to pinpoint some things we can do and ways we can improve on the amazing quality of life we have here in the U.K. for all?

We are degrees of separation for equality for all, I firmly believe the majority of problems in the U.K. now are subconscious systemic problems. Give people the training and skills to work on subconscious biases and then you have a true level playing field for all, and not just the black community but for all.

Meanwhile genocide and western wars in the Middle East kill many more thousands of innocent people but we won’t have any gestures for those pesky poor people over in the East
 
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The Fear said:
Yes, read the Ferdinand thing earlier, totally agree, said in this thread, when it was done by Villa the first time, it was actually really powerful. But over and over and over again, it waters it down and is going through the motions.
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IMO this is the EPL being the corporation they are just statements and symbols and no action.

If you had the governing board of the league in a conference right now and asked them what concrete action they have taken to combat racism both in football and outside it they'd look like bumbling fools.

Les is probably waiting for a phonecall asking what they should do, him and many other former players just sitting and waiting. Or even worse, offering and being ignored.
 
CDX_EIRE said:
IMO this is the EPL being the corporation they are just statements and symbols and no action.

If you had the governing board of the league in a conference right now and asked them what concrete action they have taken to combat racism both in football and outside it they'd look like bumbling fools.

Les is probably waiting for a phonecall asking what they should do, him and many other former players just sitting and waiting. Or even worse, offering and being ignored.
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Spot on CDX. I posted on here some time ago that the whole thing is being driven by the corporates to protect their profit margins.
The minute they think they can get away with it, without too much financial damage they will drop it like a hot potato.
 
Bloody hell - MP in 'makes sense' shocker.

Public statues of controversial historical figures should be "retained and explained" instead of being taken down, the government has said. Culture Minister Matt Warman told MPs the UK's heritage should not be removed from view "however contentious".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54299049

Explain it, point out why they have the statue in the first place and then point out based on today's morals where they were ***** so people learn.
 
You're on one with the C.N.U.T.s tonight @mike_field everyone is a C.N.U.T.

I may have misunderstood your view but I am taking it you agree. Personally, I disagree and I side with iconoclasm (to a point). At a very minimum, surely some historical figures do not deserve their likeness retained in a statue.

Using my homeland as an example, we Irish did some stupid shit as well as many things I absolutely agree it. Stupid things we did were ripping up the trams lines and demolishing the longest row of townhouses in Europe, beautiful architecture. All in the name of eradicating the symbols of colonialism. We also changed all our street names and place names. The creme de la creme of course was destroying Nelsons Pillar, rumor is the Government hired the IRA to do it which they botched.

That statue had no business being there however notable Irish writers did defend its presence. James Joyce and WB Yates two of the most widely known names. The British admiral left Dublin by air! In any case on the grand scale of wrongdoings, Nelson never did anything to us as far as I am aware. In fact he seems like a 'classic European admiral' of the times, when war was 'chivalrous'! Of course, it depends on who you're fighting.

In any case, as I draw a conclusion here it's not all black and white as usual. If Nelsons Pillar still stood in Dublin today I doubt there would be any rush to take it down. Contrast this with say, Churchill, whose statue I dare say wouldn't have lasted 24hrs on the isle of Ireland at any time in history.

It depends on the figure, the culture, the country, and how history perceives them - sometimes it can be hard to know if some of history is even right. Few if any Nazi monuments still stand, why is any slave owner, perpetrators of war crimes, or colonialist any different? As they say, history is written by the victor but some evils can't be brushed over so easily. I don't know if monuments to perpetrators of hate can be so easily converted to teachable guide stones.
 
One of those night's CDX lol Four simple letters avoid the need for me to ramble a paragraph of insults!

No, yes I agree with you and I was just being generic. History would show some in such a bad light it shouldn't be 'public display' in that sense, those ones would go with JF's comment about a museum where the good, the bad and the ugly was explained.

Others I imagine could remain on public display where they are with just a simple update (plaque whatever) to explain the darker side of their lives.

There wouldn't be a catch all and I dare say some would need public consultation to at least get a majority consensus so you've heard all sides so to speak.

But it's a better option than ripping them down or blindly leaving them up as naturally they mean different things to different people, but it's about finding a common ground.
 
Yeah i suppose we could also have information in these museums on black peoples ancenstors role in the organisation and selling of black slaves too.
BLM and others make out that the Europeans just waded into Africa and took these people and used them as slaves.
Who do you think the europeans bought their slaves off?
In Africa.... Nigeria, the Congo etc black people set up slave camps where the slaves were nurtured into the slave way of life before being sold on.
If we are going to educate folk, we need to tell the whole story or its just going to be half the story! The half that fits!!!!!
 
colavfc said:
Yeah i suppose we could also have information in these museums on black peoples ancenstors role in the organisation and selling of black slaves too.
BLM and others make out that the Europeans just waded into Africa and took these people and used them as slaves.
Who do you think the europeans bought their slaves off?
In Africa.... Nigeria, the Congo etc black people set up slave camps where the slaves were nurtured into the slave way of life before being sold on.
If we are going to educate folk, we need to tell the whole story or its just going to be half the story! The half that fits!!!!!
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This is not the way forward anyway.

We shouldn't be splitting the human race up into different races/colours and thinking each colour denotes a different type of human being.

Its 2020 and where we are now - is the human journey. One race, one species.

BLM are categorising humans into different sub sections depending on colour of skin. Whites did this, Blacks did this etc = which is wrong.
 
Green Tea said:
This is not the way forward anyway.

We shouldn't be splitting the human race up into different races/colours and thinking each colour denotes a different type of human being.

Its 2020 and where we are now - is the human journey. One race, one species.

BLM are categorising humans into different sub sections depending on colour of skin. Whites did this, Blacks did this etc = which is wrong.
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No. We shouldnt be. In an ideal world. But the media do it non stop.
Not sure how you educate people without doing so without it sounding like a fairy tale.
 
mike_field said:
No, yes I agree with you and I was just being generic. History would show some in such a bad light it shouldn't be 'public display' in that sense, those ones would go with JF's comment about a museum where the good, the bad and the ugly was explained.
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That makes much more sense, I would be in agreement with that move tbf.

Green Tea said:
We shouldn't be splitting the human race up into different races/colours and thinking each colour denotes a different type of human being.

BLM are categorising humans into different sub sections depending on colour of skin. Whites did this, Blacks did this etc = which is wrong.
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I do find it funny White Conservative Americans are always trying to take this route but rightly don't agree that men and women are equal biologically.

Its a great sentiment GT but it won't help or change things. The problem with this approach is people of African descent have had their entire history and lineage erased. They don't know where they come from, they don't have 'roots' and the only culture they have is the one they created. A lot of people in the black community have identity issues because of this and they end up only really having the colour of their skin.

Something I notice is black people treat each other the same way Irish people treat other Irish when they are in a foreign place. There is something shared, something else that is known, they have shared experiences.

So when you say something like that you're once again taking away their identity.
 
Be lovely to see sky, the premier league and the tv channels to do something to promote the latest people that have died wouldnt it.
How many more times are we going to let policemen and women get killed and abused bluelivesmatter. Are we going to all take the knee? Or minutes silence. I bloody hope so.

Surprise surprise not much was done for the poor lad murdered in birmingham. Everton did a small ceremony but nothing wider.
Innocent upstanding peoples lives matter.
Im sick of it. Absolutely sick of it.
 
colavfc said:
Be lovely to see sky, the premier league and the tv channels to do something to promote the latest people that have died wouldnt it.
How many more times are we going to let policemen and women get killed and abused bluelivesmatter. Are we going to all take the knee? Or minutes silence. I bloody hope so.

Surprise surprise not much was done for the poor lad murdered in birmingham. Everton did a small ceremony but nothing wider.
Innocent upstanding peoples lives matter.
Im sick of it. Absolutely sick of it.
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The problem is we’ll be having a minutes silence or kneeling or clapping before every game, the poor lad innocently killed was a horrible loss of life but where do you draw the line without it becoming a gimmick?

Our justice system for me is weak, the murderer will probably get 14 years or whatever it is before parole.
 
Sport isn't political - that is the biggest no no on the kneeling. I consider the poppy differently for what it's worth.

I don't consider the knee differently because of the group it promotes.

A minutes applause for notable fans who have died yes, an annual RIP game as Villa do, yes...but no otherwise, for anything.

Palace had a Ratana outfit (I'm not sure what else to call it) in the stands for their last game - that comes off as wanky to me but maybe he was a fan?

So it does go on Col, without meaning to be harsh you've got to stop taking the BBC/Sky/Daily Mail et al frontpages as truth. If Ratana wasn't a Palace fan, I totally disagree with their actions - but he's been honoured within football and if he was a fan, it was totally acceptable.

It happens all the time but how often do you check newsfeeds of other clubs for the small mentions that go on, that don't make national news?

You've got to stop this false equivalence on things mate as it's wider.

How many players have coppers in their family for example? How many players are black and have experienced racism? The two are not comparable in terms of something they'd get behind (even without understand the bullshit that is the BLM wannabee political party).

And yes Dan, the problem is we are in gimmick land now and it's done to be done rather than because it should be done.

Funny how quiet the Brum stabbings became when it clearly wasn't an immigrant/illegal/religious/terrorist thing - if anything that speaks volumes about what's wrong with the press.
 
So they had a no knock - were plain clothed - but waited to announce themselves whilst politely knocking?

Hmmm...

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Given technically and unfortunately no criminal act was committed under the no knock procedure the Police and AG are going the very long route around admitting no knock warrants are total nonsense and when you use them this is inevitable.
 
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