Spursex
Alert Team
This is well worth a read.
https://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFile...lublicensing/02/58/98/12/2589812_DOWNLOAD.pdf
https://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFile...lublicensing/02/58/98/12/2589812_DOWNLOAD.pdf
Uefa state of leagues.Clubs finances...
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Spursex
Alert Team
Europe’s top-tier football clubs reap benefit of FFP with first overall profit
• 700 top division clubs across 55 leagues record profit of £545m
• Uefa report confirms commercial dominance of Premier League
David Conn
Thu 17 Jan 2019 22.30 GMT Last modified on Thu 17 Jan 2019 22.31
Uefa’s adoption of financial fair play has stemmed clubs’ excessive spending. Photograph: Denis Balibouse/Reuters
Clubs across the top divisions of European leagues have recorded an overall profit for the first time, reversing years of losses before the implementation of financial fair play (FFP) rules, a Uefa analysis of the 2017 financial year has revealed.
The unprecedented “bottom line” profit, a total of €615m (£545m) made by the 700 top-flight clubs in Europe’s 55 national leagues, represents a fundamental turnaround since 2008-11, when clubs’ total losses amounted to more than €5bn (£4.4bn), Uefa said.
European football’s governing body introduced its FFP rules in response to those losses, as clubs competed with each other by overspending on escalating players’ wages, without any limits. Sefton Perry, head of Uefa’s intelligence centre analytics, said the excessive spending began to be staunched after the introduction of FFP, which limits losses clubs can make even if covered by a wealthy owner.
In 2016-17 clubs’ revenues grew faster than the wages they paid for the fourth year out of five, a reversal of football’s tendency before FFP’s introduction, when wages increased more than revenues ever year.
“The health of European club football has improved dramatically since 2012,” Perry said, “with losses declining every year and overall profitability being reported for the first time.”
Uefa’s latest “benchmarking” financial report also documented the commercial dominance of the Premier League compared with the other major leagues in Europe. The 20 clubs in England’s top division made total revenues of €5.3bn in the 2016-17 financial year, the most recent for which full information is available, almost double that of the league with the next highest total revenues, La Liga, whose clubs made €2.9bn.
Bundesliga clubs made €2.8bn during the same financial period, those in Serie A €2.1bn, and Ligue 1 €1.6bn, less than a third of Premier League clubs’ revenues. Of all Europe’s top clubs, only Barcelona, Juventus and Real Madrid received more TV revenue than even the 20th Premier League club in 2017, relegated Sunderland, who received £93m.
The Uefa president, Aleksander Ceferin, while celebrating European football’s “underlying health”, its first overall profit and a general 9% increase in revenues cautioned about the game’s widening financial gap. TV income is generally increasing and attendances growing across Europe – 2017-18 was a record year for crowds, with a total of 105 million people going to matches – but the report found that the “absolute revenue gaps” between leagues are increasing.
Remarkably, the top 12 clubs with global sponsorship deals – the report does not name clubs individually – accounted for 39% of sponsorship and commercial revenues across Europe, almost double the 22% of 10 years ago.
Ceferin said: “Recent issues of this report have brought the challenges of polarisation and competitive balance into focus, illustrating how financial gaps are augmented by globalisation and technological change, and it is therefore more essential than ever that all stakeholders work together to keep football strong up and down the pyramid.
“Football will never be equal, it doesn’t live in a bubble, but I truly believe it is Uefa’s role as guardians of the European game to ensure that football in every one of the 55 member associations can exploit its full potential, and we will work to support this.”
Ceferin has proposed some limited ideas for improving “competitive balance”, which Uefa officials are exploring, but the top clubs’ efforts are aimed in the opposite direction, at increasing financial dominance, backed by threats of breaking away.
Perry noted that the game’s financial position is predicted to change considerably with the “increasingly rapid fragmentation of the media landscape” which includes streaming by internet platforms and perhaps by clubs themselves. “That will not be easy or painless,” he predicted.
The report also documented the modern prevalence of gambling companies sponsoring football clubs, finding they did so in 26 European leagues, and were the most common shirt sponsor in 10. The Premier League, in which nine clubs were sponsored by betting companies, had the second-highest level of such concentration, after Bulgaria’s top division.
• 700 top division clubs across 55 leagues record profit of £545m
• Uefa report confirms commercial dominance of Premier League
David Conn
Thu 17 Jan 2019 22.30 GMT Last modified on Thu 17 Jan 2019 22.31
Uefa’s adoption of financial fair play has stemmed clubs’ excessive spending. Photograph: Denis Balibouse/Reuters
Clubs across the top divisions of European leagues have recorded an overall profit for the first time, reversing years of losses before the implementation of financial fair play (FFP) rules, a Uefa analysis of the 2017 financial year has revealed.
The unprecedented “bottom line” profit, a total of €615m (£545m) made by the 700 top-flight clubs in Europe’s 55 national leagues, represents a fundamental turnaround since 2008-11, when clubs’ total losses amounted to more than €5bn (£4.4bn), Uefa said.
European football’s governing body introduced its FFP rules in response to those losses, as clubs competed with each other by overspending on escalating players’ wages, without any limits. Sefton Perry, head of Uefa’s intelligence centre analytics, said the excessive spending began to be staunched after the introduction of FFP, which limits losses clubs can make even if covered by a wealthy owner.
In 2016-17 clubs’ revenues grew faster than the wages they paid for the fourth year out of five, a reversal of football’s tendency before FFP’s introduction, when wages increased more than revenues ever year.
“The health of European club football has improved dramatically since 2012,” Perry said, “with losses declining every year and overall profitability being reported for the first time.”
Uefa’s latest “benchmarking” financial report also documented the commercial dominance of the Premier League compared with the other major leagues in Europe. The 20 clubs in England’s top division made total revenues of €5.3bn in the 2016-17 financial year, the most recent for which full information is available, almost double that of the league with the next highest total revenues, La Liga, whose clubs made €2.9bn.
Bundesliga clubs made €2.8bn during the same financial period, those in Serie A €2.1bn, and Ligue 1 €1.6bn, less than a third of Premier League clubs’ revenues. Of all Europe’s top clubs, only Barcelona, Juventus and Real Madrid received more TV revenue than even the 20th Premier League club in 2017, relegated Sunderland, who received £93m.
The Uefa president, Aleksander Ceferin, while celebrating European football’s “underlying health”, its first overall profit and a general 9% increase in revenues cautioned about the game’s widening financial gap. TV income is generally increasing and attendances growing across Europe – 2017-18 was a record year for crowds, with a total of 105 million people going to matches – but the report found that the “absolute revenue gaps” between leagues are increasing.
Remarkably, the top 12 clubs with global sponsorship deals – the report does not name clubs individually – accounted for 39% of sponsorship and commercial revenues across Europe, almost double the 22% of 10 years ago.
Ceferin said: “Recent issues of this report have brought the challenges of polarisation and competitive balance into focus, illustrating how financial gaps are augmented by globalisation and technological change, and it is therefore more essential than ever that all stakeholders work together to keep football strong up and down the pyramid.
“Football will never be equal, it doesn’t live in a bubble, but I truly believe it is Uefa’s role as guardians of the European game to ensure that football in every one of the 55 member associations can exploit its full potential, and we will work to support this.”
Ceferin has proposed some limited ideas for improving “competitive balance”, which Uefa officials are exploring, but the top clubs’ efforts are aimed in the opposite direction, at increasing financial dominance, backed by threats of breaking away.
Perry noted that the game’s financial position is predicted to change considerably with the “increasingly rapid fragmentation of the media landscape” which includes streaming by internet platforms and perhaps by clubs themselves. “That will not be easy or painless,” he predicted.
The report also documented the modern prevalence of gambling companies sponsoring football clubs, finding they did so in 26 European leagues, and were the most common shirt sponsor in 10. The Premier League, in which nine clubs were sponsored by betting companies, had the second-highest level of such concentration, after Bulgaria’s top division.
Spursex
Alert Team
UEFA report details European football’s journey to profitability
Friday 18 January 2019
UEFA has released its tenth club licensing benchmarking report on European club football – authoritative overview of 700 top-division clubs highlights profits and record revenues and shows ten-year trends
UEFA's club licensing benchmarking report provides important insights ©UEFA.com
UEFA has released the tenth edition of its annual club licensing benchmarking report on European club football, named ‘The European Club Footballing Landscape”. As well as focusing on the 2017 financial year, the tenth edition also analyses the major trends of the past ten years.
The resulting report provides the most comprehensive and transparent overview of the state of the European football finance ever published.
Both the 2017 data and the detailed ten-year trends paint a positive picture. For the first time, the 700 top-division clubs together generated a ‘bottom-line’ profit figure in the 2017 financial year. These bottom-line profits of €615million – profits after transfer, non-operating, financing, tax and divestment – reflect six consecutive years of improvement since the introduction of financial fair play.
Looking back over the last ten years, the report presents a clear narrative of two distinct parts, the post-recession and pre-regulation years 2008-2011, and the period since 2012 when UEFA financial regulations and, subsequently, a number of domestic financial regulations were introduced. Spiralling club costs, mainly wages, sent club losses crashing from €600 million in 2008 to €1,700 million in 2011.
However, losses have been cut every year since the introduction of financial fair play, and finally turned into net profits in 2017.
In the foreword to the report, UEFA President Aleksander Čeferin said: “This report showcases the many successes of European football. It shows that the positive revenue, investment and profitability trends identified in last year’s report are continuing. The underlying health of European club football is highlighted, with the 700 top-division clubs together generating the first bottom-line profit in history. Is it therefore any wonder that interest in European football is radiating outwards across the globe as demonstrated by the many millions of social media activations and by the numerous club acquisitions from foreign investors.”
The report highlights a cultural change in European football finance over the past decade, with football regulation, led by UEFA and supported by national associations; a stable media landscape; supporter loyalty; and a club-wide focus on managing costs allowing European football to end these ten years far stronger than when it started.
As such, the report details that 2017 saw the highest revenue increase in history, with more than €1.6 billion revenue added. In addition, a record number of 28 leagues reported profits in 2017 compared to just nine leagues in 2011, prior to the introduction of financial fair play.
The report also shows that over the past ten years, the top 12 ‘global’ clubs’ share of European club sponsor and commercial revenues has almost doubled from 22% to 39% as they added €1.6 billion in commercial and sponsorship revenues. In comparison, the other 700 European top-division clubs, from large, medium and small revenue leagues, were able to add less than €1 billion.
While the report notes the polarisation at the very top paused in 2017, with the 11th to 20th clubs enjoying more revenue growth than the top 10, it is an issue that UEFA continues to monitor closely.
Aleksander Čeferin said: “Recent issues of this report have brought the challenges of polarisation and competitive balance into focus, illustrating how financial gaps are augmented by globalisation and technological change and it is therefore more essential than ever that all stakeholders work together to keep football strong up and down the pyramid. Football will never be equal, it doesn’t live in a bubble, but I truly believe it is UEFA’s role as guardians of the European game to ensure that football in every one of the 55 member associations can exploit its’ full potential and we will work to support this.”
Other key findings in the report include:
• Top-division club revenues have increased by 77% from €11.4 billion in 2008 to €20.1 billion in 2017.
• For the fourth year out of the last five years, European club revenues grew at a faster rate than club wages, with revenue at 8.9% and wages growing at 6.7%.
• Because of this better wage control, clubs were able to report the highest operating profits in history of €1.4 billion in 2017. Europe’s clubs have now generated more than €4 billion in operating profits in the last five years, fuelling the recent increased transfer spending.
• Net debt continues to fall, from 65% of revenue before the introduction of financial fair play in 2011 to 40% in 2015, and down to 34% in 2017.
• The first year of the current Premier League TV rights cycle further separated English clubs from their rivals, with reported revenue increasing by 47% in domestic currency and 28% in euro currency terms. Indeed, only FC Barcelona, Juventus FC and Real Madrid CF received more TV money than the 20th Premier League club.
• Transfer spending has increased by 95% in just three years, with prices almost doubling in all three price ranges (top, middle and lower-value deals).
• Gambling and betting firms are now the most common source of shirt sponsorship in ten European leagues.
• More people are watching European football than ever before.
2017/18 recorded the highest total European attendance level on record, with attendances of 105 million marginally outperforming the level reached in 2011/12. A record 15 clubs had aggregate league match attendances of over 1 million.
• UEFA prize money has become more important as a source of revenue, especially in less wealthy leagues: UEFA revenue to clubs has risen by 228% in the last ten years, compared with an overall growth in revenue of 77% and a growth in broadcast revenue of 113%.
• Over the past decade, 46 foreign investors of 22 different nationalities have become ultimate controlling parties of European top-division clubs.
Download the full report here
Friday 18 January 2019
UEFA has released its tenth club licensing benchmarking report on European club football – authoritative overview of 700 top-division clubs highlights profits and record revenues and shows ten-year trends
UEFA's club licensing benchmarking report provides important insights ©UEFA.com
UEFA has released the tenth edition of its annual club licensing benchmarking report on European club football, named ‘The European Club Footballing Landscape”. As well as focusing on the 2017 financial year, the tenth edition also analyses the major trends of the past ten years.
The resulting report provides the most comprehensive and transparent overview of the state of the European football finance ever published.
Both the 2017 data and the detailed ten-year trends paint a positive picture. For the first time, the 700 top-division clubs together generated a ‘bottom-line’ profit figure in the 2017 financial year. These bottom-line profits of €615million – profits after transfer, non-operating, financing, tax and divestment – reflect six consecutive years of improvement since the introduction of financial fair play.
Looking back over the last ten years, the report presents a clear narrative of two distinct parts, the post-recession and pre-regulation years 2008-2011, and the period since 2012 when UEFA financial regulations and, subsequently, a number of domestic financial regulations were introduced. Spiralling club costs, mainly wages, sent club losses crashing from €600 million in 2008 to €1,700 million in 2011.
However, losses have been cut every year since the introduction of financial fair play, and finally turned into net profits in 2017.
In the foreword to the report, UEFA President Aleksander Čeferin said: “This report showcases the many successes of European football. It shows that the positive revenue, investment and profitability trends identified in last year’s report are continuing. The underlying health of European club football is highlighted, with the 700 top-division clubs together generating the first bottom-line profit in history. Is it therefore any wonder that interest in European football is radiating outwards across the globe as demonstrated by the many millions of social media activations and by the numerous club acquisitions from foreign investors.”
The report highlights a cultural change in European football finance over the past decade, with football regulation, led by UEFA and supported by national associations; a stable media landscape; supporter loyalty; and a club-wide focus on managing costs allowing European football to end these ten years far stronger than when it started.
As such, the report details that 2017 saw the highest revenue increase in history, with more than €1.6 billion revenue added. In addition, a record number of 28 leagues reported profits in 2017 compared to just nine leagues in 2011, prior to the introduction of financial fair play.
The report also shows that over the past ten years, the top 12 ‘global’ clubs’ share of European club sponsor and commercial revenues has almost doubled from 22% to 39% as they added €1.6 billion in commercial and sponsorship revenues. In comparison, the other 700 European top-division clubs, from large, medium and small revenue leagues, were able to add less than €1 billion.
While the report notes the polarisation at the very top paused in 2017, with the 11th to 20th clubs enjoying more revenue growth than the top 10, it is an issue that UEFA continues to monitor closely.
Aleksander Čeferin said: “Recent issues of this report have brought the challenges of polarisation and competitive balance into focus, illustrating how financial gaps are augmented by globalisation and technological change and it is therefore more essential than ever that all stakeholders work together to keep football strong up and down the pyramid. Football will never be equal, it doesn’t live in a bubble, but I truly believe it is UEFA’s role as guardians of the European game to ensure that football in every one of the 55 member associations can exploit its’ full potential and we will work to support this.”
Other key findings in the report include:
• Top-division club revenues have increased by 77% from €11.4 billion in 2008 to €20.1 billion in 2017.
• For the fourth year out of the last five years, European club revenues grew at a faster rate than club wages, with revenue at 8.9% and wages growing at 6.7%.
• Because of this better wage control, clubs were able to report the highest operating profits in history of €1.4 billion in 2017. Europe’s clubs have now generated more than €4 billion in operating profits in the last five years, fuelling the recent increased transfer spending.
• Net debt continues to fall, from 65% of revenue before the introduction of financial fair play in 2011 to 40% in 2015, and down to 34% in 2017.
• The first year of the current Premier League TV rights cycle further separated English clubs from their rivals, with reported revenue increasing by 47% in domestic currency and 28% in euro currency terms. Indeed, only FC Barcelona, Juventus FC and Real Madrid CF received more TV money than the 20th Premier League club.
• Transfer spending has increased by 95% in just three years, with prices almost doubling in all three price ranges (top, middle and lower-value deals).
• Gambling and betting firms are now the most common source of shirt sponsorship in ten European leagues.
• More people are watching European football than ever before.
2017/18 recorded the highest total European attendance level on record, with attendances of 105 million marginally outperforming the level reached in 2011/12. A record 15 clubs had aggregate league match attendances of over 1 million.
• UEFA prize money has become more important as a source of revenue, especially in less wealthy leagues: UEFA revenue to clubs has risen by 228% in the last ten years, compared with an overall growth in revenue of 77% and a growth in broadcast revenue of 113%.
• Over the past decade, 46 foreign investors of 22 different nationalities have become ultimate controlling parties of European top-division clubs.
Download the full report here
muttley
Alert Team
The Premiership and the English FA should be addressing why they have no real seat at the table with FIFA and UEFA whilst being the biggest net contributor. FIFA and UEFA suck so much money into their own coffers from the English football brand and never award us a World Cup or Euro's whereas a country like the US can get 2 WC's in my lifetime.
It's about time we upped the anti on them and started to subtly switch off some of their revenue streams derived from our game in my opinion.
It's about time we upped the anti on them and started to subtly switch off some of their revenue streams derived from our game in my opinion.
Spursex
Alert Team
20. AC Milan – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €128million (£113.09m)
19. Southampton – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €131million (£115.74m)
18. Leicester City – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €132million (£116.63m)
8
Winning the Premier League title earned stars like Jamie Vardy a big pay rise
17. Crystal Palace – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €133million (£117.51m)
16. Wolfsburg – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €139million (£122.81m)
15. Roma – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €145million (£128.11m)
14. Tottenham Hotspur – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €148million (£130.76m)
8
Tottenham star Harry Kane has seen his wage rise gradually as he continues to excel
13. Inter Milan – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €155million (£136.95m)
11= Atletico Madrid – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €178million (£157.27m)
11= Borussia Dortmund – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €178million (£157.27m)
10. Arsenal – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €234million (£206.75m)
8
Alexandre Lacazette is on £200,000 a week at Arsenal
9. Liverpool – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €244million (£215.58m)
8. Chelsea – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €256million (£226.19m)
7. Juventus – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €264million (£233.25m)
8
Paulo Dybala is on decent money at Juventus
6. Paris Saint-Germain – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €272million (£240.32m)
5. Bayern Munich – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €276million (£243.86m)
4. Manchester United – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €306million (£270.36m)
3. Manchester City – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €334million (£295.10m)
8
Sergio Aguero and Kevin De Bruyne are paid well by Man City
2. Barcelona – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €378million (£333.98m)
8
It costs a pretty penny to keep someone like Lionel Messi at Barcelona
1. Real Madrid – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €406million (£358.72m)
19. Southampton – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €131million (£115.74m)
18. Leicester City – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €132million (£116.63m)
8
Winning the Premier League title earned stars like Jamie Vardy a big pay rise
17. Crystal Palace – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €133million (£117.51m)
16. Wolfsburg – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €139million (£122.81m)
15. Roma – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €145million (£128.11m)
14. Tottenham Hotspur – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €148million (£130.76m)
8
Tottenham star Harry Kane has seen his wage rise gradually as he continues to excel
13. Inter Milan – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €155million (£136.95m)
11= Atletico Madrid – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €178million (£157.27m)
11= Borussia Dortmund – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €178million (£157.27m)
10. Arsenal – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €234million (£206.75m)
8
Alexandre Lacazette is on £200,000 a week at Arsenal
9. Liverpool – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €244million (£215.58m)
8. Chelsea – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €256million (£226.19m)
7. Juventus – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €264million (£233.25m)
8
Paulo Dybala is on decent money at Juventus
6. Paris Saint-Germain – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €272million (£240.32m)
5. Bayern Munich – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €276million (£243.86m)
4. Manchester United – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €306million (£270.36m)
3. Manchester City – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €334million (£295.10m)
8
Sergio Aguero and Kevin De Bruyne are paid well by Man City
2. Barcelona – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €378million (£333.98m)
8
It costs a pretty penny to keep someone like Lionel Messi at Barcelona
1. Real Madrid – Wage bill for the 2017 financial year = €406million (£358.72m)
Spursex
Alert Team
When you look at the wage bill of our rivals v our turnover - it's utterly astonishing how we compete at all.
Of course, it's now catching up with le arse and another season without CL football will really hurt their finances.
Interesting to see in UEFA's report that the biggest rises in revenues come when clubs have a new stadium and premium packages and or new bigger ticket numbers ...
It points the way to why I believe that our yearly revenue increase(s) after 2-3 years may well be as much as 150-200 million....p.a.
Of course, it's now catching up with le arse and another season without CL football will really hurt their finances.
Interesting to see in UEFA's report that the biggest rises in revenues come when clubs have a new stadium and premium packages and or new bigger ticket numbers ...
It points the way to why I believe that our yearly revenue increase(s) after 2-3 years may well be as much as 150-200 million....p.a.
Spursex
Alert Team
I've often pondered this over the years; the one thing we know for absolute certainty is that the 'target' in the project for Poch when he was appointed was to achieve CL football in the first season that the new stadium was opened..
He's beaten that handsomely and some would says fairly easily; so the key question for me; is that a reflection of the lack of ambition of our owners in setting the 'success' bar too low or is it a reflection of the vast financial chasm that has existed between ourselves and the other 5/6 clubs at the top of the PL.?
By any financial measure, finishing up above Arsenal, Chelsea or Manchester united. let alone Liverpool or ManC, should have been 'mission impossible'.
So 'Goal no.1.' as far as the owners have declared gets a massive tick for Poch.
As far as the fans go, there is an almost 50/50 split from what I hear/dicuss/see and read amongst our mathc attending/paying fans - on the one hand playing the best clubs in Europe in the CL is a dream come true (I fall in this camp) on then other, half still don't see the Top 4 as the incredible achievement it is and still would prefer missing out on the CL for domestic silverware/ or perhaps now the Europa, that if we won it, could serve both (well for one season).
We've all known the hackneyed old arguments on both sides of the debate; I tend to prefer looking to the future and believe being a regular part of the CL picture allows you to attract better/top players - and that the new stadium will over the next 3-5 years deliver the bottom line profits to make sure we stay there, improve the depth and quality of our squad which will in turn bring us closer to winning domestic silverware.
But even then, it's going to be tough, the capital employed in their non-tangible assets on the pitch will dwarf anything we can expect for night on a decade.
Of course, I've been expecting for a long time for Uncle Joe to sell his stake in ENIC/Spurs; he cannot carry on forever and keep dodging the grim reaper - at his age, it's creeping ever closer and the interest of his son/daughter in remaining a major shareholder remains unclear.
Once the stadium is completed, the dust settled, my money is till on a very large value placement of shares with institutions and perhaps even a small US based flotation ( a la Manure).
That would free up capital and allow ENIC to remain in overall control - something I am told the Levy 'clan' is keen to achieve.
So, as of now, I still believe our best years after all the infrastructure at the club has been delivered is yet to come.
And I think that might well be in spite some of our ownership's shortcomings, not necessary because of it, that said, my criticisms of them remain what I called Levy a decade a go, 'penny wise, pound foolish' and in turn translates into business owners running the club like a business, not a rich businessman's ego plaything.
freundorfoe
Vital 1st Team Regular
Interested in your thoughts on this thread Ex
Spursex
Alert Team
It's a factual representation of where we are - there is nothing there for me to argue against as I've been over the figures many times.
I know how the club has been financed and how it's money has be reinvested in the club - the one thing that I have always said about old Joe is that apart from buying the club via enic he / they have invested nothing like other sugardaddies did/have.
ENIC took the view that the sugardaddy approach was not sustainable (I had that conversation with key directors after the agm/egm many times).
Essentially, history has proved them right - only one sugar daddy club can claim that this approach has been successful (against around 14 clubs where it failed and almost wiped the clubs out) - and let's not forget that the rubbish Russian mobster is now banned from the UK and cannot see the club he still owns, and has refused to now bankroll a new stadium and is said to be actively looking to sell (how true that is, I do not know) - but if he does sell, the loss he will take and the impact on the Chelsea Chav's - may well be catastrophic.
So, as I said, History has proved ENIC to be right - but that 'success' has also proved to be an anchopr dragging on the progress of the club when a measured gamble may, and I repeat 'may' have meant we ended up with a piece of silverware.
I retain the view that over the next 5-10 years we will reap the rewards for their frustratingly (at times) conservative approach - but until that happens, I expect them to keep getting the critism so many think they deserve for not sticking 2,3,4,500 million into the club..
Edit: of course the second 'successful' sugar daddy club is of course ManC - which we now know was built on a platform of deceipt and financial rule busting engineering - which I still hope will see them get the punishment that they fully deserve.
I still (perhaps naively) hope that cheats will never prosper.
Last edited:
Spursex
Alert Team
Mauricio Pochettino uses West Ham as example to explain lack of progress at Tottenham
Tottenham Hotspur and West Ham United saw any chance of domestic cup success come to a shuddering halt at the weekend.
Out of the Carabao Cup, West Ham were humbled 4-2 away at League One basement boys AFC Wimbledon in the FA Cup fourth round.
Then Spurs were comfortably beaten 2-0 by Crystal Palace.
Tottenham still have the Champions League last 16 to focus on and securing qualification for the competition next year.
West Ham’s only remaining goal is to aim for a seventh place finish to secure Europa League football.
West Ham have not won a major trophy for nearly 40 years.
Pochettino compares Spurs struggles to West Ham
But for Tottenham the urgency for silverware is more acute. Many fans and pundits feel winning a first trophy in his tenure is vital to the long-term success of Tottenham.
With Manchester United and Real Madrid interested in acquiring Pochettino’s services, winning a trophy is about more than just furnishing the Tottenham trophy cabinet. It could be instrumental in keeping the Argentine at Tottenham.
Pre-empting the defeat at Palace, Pochettino has moved to explain Tottenham’s lack of progress in terms of silverware.
Speaking to Sky Sports the Spurs boss likened their situation to West Ham’s putting the blame on their stadium move.
Stadium move hurt West Ham’s progress like Spurs
“We are always close to the last step (to trophies) but to achieve it is the most difficult thing,” Pochettino told Sky Sports.
“At the moment, the team needed the last push, what happened? We build and build but then, White Hart Lane – gone.
“We moved to Wembley and there were all the doubts about how we are going to behave. There was the example of West Ham in their first season (at the London Stadium) and many things in this process that stopped the evolution of their team about to win.
“Remember, we were unbeaten in the Premier League at White Hart Lane in our last season there.
“Nobody said what it meant to move to Wembley to create another project and not only this – we were going to play only one season at Wembley, and now it’s nearly two seasons and no one says nothing.
“When Arsenal moved (to the Emirates), people talked about massive problems, they are still paying.”
Tottenham are clearly competing on a different level to West Ham under Pochettino.
Three years in but stadium move starting to pay off for West Ham
But West Ham fans will relate to his comments.
West Ham’s final season at their beloved Upton Park saw the club record their best ever Premier League points tally.
The Hammers finished just four points off the Champions League.
But the move to the London Stadium has been disruptive to the progress West Ham were making on the pitch.
Two seasons flirting with relegation look to be behind the Hammers now.
But Manuel Pellegrini’s side have little to play for other than the possibility of securing a Europa League spot.
Three years into the stadium move things are starting to settle down for the Hammers at the London Stadium.
West Ham have the second highest number of season ticket holders in the Premier League, the fourth highest attendances in Europe and will have the second highest capacity in the Premier League of 66,000 even after the stadium rebuild at Tottenham.
The increased revenue has started to bear fruit in the transfer market where West Ham splurged £100 million in the summer while Tottenham failed to make a single signing.
- 28th January 2019
Tottenham Hotspur and West Ham United saw any chance of domestic cup success come to a shuddering halt at the weekend.
Out of the Carabao Cup, West Ham were humbled 4-2 away at League One basement boys AFC Wimbledon in the FA Cup fourth round.
Then Spurs were comfortably beaten 2-0 by Crystal Palace.
Tottenham still have the Champions League last 16 to focus on and securing qualification for the competition next year.
West Ham’s only remaining goal is to aim for a seventh place finish to secure Europa League football.
West Ham have not won a major trophy for nearly 40 years.
Pochettino compares Spurs struggles to West Ham
But for Tottenham the urgency for silverware is more acute. Many fans and pundits feel winning a first trophy in his tenure is vital to the long-term success of Tottenham.
With Manchester United and Real Madrid interested in acquiring Pochettino’s services, winning a trophy is about more than just furnishing the Tottenham trophy cabinet. It could be instrumental in keeping the Argentine at Tottenham.
Pre-empting the defeat at Palace, Pochettino has moved to explain Tottenham’s lack of progress in terms of silverware.
Speaking to Sky Sports the Spurs boss likened their situation to West Ham’s putting the blame on their stadium move.
Stadium move hurt West Ham’s progress like Spurs
“We are always close to the last step (to trophies) but to achieve it is the most difficult thing,” Pochettino told Sky Sports.
“At the moment, the team needed the last push, what happened? We build and build but then, White Hart Lane – gone.
“We moved to Wembley and there were all the doubts about how we are going to behave. There was the example of West Ham in their first season (at the London Stadium) and many things in this process that stopped the evolution of their team about to win.
“Remember, we were unbeaten in the Premier League at White Hart Lane in our last season there.
“Nobody said what it meant to move to Wembley to create another project and not only this – we were going to play only one season at Wembley, and now it’s nearly two seasons and no one says nothing.
“When Arsenal moved (to the Emirates), people talked about massive problems, they are still paying.”
Tottenham are clearly competing on a different level to West Ham under Pochettino.
Three years in but stadium move starting to pay off for West Ham
But West Ham fans will relate to his comments.
West Ham’s final season at their beloved Upton Park saw the club record their best ever Premier League points tally.
The Hammers finished just four points off the Champions League.
But the move to the London Stadium has been disruptive to the progress West Ham were making on the pitch.
Two seasons flirting with relegation look to be behind the Hammers now.
But Manuel Pellegrini’s side have little to play for other than the possibility of securing a Europa League spot.
Three years into the stadium move things are starting to settle down for the Hammers at the London Stadium.
West Ham have the second highest number of season ticket holders in the Premier League, the fourth highest attendances in Europe and will have the second highest capacity in the Premier League of 66,000 even after the stadium rebuild at Tottenham.
The increased revenue has started to bear fruit in the transfer market where West Ham splurged £100 million in the summer while Tottenham failed to make a single signing.
freundorfoe
Vital 1st Team Regular
Was particularly referring to the point about Levy's salary being only 2M shy of our average net spend p.a. and that I believe you've doubted that ENIC will sell in the past. That thread was seemingly implying (as others have) that the work they've done has just been to increase value for a sale.
"So when you hear that the club has no money to invest into the playing staff just remember, that is because the club are paying for everything themselves whilst ENIC stand to profit by increasing their investment by over 700%."
"So when you hear that the club has no money to invest into the playing staff just remember, that is because the club are paying for everything themselves whilst ENIC stand to profit by increasing their investment by over 700%."
Spursex
Alert Team
I can't fault Levy for the money he takes - that's between him (the owners) and the board, fans may not like it, but as it's their business and they've taken all the big risks - only they know if they're taking the piss or not...
Would I pay him that? Nope, not a chance, but in terms of the lack of money that they've taken out in dividends for the money they've invested, I couldn't argue too greatly against it either.
As for increasing the value of their investment, they could just as easily have got nil return by screwing it up and taking gambles that other owners have done and virtually losing most of their cash....
So from a business perspective, they've run the business well but as for being a 700% increase in the value of their investment...that has yet to be proved and won't be until they sell.
An imperative for any owner of a business is to increase value - and Levy and the rest of the board have in my book done that by investing profits in infrastructure that should be their enduring legacy and one that fans can enjoy for a long time to come.
If that means Joe banks another 500 mill or so and levy 2-300 mill - I won't complain at all!
